Collection Agency At My Door

Help! I just had a shock this morning, at a very hectic time of my life and need some advice.


My DH has been with me for almost 2 years. She and I have already discussed renewing her contract and I'm happy with her performance in terms of how well she treats my 20 month old daughter.


Unfortunately, I received a knock on my door this morning (I had a day off) and it was a loan shark asking for my helper. The story is that she was a guarantor for a friend's auntie and now the auntie hasn't paid back the HK$5000 loan, which has now escalated to HK$6,000+.


I was livid when I found out, as anyone would be. More so because the loan shark came to my door and this whole situation has jeopardized the security of my daughter. I live in a well-secured area and complained to the management, as they shouldn't have been allowed up. They say they're looking into the matter.


In terms of my DH, she is an emotional wreck and crying with disbelief that the auntie didn't pay back the money. I don't know how much to believe this, but in the past 20 months I've known her, I've come to realize that her character is so naive to the point I sometimes wonder what is between her ears (I'm sorry to be so blunt). I know some people may say I'm the one who is naive to believe that she's innocent in all this, but I really don't think she thought this whole thing through and understood the consequences of her actions.


Anyway, I'm in a situation now where I am considering whether to fire her or not. But I'm just wondering whether anyone has been in such a situation and helped their helper to pay off the loan initially, and deduct installments from their salary.


I will be giving her a written warning letter and have her sign acknowledgement that my address is not to be given to anyone in the future, otherwise she's out of the door immediately.


Any similar situations or advice I can learn from would be so much appreciated!


Frantic mother!

Sorry to hear that. But that is not unusual. I've heard of a DH that has guaranteed her aunt's loan, too. In the end, the employer terminated her because these loan sharks just won't take no for an answer. First, they'll call your no. numerous times a day (n midnight, too). Then they'll knock on your door, write with paint on your walls and they'll really do everything to intimidate you to pay for that loan, no matter what. Of course you could call the police. But, still you don't know what will happen next. I'm sorry if this scares you. If on the otherhand you choose your DH to settle the loan first, you should ask her first if she's willing to do that. Also, you have to put into consideration the fact that you won't be able to get that money or part of it back. According to the Guidebook for employment of DH, the deduction for the recovery of any advance or over-payment of wages made by the employer to the Helper but subject to a maximum of one quarter of the wage patable in one wage period. So, if she has worked for you for 20 months, you have only 4 months x 1/4 of her monthly salary to deduct. Even if you choose to renew her contract, you are still not sure that she'll continue to work for you and repay you. She might just run away. Plus, maybe you should ask her if she still has other loans guaranteed.


By the way, remember to keep all of your bills, letters with addresses away of her reach. Usually these loan agencies will only loan money to DH who has proof of address. So that means electricity bills, telephone, mobile phone bills, etc.


Good Luck!

Thanks for the advice, Mochie99. Police say that they can't do much other than take a record that I was visited by a loanshark, should anything happen to me and my family in the future. They said to me that by law, even if the loansharks pay another visit, the police can't do much, as it's private property (sigh!).


Anyway, thanks for the advice on the bills etc. She told me that the finance company got the address from her employment contract in the first place. Not sure how much to trust her in this matter, but guess I have to keep everything under lock and key from now on until I decide what to do with her.


Just a warning to anyone who reads this.... sometimes it's so good to be trusting and treat your DH like part of your family (as we did), but when you get this in return, it kind of makes you think whether it was the right thing to do or not. She's taken that trust and abused it completely, and that hurts!

Should the people come back, explain firmly to them that you didn't want this harassment at your private home, that it is nothing to do with you and if they return you shall have to fire your helper. The agencies generally know they need the helper working to paid the debt.


Also ask her how she intends to pay the debt - I think some of them really have no idea that it will become their responsibility should their aunt, cousin, best friend's whatever doesn't pay. Too trusting? Too naive? Perhaps.


Remember it is not your debt or your responsibility. Yes you could pay it but there is no assurance your helper will stick around for the repayments - sorry but that happens.


