Posted by
hkexpat11
13 yrs ago
We've had our helper for a few months and it's been working out pretty well - she has lots of iniative and has been very helpful.
However, the other day she made an extremely offensive comment about my religion, which I found very upsetting. We didn't talk about religion (hers or ours) in the interview as to my mind it was irrelevant - as long as she obeys my instructions on the food she cooks for us (which as far as i know she has done). But now I'm thinking - did she mean it? Does she hate us now that she knows our religion and was this a way of showing it? Or was it just ignorance?
Anyone else encountered this kind of clash, or have any advice?
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The replacement for my ex worker then is a member of Jesus Is Christ. she knew the employers non-christian. What she did was go in every room before everyone wakes up and do her "ritual" of casting the evl spirit away.
She condone all the boss's teenage grandchildren who are sexually active and those living in together. And the way she looks up/looks down to our gay couple guests are beyond/logic.
When the boss and i were away, he would take her tambourine and perform praising songs and dance whole cleansing ever nook and crany of the house.
BUT when the boss is around, she's all smile and praises to everyone!
No wonder I would rather be stoned to death than be converted by her in her religion.
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Tune
13 yrs ago
I'm not sure Cara, I always tend to rise above such things. I used to hold to certain religious views until the day I bought a telescope.
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I beg to disagree. Some people are simply hateful and offensive. Full stop.
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I think a good exorcism may be called for if web cams, beatings and removal of all of her human rights fail to render results. But in all seriousness, this is ignorance, unfortunately the church rules, and these poor people have been traumatised into this state of mind by religion and the church.
As little as they earn, they still even fork out substantial amounts of their salaries, just to keep "the man in the sky" happy, and that just before he kills a bunch more with another typhoon, flood, tsunami or earthquake, just to further "test their faith".
My helper is obsessed with "worship" and the church, a few weeks back she rented a gown (graduation style robe) for a concert, as did about 30 of her friends, who form a choir, when I asked her the cost, she advised that it was close to $300. I was astonished, and suggested that she surely had more important ways to spend the money, than a gown for a concert. She did not seem to think it was a sacrifice at all, but apparently she would not be permitted to perform if she did not have the gown.
All to their own, I do not interfere, I am just startled at this blind faith, on the other hand maybe the pastor has shares in the gown rental.
Yes it is ignorance, her church has indoctrinated her and she is likely unaware of the impact of her comments, oh and by the way, when next you invite Sodom and Gomorrah for dinner, just tell her not to stare too much, but to pray for them from the pew in the pantry.
If she doesn't believe in fairies, ask her how she can believe that there are such things as talking snakes.
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Religion has caused and awful lot of wars and division of countries , why don't people just learn to be kind and good to each other without professing a particular religion and hating another! or imposing their religion on others, no one has the right to do that, if a person follows a particular religion- this is fine as long as they keep their beliefs to themselves, and respect others.
Some of the more 'extreme' religions attract weak minded people who have to follow like sheep, and they get their weak minds and purses! manipulated by the church leaders.
When respect has gone in any employee/employer relationship it is time for parting of the ways.
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Fixer
13 yrs ago
Without knowing what the offending remarks were made by your helper, should the board be taking sides?
And regardless of what religious faith the OP follows, aren't religions meant to teach the believers to forgive and move on?
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Dear Fixer, the problem is these religions are meant to teach believers to forgive and to carry on, however all too often they teach them to JUDGE and CONDEMN! A lot of the believers have taken on the role of the man in the sky and make judgement on their own.
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naoe
13 yrs ago
Actually, Religion is a form of worship. It includes a system of religious attitudes, beliefs, and practices; these may be personal, or they may be advocated by an organization. Usually religion involves belief in God or in a number of gods; or it treats humans, objects, desires or forces as objects of worship. Much religion is biiased ono human study of nature; there is also revealed religion. There is true religion and false.
AND MY QUESTION IS,, Why are there so many religions? Are all religions acceptable to God?
please let me know your idea,,thanks a lot,,
i like this topic.
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Dear Naoe, can you be a little more specific, acceptable to which God?
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My sentiments exactly madtown, with a talking snake and all!
