Helper Nightmare for the past four years!!

Hi Everyone. For the past four years I've had so many problems (big and small) with my helper. I've never thought of putting anything here but I've had enough and I would just like some opinions as to what to do now. Pretty much none of my friends have helpers nor kids (we are a young couple).


Before reeading, just to be clear we are a small family of 2 adults, 1 kid in a 2bdrm house. Kid goes to school full day. Salary for DH is 4,200.


To make reading easier I'll list out all the things she's done wrong (may not be wrong to others):


1. Eight months into her first contract, I got a call from an agent who yelled at me saying my helper is so troublesome. Agent said she agreed to sign with another employer but then cancelled last min. This was the first I heard she wanted to leave. I was taken aback. Then she told me never mind and she wanted to stay.


2. Two years, I got a call from my kid's friend's mom. She said my helper always invites herself and my kid to their home to have dinner (3x/wk) and asked to borrow money and tried to tell her she can help with their business. The mom said she didn't want my kid around if she is around. Saying my helper tried to get their helper fired so that mom will hire my helper. Imagine the heartache when I had to tell my kid he can't play with his friends when his nanny is around.


3. Helper asks me several times if she can go downstairs at night. I say okay but after she finishes up her chores. one time she threw a fit, left for two hours!


4.Management and security guard regularly complain about helper leaving good in fire excape/ trash starewell for other helpers to pick up and vice versa and regularly store goods in the lobby.


5. Other parents complaining of helper selling some sort of charity tickets during hours when she's supposed to be watching son.


6. Other helper calling house saying she owes them money.


7. Found out she gave my son some appetite stimulant pill!!!! (worst of all) It is called Petina, seious side effects and even discontinued manufacturing!!! Didn't call police. Never even apologized!!! But we still kept her.


8. Again, she wants to go but the changes her mind.


9. Loses her passport on way to interview for going to another country. Causes me to miss 5 seperate days of work that month. She lost her passport but nothing else. Didn't even ask nicely to borrow money for renewing everything. One month later she can get her new visa and Immigration will only let her stay if she starts a new contract with me rather than husband. Guess it's their loopol to let her stay in HK since she lost passport. So one month later, when she needed to pick up visa, she disappeared for FIVE hours after Immigration closes! She came back and my huz and I talked to her until 3am!


I told her I had to call police cause we are responsible for her safety. I also had to cancel work cause she didn't return.


She told us she was at immigration til 6:30 and cancelled our application!! Without even telling us. And she wanted to go immediately! but she should've been back by 7:30 (1 hr to home max). then change subject to...where are our original copies of personal documents?? asked her FIVE times! blank stare for 10 min! husband gets pissed then she said she gave to agent. So now, we find she was at agency! called agent (same as before) and he said she didn't give them squat. then she says maybe left at immigration! fast forward next morning(today) she left for good, went to agent and handed over our documents! i searched her bags this morning and she had nothing. she must've hid them somewhere.


i recorded our entire conversation which proves she intentionally hid our documents, lied about numberous of things and only spoke when asking about reference letter.


seriously, reference?? what good things would we write?


I don't get it. Were we too nice? I mean is it cause she's worked here for too long and she knows the tricks of the trade?? (She's been in Hk for 15 years.)


I am exhausted. Now I can't work til new helper comes and I don't get any benefits as I am a one-man-show.


Is it worth going to Labour Dept and Immigration to file a complaint against her??

I apologize for typos, but I am tired :/

Wow, definitely sounds like problems and inconveniences. Just curious how you found out she was giving your child pills and why you kept her after that? Meaning, what was her explanation for using them.

Well I may sound like a horrible mother but we really needed a helper but now I think Ive been given a sign that its time for her to go. We are working expats and need to make a living. Couldnt afford to take time off to train new helper.


She never gave a reason. I gave son a candy. He said something similar was given by nanny before. Showed me where then I asked her to take it out. Kept the bottle for ref. She said she only gave one time. She apologized only last week and not specifically for that.


Ive cried all day over this whole mess.

I am sorry as I didn't mean it that way. There's no way you could have known prior that she was doing that. I just don't understand why she would even give them in the first place, strange. Also, it sounds like it is a good thing she is gone (although you can't work), it may be a blessing in disguise. Not sure what the labour department would do, sorry I can't be more helpful.