If you decide to let her go, contact the agency and tell them she doesn't work for you.

What surprises me sometimes is that a loan agency will accept a helper as guarantor for a loan to another helper. How does that make their loan necessarilt any more secure?

taytay, trust your instincts. if you belive in your helper that she became gurantor with the assumption that the loan would be paid, then what you should do is help her pay off the loan and then deduct it from her salary gradually. however u must find out whether she took out a loan too. they often gurantee each other so they are both given loans.


i had a similar incident with my helper. she opened up a mobile phone account for another helper in our estate. the other helper defaulted on the phone bills, about 3k and we found out because we received the letter from the finance company. my helper is indonesian so she had to ask me to explain the letter. i paid off the loan for her and i then also spoke to her friend's employer about the situation. luckyily the other employer was very thoughtful so they paid me back straight away. my helper obviously learnt a great lesson. she now knows not to lend any money or become a gurantor. a good helper is sometimes hard to replace and it is human nature to make silly mistakes.

Good advice s1. Firing her is a bit darn steep. Try to act like a human being in this case. Either tell the agency to bugger off and leave you alone, or mediate and sort it out. Think of all the trouble and expense of getting a new helper - and the chances of finding one you're happy with, then deal with it.

the simple answer is to tell the loan agency that you will not tolerate them on your property or on your phone and explain to them that you know who they are and if anything goes wrong you'll go to the police. Don't be so spineless lah.

Thanks for the advice everyone. Inkonkoni, I've already spoken to the agency to tell that they shouldn't be on private property etc and reported the matter to the police, so don't know where the spineless bit came from.


These agencies are ruthless - the fact that their first visit to chase up on the loan was a knock on my front door, as opposed to a telephone call, and how they sneaked through security downstairs just goes to show how keen they are to be intimidating. Most of the people who I know have experienced a similar situation only get the phone calls initially. Either way, these kind of situations are nasty to deal with.

TayTay, here is my personal experience for your reference.


When my helper first started with me (7 yrs ago), she did the same thing. Being new at having a helper, I didn't know anything about money lending agencies and etc. One day I received a phone call from a loan collector and that was how I found out that my helper borrowed $40,000 (belive it or not) from 3 different agencies. According to her, one of the $20,000 was for a friend (she co-signed). She borrowed from 3 places because she was trying to use one to pay the other untill somehow she screwed up the timing... I was so so so mad.


At first, I told the loan collectors not to call again and I would call the police and etc. Didn't work. I then told them that the helper has been fired. That did't work either as I have many friends who actually did fire the helpers but still had collectors calling them. I was so afraid of these people knocking on my door with only the helper and my daugther at home.


She was a good maid and I was quite dependent on her (I work full time). So either fire her or pay the debt off. I chose the latter. I took a big risk and paid off $40,000 for her and then told her I would keep her passport and contract and she will have to pay me back the money by my taking a portion of her salary out. It took almost 2 years but she paid me back. As far as I know, she hasn't borrowed again. If she somehow messed up and ended up getting fired, I would have lost all my money. It was a big gamble.


So at the end of the day, your decision will have to be based on your gut feel about her. I actually think most of these maids really do not understand the meaning of "co-sign". My maid at the time had no idea that the agency was charging her 45% interest even though it was written clearly on paper. They usually just sign things without reading them. The person who she co-signed for eventually disappeared so if her story was true, she paid $20,000 for her friend. I think she learned her lesson the hard way.


My personal experience and those of my friends was that you can tell the building security, the lending agency and etc of not bothering you, the reality is that it is very difficult. Those people have many ways. Your life will not be peaceful untill it is settled either by you firing the maid or paying the money.


So after the incident I told my helper that if she needed money (not a big some), I will lend her. So does come to me for money occasionally. So far so good.


Good luck sorting this out.

Tay Tay,

They had probably been trying to contact your maid by phone but she either ignored their calls or changed her sim card - so their only way of getting any contact was to visit the property where she lives - to see if she is still there, to ascertain the situation and to ensure her employer (you ) knew about the situation - they probably find that by ensuring the employer knows about it they have a higher chance of collecting the money as the employer will pay them out to stop the hassling.