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Fixer
13 yrs ago
Interesting comments on why one chooses to follow a religion when the OP's posting was about themselves being intolerant to another human being which clearly goes against all that's decreed by their respective faiths.
I've seen many followers who take on the notion that belonging to their special club puts them in a higher order above the non believers, yet totally compassionless towards others and living creatures.
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naoe
13 yrs ago
What you mean by WHICH GOD? We have only ONE GOD, Right??? You dont believe we only have one God?
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naoe
13 yrs ago
What you mean by WHICH GOD? We have only ONE GOD, Right??? You dont believe we only have one God?
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naoe
13 yrs ago
hi,, but if you learn the true about which religion is teaching the truth about God, then you will learn that there is a group of religion that full of compassion to each other no matter what nationality they have. thanks
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selda
13 yrs ago
I am glad i don't need a helper because i would find it difficult to share my flat with someone i have very little in common with. If you hold strong religious beliefs, have children and need to keep kosher, or halal, i think you would be better off with a helper from Sri Lanka in the first case and Indonesia in the second. If you are Christian, obviously a Christian helper from the Philippines would be ok.
I am a vegetarian, so i'd rather prepare my own food but as a non-religious person i am tolerant of other people's beliefs, as long as they don't impinge on my freedom.
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Quoting madtown in part " That being said, if anyone or any group would be justified in clinging to a God or any false sense of hope it would be those in the Domestic Helper community. I can certainly see why they would hope for a better after-life as this life hasn't dealt them a winning hand (so to speak)."
Only those worship the wrong god. Ask Homer.
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naoe
13 yrs ago
there are millions of religions now right? so its vitally important then, to make sure that we really worshipping the true God, the Creator of heaven and earth, and that our worship is pleasing to him!
so its not the matter either helper or empLyer, the matter is we serve the only true God becoz in Gods eyes no helper, no employer,,, We are all thesame to him... thanks
THATS WHY IM GOING TO INCOURAGE TO ALL OF YOU TO LEARN MORE ABOUT OUR THE ONLY TRUE GOD TO ATTAIN THE EVERLASTING LIFE... THANKS
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Naoe
There are many religions on the planet and many of them believe that they are the correct and only true religion. They all have a GOD, many of them believe that their GOD is the only GOD. They often have the opinion that they are "the chosen ones" and that other religions are all wrong and that their GOD's are simply idols, right? They will even go to war and kill to prove their point.
I Hope that answers my question.
Which GOD are you referring to then?
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I would like to agree with fixer except that I could not sense any intolerance from the OP's post. I just hope they've found a way to get pass the uneasy feeling when such "tactless" comment was made.
It is possible to live with someone who has different faith as you do in harmony. It's pretty basic called Respect.
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naoe
13 yrs ago
yes i appreciate you said that whitemischeif,, and thats one proved that they are not the true religion making war, right???
Ofcourse i will refer the God that hates lawlessness, like wars, crime, kidnapping, and all the badness and so on..... DO YOU KNOW WHO IS GOD IS THAT?
DO YOU LIKE TO HAVE A GOD LIKE THAT?
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Wasn't there a talking snake in the Jungle Book?
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Interesting how everyone's seemed to have made the assumption that the OP's helper is Christian and the OP's religion is not Christianity, when there was nothing specified about either's religion. The assumption may be correct, but we actually don't know for sure.
Reason why I mention this is that the thread seems to have descended into a combination of religion-bashing and promotion (mainly Christianity-bashing, specifically directed at domestic helpers), with a few exceptions.
I was a bit disturbed by whitemischief's following comment:
"[A] few weeks back she rented a gown (graduation style robe) for a concert, as did about 30 of her friends, who form a choir, when I asked her the cost, she advised that it was close to $300. I was astonished, and suggested that she surely had more important ways to spend the money, than a gown for a concert."
Who are you to judge how she spends her money? I'm not sure how I find that more reprehensible than say, renting a Halloween costume or an expensive tuxedo, or spending it on a few drinks or a meal. True, her wages are going to be much, much lower, than her employer's, but everyone finds fulfilment in different things - and to judge someone on how they spend their hard-earned money is a bit much. Might be different if it were spent on say, drugs, but even then it becomes a matter of where you draw the moral lines in the sand - some people might well take offence to alcohol la.. Incidentally, I'm sure that many DHs might be taken aback by the exorbitant amounts employers might spend on luxury items, but surely for them to comment on this would be inappropriate.