Well maybe Im not as good of of a mother as you are Cara. Ive read many forums where you replied. And some even stated you're a bit cruel. I know you're blunt and all but we are all parents. We do the best we can in our situations. I don't expect you to say anything. In fact, have you heard the expression "dont say anything if you dont have anything nice to say"? Afterall, you are a teacher right? (I could be wrong.)


My son means the world to me. At the time, we couldve lost our home if I hadnt worked. So you dont know the whole situation. Having a home and stability is also important. And he had become attached. Depression is all too common in children these days. I wanted to slowly break the news to him. And not taint his memories. Boys can be more sensitive especially mine. So many lovals fire their helpers and it teaches the kids to treat them like objects, robots. Coming from a place where helpera pretty much dont exist I dont want my son to be spoiled.


I never said her being gone is all bad. Its great! But Ive just been thrown under a bus. Last min help is hard to find (family overseas).


Thanks for your two cents though!

I agree that cara's response was harsh, she tends to be that way. By the looks of it, she has spent the better part of the 21st century on this site and geoexpat and probaly is tired of seeing the same stories. Who knows?


Anyway, the part I don't understand is #7. Your helper knowingly gave your son a pill without your permission? Stop and think about that. That is a criminal offense. The only pill a child should ever be taking are those OK'd by a doctor. That is extremely dangerous and potentially lethal. This helper needs to be reported to the authorities immediately as she poses a threat to any family unfortunate enough to hire her.

If you're unhappy with your helper and have done your level best to improve things, let her go. It is really not worth the hassle to have a helper who is not helping and who is adding worry and work to your life. Let her go. Get a new one. Carry on. There are many fab helpers out there.



cara is blunt, but she gives good advice. She doesn't want to be your best friend. She wants you to do the right thing. You'd do well to listen to her no matter how uncomfortable she makes you feel. You asked for advice and she gave good advice. I'd rather get advice from someone who is honest and blunt than someone who tells me everything is all right when it isn't. Do you want to solve the problem or do you just want to get sympathy? Life is full of hard decisions but we are better off if we make the right ones instead of tooling along with the crap status quo.

Hi axpatguy38,


I wonder if you are Cara's husband? She is blunt, at times rude, thinks she knows it all, do you really think you need to come out to her defense? Just saying this becuase is not the first time you do it.


Back to the subject, Opinion, learn from this experience, even if the next helper doesn't work don't be afraid to fire her until you find the one that meets your family needs.


For future reference, you can always start the process to hire a new helper and once the visa is approved you terminate the existing helper.


That is what I am doing now. My helper has been with us for more than 6 years but I finally got tired of her now that I came back from 4 weeks holidays.


She decided to stay in my house since she said she wanted to take holidays in Dec I said ok, so she stayed doing basically nothing. My husband stayed here but he works long hours and also travels a lot. I tried to call home few times but never answer the phone or mob phone.


I came back last Sat night after 27 hours flight etc. Asked her the next morning what she bought for Sunday dinner she said nothing! So I told her to be back at home 6:00 pm to cook dinner, she gave me the sour look!

She showed up at 6:30 saying she got stuck on traficc jam. Really? from Central to Mid-levels? Then at that time she went to buy the groceries for dinner.

I was jetlag and felt slept the whole afternoon otherwise I would have gone to buy the groceries.

It was 7:30 b4 dinner was ready the kids passed out without eating. I got really mad at her I told her it was very inconsiderate from her that I did not ask her a thing for 4 weeks and she was not even capable to buy food for Sunday she said if you don't like it fire me! So this is what I am doing now.

Cannot do it on the spot since same as you I work but have already some interviews this Sunday and will have to put u\p with the existing helper until the new one has the papers ready.

Wish you luck

FIFIB. cara and I are not married (to each other). The reason I "come to her defense" (not that she needs it) is that she gives what I feel is good advice that I agree with and then is often slammed for being blunt. Not very nice as she is trying to help.


The deterioration in tone on these boards in the past year or two has made me leave them almost completely. Why bother giving advice (which people ask for) if you get grief for it?

