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Expats leaving due to recession?
Posted by jmannie (361 days ago)
anyone leaving because of recession/ job loss? or sticking it out till it gets better?
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Posted by scottc (361 days ago)
In the japan downturn in 2003, it took 2 years for finance job openings to reappear. I think this time around might take 3-4 years so people shouldn't be too optimistic. A lot of expats wiped out their savings in japan paying expensive rents & tuitions waiting for those jobs that pay 10x local salaries to come back. unless one can find a job quick or surive with reduced income 2-3 years probably best not to be too optimistic and maybe move someplace cheaper. The banks currently laying off hundreds of employees each.
Posted by beerboy (359 days ago)
The footwear company my wife works for is in the process of returning all expats to their home countries due to the business environment.
Posted by HKhereIcome (359 days ago)
not really - I'm in UK on home leave, but will return to HK, and the expats I know are not leaving. It depends on which line one is in - junior finance jobs will be the worst hit.
Posted by equinox (359 days ago)
I know of many expats leaving HK - and not just in banking or finance jobs.....it seems all industries are badly affected ......even those who own their own businesses are feeling the effects and are going to cheaper places
Posted by empty allo (359 days ago)
Living in China is really cheap. In the Pearl River Delta -between Guangzhou and Hong Kong- you can get a huge apartment for 2-3000 $. Food is cheap, life is less hectic, and you can do anything there that you can do here. Having said that, I used to live there, and I am glad to be back in Hong Kong. Because it is a bit boring also.
Posted by beerboy (359 days ago)
Living in china, mainland maybe really cheap but the wages are far less than in Hong Kong.
Posted by babswymak (358 days ago)
Yeah things may be cheap there but also a hazard...eg. food products etc.
Often profits comes before health and safety !
Posted by empty allo (358 days ago)
If you are not tied by a job in Hong Kong, China is a real option right now.
You will be surprised about by how 'Hong Kong' it all is, over there.
And it is a great experience that you can tell your grandkids about.
Posted by Ed (357 days ago)
Unable to read that without a membership...

Posted by dadda (357 days ago)
here it is for Ed the Scrooge...
Exodus of expats foreseen as crisis takes toll on jobs
Lay-offs in financial sector could drive westerners away
Joyce Man
Updated on Dec 01, 2008
The tinsel and carols have gone up to signal that Christmas is on the way, but for John, a banker, the past few weeks have been "a logistical nightmare".
The reason? He lost his job last month and has to head home this week.
John has spent the past month in discussions about breaking his lease, taking his children out of school, packing up his home and also saying farewell to friends.
"It has been terrible. It was a surprise. It took everyone by surprise," said the Australian, who has lived in Hong Kong for nine years with his wife and two children, aged 9 and 11.
"In the current climate, we decided it was the best option," he said.
He plans to wait in Australia for the economic turmoil to calm down and apply for jobs in Hong Kong as soon as possible.
The Immigration Department, the Trade Development Council and consulates do not keep figures on the number of foreign workers leaving the city permanently, but many expatriates say they are going home.
Some predict an exodus and a repeat of the situation during the 1998 financial crisis and the outbreak of severe acute respiratory syndrome in 2003. Restaurants, bars, recruiters and property companies are watching for a major shift in business, while schools are monitoring changes in enrolment and waiting-list numbers.
Ben Tyrrell, director of removals firm Relocasia, said: "This is not dissimilar to what happened during Sars, when we had people wanting to move the next day. People don't do that unless they sense dark clouds on the horizon."
Mr Tyrrell has seen many foreigners - including chief financial officers, middle-class corporate staff and recent graduates - deciding to move and leaving the city within days.
The company, most of whose clients work in banks and live in upmarket areas, saw outbound orders rise by 65 per cent last month and expects a 100 per cent increase for this month, compared to the same month last year. Most of the orders for last month were made by Britons, Australians and Americans.
"They're either deciding to take redundancy packages or are being forced to leave," he said. "It's been phenomenally busy."
Recruitment agencies predict expatriates will leave when they fail to find jobs.
