Posted by
snagito
15 yrs ago
We have a good relationship with our helper and she's just signed her second contract with the family.
During the first contract I was working too, and needed her to work the odd HK public holiday (as my head office was based in Australia and I wouldn't get the HK public holidays off etc). I asked her about it and she said that her previous employer had paid her $500 a day and that would be the rate, so I paid her that and she seemed happy enough. I didn't realise that it was illegal.
I'm not working now and we have two small kids and my husband says he would dearly love to have a relaxing Sunday just once in a while - rather than spend the whole day running after the children/cleaning/bathing/diapering etc! I know this might sound really spoilt, but we would really like our helper to work one Sunday a month (any Sunday that suits her, we're not fussed) and then give her another day off in lieu rather than paying her $500 as for one I can't afford it now that I'm not working myself - and of course it is illegal anyway.
Do you think this is totally unreasonable? Should we not ask as we have a good relationship and don't want to mess things up? All input most welcome. Thank you!
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Of course you should ask. However it is only fair that you give her the choice between the money and the extra day off..
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Thanks so much for responding. Given what we've done in the past I know she'll choose the money. Apparently some people pay $125-ish for the day (that being what you get when you actually divide monthly salary by the number of days or whatever) - others pay $250 being double that. No one I know seems to have paid the $500 so was wondering what to do! Do you think $500 is too much to pay?
I would just like if she could be more flexible...I kind of feel like we are fairly flexible employers so probably that's why I'm feeling like this! We pay her $4500 plus $500 food allowance (we buy her jasmine rice/oil/sugar whatever she wants); we pay for her Filipino Channel TV...plus she's already taken all her 17 days holiday just 2 months into her second contract -i think she's banking on us going on holiday later on in the year so that she'll get time off anyway which is fine. ..
I don't think having an alternate day off once in a while should be a HUGE deal as she isn't a church goer so uses Sunday to sleep in (till 2 pm --- aaah would be so nice to sleep in - we've not done that in nearly 4 years of course as we always get the kids up ourselves at 6 am or whatever wretched hour they chirp! sorry whine over..we love being there for the kids but you know how it is!) ..
I do know that none of this is our helpers' problem as she's just sticking to her job description but just asking for advice and input as I'm getting a little confused..hubby usually leaves it all to me but his recent request has me stumped!
All input welcome and sorry for the rambling..
hat should I do to make hubby's life a little easier on Sundays - shall I bother asking her (she is a nice person but even those public holidays that i paid her $500 had a bit of a long face!) ..or look around for a good part time?
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Well, to be honest, I can understand her not wanting to change her day off from Sunday to a day in the week ... it's probably the only chance she gets to catch up with her friends, if that's what she does on her day off ... most helpers live for that one day off a week when they can socialise with friends and having an alternative day off in the week isn't worth it to them, that's probably why she'd rather take the money. And I don't think $500 is too much to pay if you would like her to look after your children all day on a Sunday ... it's seems your husband realises it's not any easy task. There's no harm is asking, but you should tell her that you're not putting her under any pressure to do it unless she's happy to do so ... if you already have a good relationship with her, you don't want the long faces and ill feelings taking over ... it's not worth it. Only do it if she's happy to do it.
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Joeuk
15 yrs ago
If you want her to help out on an odd Sunday I don't see a problem. I have asked ours once or twice in 2 years and my helper has been happy to help. We did only ask for an afternoon or something though not a whole day. We would be up with the children then our helper would takeover say 12.00 then we would be back at 5.00 or 6.00 to bath and put to bed etc. For that amount of time we would give her $200 as its really good of her to help us out. She has time in the morning to do whatever she needs to do then earning extra always helps!
And yes we all know what its like with young children when you really need quality time with your husband. Sometimes Sundays can be hard with them but we all know we wouldn't change it for the world!!!
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"Do you think $500 is too much to pay? "
We would go by 70 an hour, so with a 8 hour working day (assuming she has a short day on the Sunday) you're talking 560. We definitely pay that much for a Sunday. You can think of it as overtime pay. Of course, if she only works like 3 hours 250 is reasonable.
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Thanks a lot guys. Really appreciated the input.
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I've stopped visiting this board for a long time, but I just saw this as one of the highlighted threads.