Opinion, I will also diagree with what you and others have written about Cara. You have posted to elicit opinions of what you have gone through over the last 4 years and whether it was because you were too nice. Perhaps if you had only wanted 'nice things' posted then you should have put that in your post. I see nothing unreasonable in what Cara has posted and although she is blunt I think she is just cutting straight to the point. Definitely she is not cruel, you just do not like what she has written and perhaps it is a bit too close to the truth to be bearable. In essence you did accept a way substandard helper to look after your family and son because you 'could not afford the time to train a new one' - read and reread this and realise how this doesn't make sense at all, particualrly in light of the inappropriate and outright dangerous way your helper had consistently been behaving. If it was you hanging onto the family home through your work then what about your husband picking up some of the slack in terms of finding and training a helper? That is an excuse because when you look at the macro view of your family, spending 1-2 sundays down at the maid agency to interview and short list and then sign a new helper is not much time at all. Secondly, waiting until the new visa is ready before firing this current one - no brainer. Thirdly, training the helper bit by bit every day, not much time at all.

In terms of your son and his attachment to the helper. I'm not sure that with her around it was the healthiest environment for your son, examples include being told by his mum that when she's around he can't play with his buddies (making him feel like there is something wrong with her = inferior), seeing her sell tickets when she should have been looking after him, feeling the tension in the home as you put up with all your helpers shenanigans. Sometimes as the adult you have to make the hard but right decision. You opted to take the soft option and its majorly come back to bite you in the bottom.

AT the end of the day as Cara puts it we all have to live with the consequences of our decisions. She was a crap and dangerous helper, but in some ways you shoulder a greater portion of the blame because no matter how outrageous her antics you kept her on. She's only left your household because SHE left and not because you fired her! If she hadn't left the morning she did you would have kept on keeping your list of her transgressions and living in your personal hell. Life is harsh but you must shoulder the blame yourself and no it was not because you were too 'nice'. I think you kept her for convenience sake, Christ, if my husband stayed up to talk to the helper until 3am she would be gone and if I resisted it, I probably would have been too!

FIFIB, I thought Axpat could've been Cara's hubby too or lover haha. He's telling a total stranger, me, that it'd be good if I listen to Cara's advice. I think that's a bit too much. Just give your advice and leave it at that. I wouldn't even tell my own friends they should or must listen to my advice. (Sometimes, I think us Expats can be so stuck up and degrading especially the ones in Hong Kong)


Lagrue- I agree with you. But you missed on one point I made. I had to work at that time. No work, no place to live. Paying agency fees, this and that and taking time off training new helper was a no for us. We also have cameras in our home and I felt that it would be okay just for a little longer.


I never said that I don't take the blame for what happened. NO ONE IS PERFECT. And we were going to fire her, btw. We had signed a new helper who is supposed to start in October, but now we need a helper now so we have to let the other one go. Also we talked to her til 3am because she had our documents and wouldn't return them so we then called the police.


Anyway, end of story. All is said and done. Moving on now.

This is the scary thing...I don't think that your helper has gotten all wiley and conniving because of having "been in HK 15 years", I think its because you need her more than she needs you.


This is the seed that takes root in most of the stories relating to "I have been dicked over by the helper"


That said, I feel your pain, the worry that your home was gonna be on shaky ground if both of you didn't work...I get that it would be a toughie to let go of the helper, but it would still have been possible to look into a replacement and let that search run at the same time you kept your helper and to let her go as soon as you found someone.


I agree with someone else here, training a helper is possible one day at a time. Did you work Saturdays as well? At worst, take 3 days off work and run someone through the ins and outs of how to use the washer, dryer, how to clean the sink, bathtub and what they can and can't use what cleaning products on. Expecting them to cook might be too much early doors, so expect there to be teething problems there...but where there is a will, there is a way. There is no good or legit reason to keep someone 4 painful years during which they could have quite seriously harmed your child.


Children get attached to anyone who is around them long enough, I know this, I too had worried about my ex helper and firing her despite how insanely moronic she could be sometimes...but she loved my kid and deep down, she was not a bad or mean person...arrrghh, so I get it, it can happen...but your helper sounds like a right piece of work.


I am sorry you were stuck in that position, but for now, I guess you are in a better place in that she no longer works for you.


Good luck...hmmm, and well...hope it all works out for you. I also hope that financially you guys are in a better place now and this gives you a bit of breathing room to find a better replacement.

Yea she was a piece of work. But she is gone now and the new helper is here. She's been in HK for two years but I have to train her from beginning as she was not really permitted to leave the house before.


I agree that my ex helper knew that we needed her so she thought she could do as she pleased. Just a few days ago she told my husband she wanted to come back. We found out she already has new employer just a few blocks down. So it wont be the last we see her. Now, I need to find a way to explain that to my son :/

Explain it to your son as an adult would explain something to someone that understands that sometimes you don't always get what you want. The sooner you stop pussyfooting around trying to "soften the blow" for your son, well, the more confused you will leave him.


