Posted by
FIFIB
16 yrs ago
Hi everybody,
I need your advise since I don't know what to do. I confirmed recently my suspicions that my helper has been stealing money from me, I think everything started since the begining of this year.
She has been with us for almost 3 years.
I had already been suspecting about this for a while since my money was running out of my wallet way too fast, but since I'm kind of careless with money I kept thinking that maybe I had spent the money.
But I confirmed my suspicions one day that I went to withdraw HK1600 from the bank, didn't buy anything after that just came straigh home. Then I took my Baby to the park and felt lazy about bringing my wallet with me since it is bulky and also something extra to carry, so I left it at home.
When I came back and asked her to go to the store I had missing HK1,000 so I confronted her and told her that this was not the first time I noticed this and that this time she went too far.
She was the only one at home. My husband had taken my other girl to OP.
She kept silent, she didn't denaying or admited, although I basically was accusing her of stealing from me.
My dilemma is that my husband tells me I should fire her but my kids are used to her and she pretty much knows the routine around the house. I work part time and I'm worried that a new helper won't take good care of them. After all my kids have never been injured under her care.
I know she steals the money because she needs it. She has a lot of family drama back in the Phillipines. I told my husband that as long as we keep our wallets with us all the time it should be fine. Plus now a days I just carry with me HK$300 which is a pain in the butt because this means that sometimes I have to go to the bank machine at inconvenient times.
Now I have to hide my wallet at diffent places and sometimes I even forget where I put it. I feel upset about it.
I think that I'm scared that if I hire a new helper and is not good then I have to star all over again.
I don't think is a good idea to give her an increase on her salary because it's like telling her that it is ok to steal from me, besides God knows if her expenses will keep increasing and she will continue stealing from me anyway.
Appreciate your advise.
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if you don't do anything about it... she will feel pretty smug about doing it again and again and again... and in the long run she will just think your words are empty and she won't listen to you anymore. you are the employer - not the other way around.
yes the kids love her, yes the kids will miss her but in the end it will you who will be miserable. just need to explain to the kids that the helper cares for them but she has to be with her family too (or something like that reason). you have to tell your kids your maid is leaving because of other reasons not because she does not care for them. kids are resilient and will get over her in due time and love the new replacement
the best thing you can do if you want is to tell her to hand in her resignation or else you will have her investigated by the police and she wouldn't like having her name in the police records or the immigration records for that matter
it's your home and it's your right to feel safe at home
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Agreed with Wiz Bang. There is no way you can leave this unpunished.
Terminate her. She has abused your trust and no longer deserves it. There are plenty of trustworthy helpers out there.
"I think that I'm scared that if I hire a new helper and is not good then I have to star all over again."
I don't understand how a new helper can be worse than one who steals. Reading your post, your life is obviously hell already what with the hiding the wallet and being upset.
"I know she steals the money because she needs it. "
Stealing is never justified. She chose to take the job. Just because she needs more money doesn't justify taking it. You are making excuses for her inexcusable behavior.
"After all my kids have never been injured under her care."
What a strange thing to say. My kids have been hurt in our helper's care, but these have been "normal" playground injuries. No worries about that. I think helpers should be judged by other standards. For example efficiency, trustworthiness, willingness to teach children various things.
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I can't believe you are even asking the question!! Terminate her on the spot! Not only are you giving into her and letting her get away with it, what sort of example are you setting for your children?
If you were in an office situation, the employee would be fired on the spot. Your children will learn to love another helper and learn the routine of the household.
Her family dramas are not your business, they are hers. Stop treating this like a sob story and be an employer.
If she has stolen money from you, what else has she done that you don't know about?
It would be a very silly move to keep her on.
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danna
16 yrs ago
When you found out that you lost the 1K you should have asked her to return the money and then terminate her. And it is not only money that she can steal.
There are a lot of helpers that are honest and can well adapt to a new household. So don't worry about finding one that can replace her. Goodluck!
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Like everyone else has said here, FIRE her. She's committed a crime and it doesn't matter whether it's $10 or $1000, it's still stealing. It doesn't take long for children to adapt to a new maid and since you work part time, the transition shouldn't be too difficult.
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Agree with everyone except you, tell her to resign or report to the immigration. They are plenty good helpers out there.
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FIFIB
16 yrs ago
Dear All,
Thanks for your comments. That night when my husband came back and told him what happened he told me to sack her but since I have a Baby is not so easy to fire her on the spot since he cannot talk - understand yet. After me, my helper is the person that he feels more confortable with.