It is a 3 way street for all concerned - the lending agencies do not explain the contract well enough for these people when they enter into a co-sign agreement, the people who ask for a co-sign agreement have figured out the system of taking the money and running and not having to work for it and someone else gets the burden of repayment. AND the girls that get into these agreements are just so naive and (dare I say it) 'stupid' when it comes to money.


There are people in this world who cannot manage money in all continents - which is why credit cards and finance companies exist. People from third world countries are only exposed to such wealth when outside their own country and it is 'easy' money because they have no clue about interest rates, repayment contracts etc etc because they have never had to deal with these things before - they bought things when they had the money, and if they didn't have the money they either stole it or did without. It was a lot simpler.


Also think of it from the agencies perspective - how many of their loans are defaulted on? - if asiaxpat forums are anything to go by then I would assume that at least 50% are defaulted - this is alot of money to lose, and is the reason why they charge such high interest to those who borrow from them.

If you really like your maid i think you should do the same as MC and pay it then deduct it from her salary. BTW where is the aunt in all this? Can you contact her employer or has she disappeared. She is probably not even a relative as it seems that filipinas all tend to refer to each other as aunts and cousins - they are a very close knit community and find it hard not to help each other out financially when asked. Which is why so many of them get caught up in these situations.

Hello - me again! Just as a follow up to my message almost a year ago! Doesn't time fly!


My husband and I went through the whole situation and decided to give her another chance. We ended up deducting minimal amounts from her salary every month as a gesture towards repayment. In April this year, she resigned claiming that a family member was ill. She originally asked for a month's leave, but given the situation at our home, we said that it was too long. So she resigned. BTW, she was still owing money to us at that point.


Okay, I'll make this short...... just today, I receive a letter addressed to her. There's a telephone number showing, so I naturally call to find out more details. Turns out she's taken another loan out. To me, it's obvious she has no intentions of repaying it, as she's resigned. But the fact that she can say how much she cares for my daughter, yet jeopardize our safety AGAIN!


Moral of the story: It's hard to be tough sometimes. If you develop a bond, you want to give them the benefit of the doubt. But if my new helper has any trouble with finance companies, I'll never fall into this situation again. She's out immediately.

1. They all claim to be innocent "guarantor " .Infact , either they split the money or they guarantee one another .

2.Finance co cannot keep their passport now. So even if your maid still has her passport does not mean they did not borrow.

3. Bad debt rate is less than 20% . Therefore, still a very profitable business.

4. If a maid suddenly wants to terminate a contract, they want to "run ".

5. A maid can borrow almost $50,000 from 3 different companies. Then resign.

6. They can change surname/name easily in Phil and then come back with a new passport.

Perhaps there is another way to handle this also, that might help.

As am employer, when you hire a new DH, tell them you do not wish them to borrow money or sign as a "guarantor." Tell them if you find out they have borrowwd or lent any money, they will be terminated.

Make it clear that as their employer, you do not wish them to lend or borrow money. Make sure they understand how strongly you feel about this subject. Many of these girls are borrowing or lending money so they or their relatives can pay to go and work in Canada or even come to HK as a DH, but they must pay very very high placement fees. They are not usually borrowing the money to go and gamble in at the racetrack or Macau. To them, having a relative working in Canada means they may have a chance in the future to go themselves and they are willing to risk the cost for that chance.

If you think that keeping their passport will prevent them from applying for a loan, all they have to do is go and report that they lost their passport, and apply for a replacement. It takes a short amount of time to get another.

This is a big problem, but can be directly laid at the feet of those Agencies who charge so much money in fees that to takes YEARS to pay if off.

Try asking the Agency how much they charge the DH sometime, if they offer you a low placment fee as an employer to hire from Philippines, chances are they are passing that along to the DH. The average placment fee for the girls requires them to mortgage their land, sell their possessions and or borrow money to pay it off. We rarely think of their side of the story, but it is a reality, they want a job so badly.