I have never treated my son like a baby, and as he has grown up I know he is far more clued in and he is much more capable of understanding how the world works. Kids are not stupid. They know the world isn't perfect, they know people are not perfect, so to just tell the truth in not so many words as you have told us, that should suffice.


Good luck...and don't feel too bad for your son, if the new helper is good, he will soon have a healthy relationship with her. No one relationship will last forever, its better he learns that early doors, helpers will come and go, Mum and Dad will always be there and thats the one constant for him to depend on.

Actually, I don't find Cara's response to be harsh at all!


If the list of problems is in chronological order, this helper would not have made it so far down the list for me.


To answer OP's question: without a doubt in my mind that you are too nice! But I am glad to see that you've gotten rid of her and hope things are looking up.


Lastly: don't beat yourself on the mothering -- there isn't (usually) much comparison and most mothers love their children unconditionally, but do react differently. I'm sure you're a great mother.

Dare I offer some 'advice'? If your old helper is just a few blocks away from you make sure that she does not have access to your home or your child. Tell the new helper that she is now in charge of your home and child and that this woman is not to have any contact with either.


Go through all the possible excses you can think of that she might use - left papers someplace, cannot find ring - think it might be under sink etc. etc. Your ex-helper sounds like she wants to still be involved with your family (told husband she wanted to come back). I suspect this is because she found you an easy touch and could control her situation.


Your new helper 'was not really permitted to leave the house before' so she may perhaps find it difficult to stand up to the ex-helper. Make sure she completely understands that it is her responsibility to keep your child and your home away from this woman. You will probably need to be very firm.


Good luck

Cara - it is tough giving such honest advice, but as i read the original post, everything you posted is exactly what i was thinking.

Hi


After reading these posts, I never thought this would be my problem too.


I've had my first helper for the past year and its just not working out. For many reasons but my question is this. Is it easy enough to change dismiss her? I've given her one months notice in writing and will pay her airfare at the end of contract. Can I tell the immigration that she is just unsuitable and leave it at that? She is now telling me, in a note, that she is going to contact the labour department but wont elaborate, saying she knows her rights?


We've been demented for the last few months with her and really cant take anymore. Is there anything else I should be doing or someone I should be speaking to like the Labour Department myself or the immigration?


Any advice would be gratefully recieved.

she is there for the month. I thought it would give her time (one month plus two weeks grace) to find another employer. My understanding is that if I paid her off now she would have to leave HK in two weeks. I have always paid her in cash every month so far, now im questioning the wisdom of this. Maybe this is what she will go to the labour department with, that I havent paid her or something. Really cant think of anything else she could possibly say that isnt documented.

Alexandra - "I have always paid her in cash every month so far, now im questioning the wisdom of this. Maybe this is what she will go to the labour department with, that I havent paid her or something."


I presume you did get her to sign a receipt each month when you paid her salary?


Also, if you are so concerned that she is going to go to the labour department with false claims, then I honestly can't see why you would want to keep her in your home for the next month - who knows what she will say/do ... especially after she has had time to chat with her friends. As long as you have a genuine/acceptable reason for terminating her, you have nothing to worry about. But I'd definitely pay her for the next month and everything she's owed (flights home, etc), and let her go straight away ...

From what I've seen and heard, helpers prefer to be paid the month in lieu instead of getting the month's notice and working it out. And they do expect to be asked to leave right away. This is just a guess but perhaps your helper's mutterings of "labour tribunal" is a tactic to sway you into paying her the month's notice. So I would second the suggestion that you should just pay them a month in lieu and ask them to leave right away. This will likely reduce the chances of further trouble down the line.

No receipt for salary. Never entered my mind to be honest. I can see how I've laid myself open. My question is, does she have to go immediately if I pay her in lieu now for the month? Contract ends at end of month and she has two weeks grace before she leaves. Do I pray her accommodation too for 5/6 weeks?

Cara is right. The last time we met with our ex helper we even recorded the conversation which had her admitting she had taken our personal documents and wouldn't return them. Even after that she had the nerve to tell us she is entitled to 14 days' annual leave on top of 7 days' that's required by law. She said extra 14 days is required by law. After 30 min of trying to tell her she's wrong we conference called the Labour Dept. She then backed down.


I believe some helpers will seek wrong advice from their friends, church or even agency.