Needless to say that I couldn't sleep that night thinking about it, I was livid.
My husband travels quite a bit so it is not possible for him to work from home. My kids are at very young age so they won't learnt this from her. Besides since I mentioned before I work part time they never go out with her.
In short many thanks for your words, I'll start interviwing helpers and will terminate this one once the new arrives. I don't have relatives here so no one to take care of my kids while I'm at work and my employer won't let me take 6 weeks off. I hate to be trapped on this situation.
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It seems easy to judge for some on this discussion. Desperate people do desperate things. There are not many rich thieves in the world and not suprisingly a lot of poor ones. If you are happy with the rest of her work remove the temptation, buy a security box for cash and valuable (good advice anyway) and put her on a written warning. Everyone deserves a second chance, but it helps that they appreciate it.
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smsm
16 yrs ago
Kids, babies are more adaptable then we give them credit for....personally i wouldnt be comfortable with leaving my kids with the helper whose broken my years of trust.....stealing i wud imagine is not just one compartment of her persoanlity, u have witnessed this as this was more evident...as u said ur baby is small cant talk...i wouldnt be completely at ease leaving my lil with her even though he seems very comfotable staying with her..
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Write her a warning letter. Tell her if it happens again you will inform the police. And if it does happen again, fire her on the spot. If she's stealing from you, she obvioulsy doesn't give a damn about you or your family.
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"That night when my husband came back and told him what happened he told me to sack her but since I have a Baby is not so easy to fire her on the spot since he cannot talk - understand yet. After me, my helper is the person that he feels more confortable with."
Kids, especially young kids, get over this kind much faster than adults.
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Nobody is indispensable. I would much rather deal with a few weeks of inconvenience while finding a new helper and having my children become comfortable with her than years of hiding my valuables in my own house. Your house is the one place your family should feel safe and secure.
Give her a written warning so you have documentation when you terminate her.
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If I were you I would have had her at the police station as soon as I caught her - particulalrly as you have been suspicious of her for nearly a year.
How can you feel comfortable leaving your children alone with a person who clearly has no moral values? Did it not occur to you that your children may be at risk in her care? Maybe she would leave them alone in the house to go and try to get money from somewhere else now that she doesn't have free access to your wallet! An extreme example was in the press some time ago where a helper was accepting money to allow some pedophile to touch the children in her care Can't remember exact details but something along those lines). I am not suggesting your helper would do that but you must realise her priorities are making money not caring for your children. Besides what is the point in you working part time if you then allow the helper to steal your money.
I had a helper do a runner when my children where young (20 mths and 3) neither of them ever particulalry noticed she was gone and adapted to the next one easily.
You absolutely have to get her out of your house asap!! I would also not pay her one month notice as stealing from your wallet is clearly a criminal act.
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why wait for another incident to happen.
what do you do until then... always look behind your shoulders
hide your possessions when the thief is already in the house?
make sure you have an extra set of eyes to monitor what goes in the house
it's pointless
just tell her to submit her resignation and give her the salaries due to her
since you are waiting for a replacement, i suggest that you reduce her responsibilities to the essentials like taking care of the kids, and allow her access only to common areas like her room, the laundry, kitchen and kid's room.
limit her access to other rooms or with your supervision
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You don't have to wait 6 weeks necessarily for a new helper. We put ours on 2 weeks after interviewing. I honestly cannot believe you would consider keeping her on.
I would sooner take leave without pay from my job than to have a thief living in my house. It would eat me alive wondering what she is pocketing, especially if she knows she might be getting the boot.
Live with the inconvenience, as for the baby, the helper will be forgotten in no time, as has been said, children adapt so much better than adults.
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Fired Her and move on, otherwise you will regret! She did it once and she will do it again when there is another opportunity. In short, short term pain is but that a long term one,right! Don't get emotional with this kind of issue. Good Luck and take Care of your family.
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I would fire her now and wouldn't think twice. Find a new maid. I dealt with something similar in the past.. it happens once it will happen again.. next thing you know she'll start borrowing from finance companies and when she fails to pay them back they'll be knocking at your door. It isn't worth it.
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Why don't you talk to here - heart to heart & ask what is the real reson she does that? If she ask forgiveness give her a 2nd chance & I bet she would make up for her mistakes.
IF she is still defiant then that's another story.