Bottom line being, I'm personally for respect and tolerance, if one's actions aren't harming another's - which should go both ways.
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Muse07, can you please clarify what judgement I made in this instance? I simply posed a question, and perhaps the church provide the costumes for the entertainment? Would the fulfilment not be the same if the choir was allowed to simply wear their own clothes?
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Fixer
13 yrs ago
Cara, the OP's message never mentioned the helper being intolerant about her beliefs just that it offended her. And we can't judge if the helper is at fault without knowing the full facts which the OP has omitted to provide.
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WM, the original comment I was looking at was "..I was astonished, and suggested that she surely had more important ways to spend the money, than a gown for a concert."
You subsequently said...
"Muse07, can you please clarify what judgement I made in this instance? I simply posed a question, and perhaps the church provide the costumes for the entertainment? Would the fulfilment not be the same if the choir was allowed to simply wear their own clothes?"
Your original comment was a statement - and I reiterate that you "suggested that she surely had more important ways to spend the money". Questioning whether or not there would have been an alternative provided by her church to paying $300 to rent the gown is another thing, and sounds fair enough to me - but it sounded like the robe was required by the organisers for the concert (however debateable the reasonableness of this was), and your original comment gave the impression that you thought her money would have been better spent if she did not perform at the concert at all. However, I'm sure the event was very important to her. Anyways, have noted your clarification.. can't check out the vid atm, but will later.
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No ways, you have totally missed my point, the church and the choir is her life in HKG, her choir buddies get together in my house frequently to do whatever they do, because I allow her use it for her gatherings, and, if it were not for choir but for lingerie or tupperware parties the same rules would apply, not everyday and just clean up afterwards. This woman has worked for me for 15 years and is almost a family member, I don't want to deprive her of her fulfillment, my question is, if everyone is supposed to be equal in front of God, why are these women expected to waste hard earned cash, on a dilly gown, why does the church not provide this or at least just let them wear their Sunday best, whatever it may be.
In terms of faith, her beliefs and mine differ significantly, however they are not an issue for debate or judgement by either party.
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It's lovely to hear how you treat your helper and regard her as almost a family member etc, but I feel I can hardly be blamed for "missing your point" given the content and mostly scathing tone of your first post (I just re-read it), compared to what you have added in the last few posts.
I note your concerns about wasting "hard earned cash", and the like, but that HK$300 for the concert hardly seems like something that sounded anything like continual financial hardship? I don't know the full reasoning behind it, but I imagine, like you seem to be well aware, that her church and choir provide her with a lot of fulfilment, and as a once-off or occassional cost, does not seem overly outrageous in the scheme of things.
Incidentally, it's not just DH's - who you call "these poor people have been traumatised into this state of mind by religion and the church" that are churchgoers, but people of different demographics, including wealthy Anglo-Saxons who donate, tithe, etc to churches. I'm sure you'd have strong views there, also, but then we'd be going into a whole debate about religion, which I don't think would be productive here.
As I mentioned before - despite, I am sure, the large gap in incomes between DHs and their employers, I can easily think of many more frivolous ways to spend HK$300. I mentioned tuxedo hire previously. Say you want to go to a black tie dinner, that, say costs HK$2,000. Black tie is expected and many men may well need to hire a tuxedo (I hear it's far from cheap). One could sure say that say one can have a great time without fronting up in such gear, but it's somewhat of a tradition and the attendee may just choose to dress up like that for his own pleasure. It also costs to hire a gown for university graduation and to buy team t-shirts, etc etc.. really I don't want to go too much into this.
Having said that, as I mentioned, I'd no objection to any suggestion for some more cost-efficient way to dress up for those performances and encouraging a dialogue there. And I can understand your frustration if you don't see that there's any willingness for such a discussion.
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TS religion aside there are people who are just tactless, insensitive and lacks respect or just plain hypocrites. being lonely and away from their love ones can make them vulnerable to powerful influences, and will always be dictated. no point arguing to self-centered people so either divert the topic or just avoid to much tete a tete with her
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