All I would say is that (1) yes, HK$500 for a Sunday of work is too much, and (2) you have ever right to ask your helper to take a day off during the week in lieu of a Sunday. Of course, it would have been better if you had talked about this before you renewed her contract. Sure, some helpers like to hang out on Sundays with friends, but some helpers couldn't care less, and if your helper doesn't go to church and sleeps in late, then she is probably in the latter camp. Your helper will probably ask for money instead of another day off. If you explain to her that you have financial difficulties, then I hope she can understand. As far as I can tell, you are compensating and treating her quite fairly already (HK$5000 all in plus cable and basic foodstuffs is an above average salary). Ignore the other posters who are only happy if you are paying your helper HK$10000 per month.
And, in the future, never advance 17 days vacation at the start of a two year contract. It's almost as bad as lending (or rather gifting) your helper money that she cannot repay.
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My helper sometimes works 1 Sunday a month, but gets a different day off in lieu. Often it may be a Saturday. There are Sundays that my husband works, and I require extra help.
You do not have to give them "Sunday" off. It is what works for the employeer to.
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cd
15 yrs ago
It does not say in the contract that you have to give sundays off, any day of the week can be the day off, as long as they get 24 hours in a 7 day period. So in theory, you do not have to ask, just say that in future the 4th sunday in the month (for example) will be a working day, and the saturday a day off.
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I think the only issue here is one of communication.
Just tell her that money is now an issue because you are not working but you'd like help for at least one sunday a month. Ask her if she would mind taking one weekday off in exchange for it. If she wants to see friends every sunday, maybe you could suggest alternate working hours, say you need her from 7am-11am in the morning (so you and your husband could sleep in and she could cook you brekkie + lunch), then for her to come home earlier, say from 4.30pm - 8pm (she could cook you dinner, bathe the kids and send them off to bed). She may willing oblige because she gets another time off during the week where places are less busy plus she still gets to see her friends every Sunday.
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I would ask her to do one Sunday in 4, and give her another day off. THEN, when you get the l-o-o-o-o-n-g face, and the 'But Ma'am, all the other helpers...', I would say 'Fine, I understand, and I will get XXX in to help on Sundays - I hear she is looking for a full-time job but hasn't found one yet, and the children already know and like her.' I'm fairly sure your helper will do a quick reconsider when she feels that there is a chance of you liking the part-timer more.
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kittycat2, that's not very nice. An employee does not deserve to be treated that way. As iwilltry says, you are the one changing the terms of the agreement.
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Again, Sunday is not "the day" off. As long as she has A day off within a 7 day period. Telll her you would like her to work 1 Sunday a month and give her Saturday off. That's what we do. No need for extra pay. Where we live I see sooo many helpers working the odd Sunday.
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While you can do it the way jassy67 says, it is not a very nice way of treating your employee UNLESS you have told her she might have to work Sundays at the same time you offered her the job.
Frankly you'll get better results if you respect your employee's time off. For most, Saturday is not a good day since their friends are off on Sundays.
As for extra pay for Sundays, it is up to you but if you are changing the working routines after her contract started I would consider it. A bit of money for extra effort (and working a Sunday is) goes a long way towards making her a happy employee.
Imagine how you would feel if your boss told you, after you had worked for 3-4 months, that you will have to come in one Saturday a month.
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cd
15 yrs ago
My helper is quite happy to work some sundays, my last helper was quite happy to work some sundays, and my helper before that. Most of my friends helpers work some sundays if needed. None of them seem to have a problem with it. It doesn't need to be that big an issue. Just talk to your helper, explain that your needs have changed and this is what you need from her from now on.
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But if she doesn't want to do it, which is perfectly reasonable as so many have pointed out, then you need to find another solution. Employing someone part-time one day a month would seem to be the only solution, unless you have family (or very helpful friends) nearby. I think it is a perfectly sensible option. I also think that you would get the reaction I have suggested above. It's a choice.
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Hello, not sure if the problem has already been solved, but for what it's worth: in the government's Practical Guide for Employment of FDWs... it says that you can, with the consent of your helper, substitute some other day for the appointed rest day (which may or may not be Sunday). The substituted rest day must be granted within the same month and before the original rest day or within 30 days after it. Also, it says that the helper may work voluntarily on his/her rest days, though you cannot compel them to work.
But I agree, if she doesn't want to, then just get someone else part-time, esp. as you don't seem to mind paying more than the prorata pay of one day, which only comes out to $125 or so per day.
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Rights are one thing. Respect for employees is another. If you agreed it before signing, there is no issue. If circumstances change after signing, I would advise "selling it". Sure, you can be within your rights, but being right is not the same as being respectful and just plain nice.
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