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FIFIB
16 yrs ago
Hi All,
Like I said before I will terminate her. I'm not so sure at this point I can report her to immigration since I didn't call the police when this happened.
Easy to judge why I didn't do this or that but at that moment I felt trapped by the issue that we don't have relatives here and I'm scarred to bring the next day a total stranger to watch my kids. If this one betrayed me after 2 years and I used to trust her (that's why I renew the contract) how can I feel about bringing the next day someone that I just met.
Even if I quit my job I have to give three months notice. It is not the case that my kids lover her and cannot live without her is more that I was affraid that the new person would do the same, or do some of the stupid things that people complaint about here. At that time I thought that this one was at least the devil that I know and that as long I hide my wallet she wouldn't steal from me anymore.
My oldest one communicates very well so I call home very often to check on things so on that respect I know that she is not leaving them alone in the house or taking them out.
As soon as she's gone I will change the locks and maybe also my land line.
I don't know how could I possible warn her potential employers, I'm her first one in HK, I hired her directly from the Phillipines so she didn't have any reference letter.
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Put in the release letter the real reason why you let her go. The only way she then could find another employer is by not using it. But how could she find another employer without a release letter?
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Pls bring her to the police. Any other caught stealing would be treated this way. Why is it so different when the person is a domestic helper??
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pines
16 yrs ago
if she got terminated , she has to go home anyway...well its pretty easy to accuse a helper...but i hope its all true. we have neighbor here, she terminated her helper saying she stole from them, poor helper. and to our surprise, that helper is back and working for her! isn't it crazy? desperate helper. desperate employer, meet each other.strange huh! if you want to believe it happened in discovery bay.
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XTC
16 yrs ago
your helper is stealing from you .....and you are not sure whether to sack her ???? how can you leave your children with someone who you can not trust ?? Have heard of scary stories of things that happen when the emplyer is not around....i dont even want to go there.....
i really think that you should sack her....NOW
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she is stealing money, like someone said "desperate times" - that does not mean she will ever harm the children, XTC - lets just not overanalyse shall we?
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Trici
16 yrs ago
I've had a bad helper before and I have not hesitated to fire her on the spot. I was also doing a full time job and have no relatives in HK. I took no-pay leave for a considerable period when the new maid came. Any maid for the first time is a stranger in your household. But that is better than having a thief at home. She must be laughing that you still give in to her cheating. She has breached your trust. Fire her!!
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FIRE HER! Some of these people think that just because they come from a third world country everything they do should be accepted especially if they do it " for the sake of their poor family." Have you checked if anything else in your house is missing? I heard a story about a Filipina who borrowed a lot of money from different people and loan companies. The employers did not know and did not even notice that she was slowly moving her things out of her employers house to a friend's house and one day instead of buying food, she went to the airport and flew to the Philippines, even took the employer's money for food with her!! I dont know what happened then but sometimes people dont know the meaning of the word gratitude. You treat them bad, they complain,you treat them well and they will abuse. They always say that they are poor and have a lot pf financial problems, who doesn't? In fairness, a lot of them are good and trustworthy. Don't just get carried way by their dramas. I hope you find another one who you can trust especially with your kids.
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This helper has been with you for three years, and has most likely been
stealing from you for three years.
Let me correct myself and see if you change your mind
The helper has "been stealing from your children for the past 3 years".
There are plenty of good helpers out there. You can no longer blame
your helper now that you know she is stealing. From the moment
you found out, you are responsible.
And you are setting a bad example to your children. If they are
aware of what is going on ( and they will be since you keep hiding
things ) you are IMPRINTING in them that when they face problems
such as thes then the best thing is to keep quiet and choose the road
of least confrontation. That way you are helping to ruin your
children's future because they will not fight for what is right,
be brave to take the correct decisions. With your attitude, you
are setting your children to accept when they are adults that it
is ok to be cheated, to be abused, to be deprecated.
Please do the right thing. Also, you have your husband to back you.
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FIFIB
16 yrs ago
Cougar88
Please read well, first of all I said that I will fire her, I'm arranging now interviews which by the way is turning out to be a nigthmare, I almost feel I'm being interviewed by them but that is another issue.
You are been very judge mental, I made a mistake but that doesn't make me a bad mother or a bad roll for my kids. They are too young to realizar what is going on. One of them is 14 months old, he is smart but I doub't very much he pays attention to it.