The agencies would be able to source positions for lower-level staff - compliance officers, auditors, product controllers and technical staff - but it would be difficult for senior candidates, said Mark Enticott, associate director of banking and financial services at executive search firm Michael Page.
He predicted that many people would move in the next six to 12 months. "Naturally that happens. We saw it during the last two financial crises," he said.
Restaurants are bracing for a drop in business. "There's probably going to be a bit of an exodus," said Chris Lenz, founder of Igor's Group of Restaurants, which includes Stormy Weather, The Keg and Wildfire.
He said one of his regulars lost a job last Monday, and another last Tuesday. He expects a 20 to 25 per cent drop in income next month and in February compared to the same months in recent years, partly because expatriates would leave.
Buggle Lau, chief analyst at Midland Realty, said luxury property rents would drop when expatriates left. "Even those who are lucky enough to keep their jobs upon the expiry of their contracts will relocate or they will negotiate with their landlords," he said. Rents on the south side of Hong Kong Island, in Mid-Levels and in West Kowloon had dropped by 15 to 20 per cent up to October, he said. He expects another 10 to 15 per cent fall in the first quarter of next year.
The only places reporting stability are schools, possibly because parents do not want to uproot children mid-term. Hong Kong International School and the English Schools Foundation say enrolment and waiting list numbers have not changed from last year. The ESF even received 10 per cent more applications than last year for first-year spaces, said Peter Craughwell, head of corporate communications. But he said they were monitoring the situation.
Businesses say worse is yet to come. HSBC, Citibank, DBS, Morgan Stanley, Goldman Sachs and Merrill Lynch only announced job cuts last month. They say the period from now until the end of the year will be the lull before the storm as the unemployed seek new jobs.
However, some expect fewer people to leave than in 1998 and 2003.
"There is a fundamental difference between expats now and then," Mr Lenz said, noting they had started owning property, which was very rare in the 1990s.
"A lot of expats see Hong Kong as their home. Even if we see them losing their jobs, they will try to look for work here," he said.
Mr Enticott, from Michael Page, even expects new arrivals. "Asia is still seen by banks as an area where they can grow their revenue base," he said.
Joe, a broker from Britain, lost his job along with several others at his company last month, and his visa expires in June. He says the mood among his friends has been very grim, but he wants to tough it out in Hong Kong, where he has lived for several years.
"I don't want to go back to the UK unless I have to. I will stay as long as I have a visa," he said.
He plans to send out CVs in January and hopes to land a job with a visa. "You have to look at the economies in the rest of the world. Our prospects are better here," he said. "There are still firms coming to Asia."

Posted by Ed (357 days ago)
Heh heh thanks... I refuse to pay when there are far better free online news sources... save the money for Molson...
Posted by Robin2008 (357 days ago)
Ed could I ask you what other online news resources you mean? (Sorry perhaps I should start a new thread...) Do you know of any HK online news sites that are worth checking out? (I am not looking for international resources like CNN, BBC but more HK oriented ones.) Cheers :-).
Posted by beerboy (357 days ago)
Robin, please don't bother Ed when he is in a Molson frame of mind.........
Actually, I would have thougth he would get it gratis!
Posted by Ed (356 days ago)
I prefer the Herald Tribune but for HK news The Standard.com
Posted by dadda (356 days ago)
good site for China (and HK business) I use www.china.org.cn I mainly use Bloomberg which has everything, but many don't get that from work for free...
Posted by helloalex (321 days ago)
I am looking for an expatriate who fears to lose his job or who has already lost his job due to the financial and economic crisis. Kindly send me your phone number or email address. I am a journalist for a large newspaper.
Posted by punter (124 days ago)
The forums seems to be not as active as before. Is it because many expat have left Hong Kong already? Or is it just because it's just vacation time?
Posted by sleepnaked (124 days ago)
No point heading back to the U.K if you are worried. No jobs there, no sun, taxes are about to go up to pay for the borrowing. Take a year out somewhere strange (and cheap). Study Chinese in Kunming... great place.
Posted by axptguy38 (124 days ago)
punter, I think it's just vacation time. There's a mass expat exodus every summer. ;)
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