Posted by
axptguy38
14 yrs ago
It's a bit hard to call it abuse without knowing the individual circumstances. However in principle 17 hours is a very long day and should be avoided. It can be acceptable if it only happens only rarely.
Some helpers work, say, 06a to 20p but they have a long period with little or no work in the middle of the day, with the kids in school or doing other activities.
If a helper routinely works too much, her workload needs to be decreased somehow.
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Sure, if it's 6am to 11pm non-stop work, it's abuse, but it's allowed in HK. I don't think there are any laws here protecting the foreign domestic helper's working hours...
And as we've just heard yesterday in the Legislative Council - they won't be included in the minimum wage bill either.
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As a guideline, let the helper know during the interview about times.
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I dont think Cara is defensive here. Its her own opinion with basis.
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Grytch if you say your english is not good, better be extra careful of what you say. I can see you have so many things in mind that you cant express very well because of your limited capacity in the english grammar that leads from misunderstandings to arguments. Btw, English is my second language too.
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Actually the law protects helpers pretty well on paper. That's not the issue. Enforcement is the problem. I do feel sorry for helpers who are worked too hard or earn less than minimum wage. Unfortunately barring tougher crackdowns on abusive employers I don't see it changing.
Compare with Singapore, where helpers are specifically not protected by the employment ordnance. No minimum wage, no weekly rest day, no protection for pregnancy (you get deported).
Another factor is intangibles. If a helper is yelled every day even a higher salary, a nice room and easy hours might not be much consolation. If a helper is treated with respect and is happy in her workplace, a smaller room, longer hours and a lower salary (still at or above minimum of course) might be ok for her.
Certainly many many HK employers could learn a thing or two about respecting helpers. As one blog aptly put it: "She's a person too!"
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You mean to say here that the topic you brought up in this thread is nonsense?
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"Unless I am misinformed (which is possible), they can be worked to death apart from one day off a week."
You are not allowed to abuse a helper, so technically working a helper too hard falls under this. But you make a valid point. Unfortunately if you make a rule and lots of people ignore it, it is not working. Much better to figure out if a helper is abused as a whole than just look at strict parameters like hours.
I am for enforcement that looks for abuse in a holistic and flexible way. Let it be a judgment call from inspectors that work for the Immigration Department or the Department of Labour. I am against strict rules because employers either ignore them or find a way around them.
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Miles away
Grytch does seem to single people out, and due to her lack of full understanding of the English language, she can make very offensive comments, wrongly directed at people.
Cara should not have to feel she has to justify her relationship with helpers, she is one of the best in Hk, and has been commenting on this forum for a very long time,and always makes sensible suggestions and is very fair to Helpers and employers.
Personally I cannot even be bothered to waste my time an energy commenting to grytch's immature little rants, she needs to get her facts straight and use her grey matter. If so many Fdhs' were so hard worked the streets of hK would not be as crowded on a Sunday would they.
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Y&B
14 yrs ago
Miles away -
Reading your post it seems that English could also be your second language so maybe that is why you "don't seen any problem from her english grammar here".
I have to agree with Susie in that grytch really does need to get her facts right before posting and I also agree that many of her posts come across as very immature, in fact I found her last post most "belittling" towards Cara, now whether it was meant like that or whether it was sincere I can only guess, but that is how it came across to me.
It seems grytch is unable to grasp the most important points of what Cara has been trying her best to explain.
As a native English speaker myself I do appreciate that if English is your second language then it must be quite hard to express what you are trying to say on this type of forum but it should also be appreciated that sometimes it can be quite difficult for a native English speaker to try and make sense of some of the posts - (actually that goes for some of the perfect English posts too :-)
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Y&B
14 yrs ago
Agree with cara -
grytch, your posts are difficult to understand but it has absolutely nothing to do with "American" or "British" English, I'm afraid it's because of your poor use of English grammar in general.
As others have said many times, allowances are of course made when it is obvious English is not your first language but you must be prepared for some criticism when many of your comments are completely irrelevant or fail to make any sense at all.
Sorry, but if you took your time to read through your replies carefully you might find that they could actually be quite helpful to you.
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