This helper will be gone in no time. I have set many good examples for my kids like being with them on their daily life and participating on what its important for them.
I repeat one poor decision from my side doesn't make me a bad mother and won't screw up their life.
Being a good parent is a hard job, I don't think that any of us here are making mistakes on purpose but we do it, and the important thing is to correct them.
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Sorry to hear what has happened to you. Dont take it personal as eveyrone is sharing the experience and trying to help out each other. Had helpers like yours and also experienced the same as you with young children...Just in case that you need some info. for the future reference that you can terminate a helper without giving them any notice:
http://www.labour.gov.hk/eng/public/wcp/FDHguide.pdf, Page 18;
And one employment agency link which you can view the helpers online before you make your decision:
http://www.hi-cedar.com.hk Do not let your helper know you are terminating her before the new one arrives otherwise she may do somthing to your food or your children. Good luck.
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mdap
16 yrs ago
She steals HKD1,000 and she is still under your roof? Who is the fool here? Go to her room right now - clean everything out, check all her pockets to see what else she has stolen and dump her and her belongings on the pavement. There are thousands of good, hardworking and trustworthy FDH's looking for work that when offered, they appreciate. This person took advantage and you have to fire her. You can still also (within 3 months) report this to the police - but then you drag it out for yourself too - so just fire her and tell her to use the $1,000 as severence pay and her airfare home - don't pay her anything else!
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FIFIB
hope you can find a new honest helper soon. So that you can fire her ASAP. Hang in there, Good luck!
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Hi ....Its very bad for us helpers that something like that is happening at your households. I am really sorry to hear about that, but i guess you just have to confront her one way or another, and besides there's a lot of good helpers out there, just don't be afraid of the change, and besides we are the one who is needing the job. I had work for my Western employer for about 9 years now and they are about to relocate in February....If you are still looking for someone by then here' my number 92613341. Name's Aida
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I did not mean that you are a bad mother, I am sure you are a fantastic
mother which is why you put up with the behaviour of your helper because
you were thinking of your children.
Kids pick up on a lot of things that we don't think they do. I hope you find
a good helper. It will be worth it in the end
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Fire her and report her to the immigration, so she does not continue to steal from her future HK employers! "Once a thief always a thief!!"
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scary stories.. like sticking their big toes into mouths of crawling babies while they're on the phone with friends back in the filippines on a lazy afternoon.
I'd not just report her to immigration but the police and also the consulate of the Philippines.
This is not only theft but openly challenging dishonesty. It's not unlikely she has and would do something worse if let to stay. Protect yourself and your kids, fire her now.
If you have $1000 to spare why not give some of it to the many really poor handicapped beggars, not a helper who steals.
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You MUST FIRE HER! Any other action is up to you but if it was me I would report her and get her kicked out. How can you keep her in your home now? You will never feel safe and able to relax and she will see it as a weakness. She can steal from you, get caught and still nothing is done against her, she`ll be boasting to her friends. GET RID NOW.
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you may install cameras and inform her about it, she might stop
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You have a thief in your home looking after your kids. How can you trust her to do anything right for your family?
Do not underestimate your kids...you will be pleasently surprised how adaptable they are to different situations & people.
If this happened in my home, I'd get rid of her ASAP...I mean even without a months notice....she could leave you high & dry if you give her one month to steal stuff! My reply is blunt...but forgive me for being straight!
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I think you will find everyone, that FIFIB is getting rid of her helper as she has mentioned a couple of times, so no need to keep having a go at her/him.
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FIFIB -
I think you should consider carefully before firing your helper. To just say "fire her" is simplistic, in my opinion, for the following reasons -
Firstly, it can be very difficult to change your helper. I am not of the opinion that there "are loads of great helpers out there, and it's really easy to find a fab one". My experience has been that it's really hard to find a good one, and I had about 6 weeks with no DH at all due to slow processing of the visa by Immigration.
Some people will say, just get one who's finished contract or the employer has moved abroad, it's quicker - but these can be really hard to find and many of them are picky. For example, I have 2 young children so of course there's a fair bit of work to be done in my home, and most 'finished contract' helpers just weren't interested when they realised that.
Secondly, if you hire a new one, will she be better than the one you've got? I've had domestic help for the past 5 years, and 50% of my helpers stole from me, none with such a good reason as yours!
I wonder if you are happy with your helper in every other aspect? If her work hasn't been going downhill, if she hasn't been giving you backchat etc you could talk to her about this. Give her a second (last) chance - she may greatly appreciate that - and buy yourself a lockable box to put your money in. Don't keep hiding the key in a different place every time, otherwise of course you won't remember where you put it.
Anyway, in conclusion, I think some people's circumstances are such that they can easily advise you to 'just fire her' but if your situation is that you couldn't cope without a helper for a few weeks then I would proceed with extreme caution.
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FIFIB
16 yrs ago
Dear Snow Rose,
Thanks for your e-mail. For many of the reasons that you mention above is that I didn't fire her on the spot, not that I could anyway.
She takes good care of my kids, at least seems that way since my Baby likes to be with her. She has also taken care of my oldest since she was 15 m/o and she likes her. They play together and sometimes when I go out my daugther chooses to stay at home with her.
Her job performace is good, she has never talk back to me and she is willing to do and learn new things. She never talks on the mobile, doesn't even have one. Her family calls her to my home number in case of emergency.
Her cooking is very good, she learnt to do the dishes from my country. When my mother visits me she even jokes with her that she could open now a restaurant.
The thing is that the first two years I'm sure she did not steal anything from me but after we signed the second contract I started to suspect about it for few episodes that happen and because I know that her family has a lot of needs. Both her daughthers are in private school and the husband abandoned her for another woman. Now he has a boy with her. That's why I think she favours my boy, because she told me she could't give one to her husband.
My mother and I are very close so I told her about the HK$1,000 and she told me to think twice before firing her because of the great help. Basically she almost run the house by herself although her bad point is that she doesn't that much initiative but I just gave her a written schedule and she follows that.
My mother also told me to put a lock in one of the draws to avoid temptations. Maybe it was my fault also to leave my wallet everywhere.
I don't know :o( The point is that I'm hiring a new one because seems to be the thing to do but I feel pretty anxious about it.
I will terminate this as soon as the new one arrives.
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FIFIB
Your last reply is amazing. How can you be questioning yourself and asking if it was your fault? Can`t you leave your own wallet in your own house anywhere you like? Would you take money out of your bosses wallet if you saw it on his desk? Of course not. This is down to your helper`s greed and don`t start feeling sorry for her and her hardships…stealing is stealing full stop. You sound like you treated her well. Maybe she could have talked to you to work something out but no she abused your trust and stole from her.
Do not wait until you get someone else before firing her. I`m sure you could work something out in the meantime about your jobs and kids. What if she finds out you`re looking for someone? What will she grab or even worse do to your home or family? She`s not like that? Are you sure? Can you afford to keep her around? If your children ask then I suggest you tell them the truth about why she had to go, teach them early that stealing is wrong.
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crazy, totally agree with jushayward, I could not live like that. I totally trust my helpers (maybe more fool me)... otherwise I would be uncomfortable in my own home...
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oz64
16 yrs ago
hi, i'm a filipino living in australia, maids here in australia is unheard of but we do have maids back in the philippines and one of the main criteria we always look for is honesty, we don't care so much if they are new because you can always train them, but we never tolerate someone who is dishonest and steals. There are also cases like that even in the philippines and its sad when i think about my fellow country men doing this and yes we think they are so pitiful and unfortunate to come from poor families but still when we are talking of principles i think we should not tolerate this. And even if she is a filipino i would say fire her because they will never learn their lesson and things like this should never be tolerated. I'm sure you will find other and maybe better maids around.
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Hi there,
I think stealing is absolutely un acceptable and you are right in firing her.
Other thing of training is definitely a big issue but believe me it is very much manageable. Being an Indian and both of us working full time in demanding jobs, cooking Indian food was an issue. I trained my philipino helper and she learned to do a good job in a month.
There will be a tough period of a month or so, but I am sure its worth it. I for one will not tolerate stealing. You can keep a small locker to keep your passport and jwellery, which is a good habit in any case. Some precautions should always be taken.
Anyways I am sure lot of people have given you same advice, I just wanted to re-enforce the fact that stealing is definitely not some thing you should tolerate.
Cheers
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I don't think there is anything wrong with putting a lock on the bedroom door.
At least it saves you the problem of the helper going through your stuff.
Yes, trust is important, but there are certain degrees of trust.
Its no different from an office. Does the boss leave his cheque books, payroll, tax
returns, profit statements lying around? Yes, he trusts his staff, but at the end of the
day, he has a duty to protect himself.
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