Posted by
hkdd
17 yrs ago
I am sick and fed up with many of the local helpers (phillipino's) attitude about the their preferred choice of employer. They have to be white expats from the US/Aus/Europe. I have been told by numerous maid agencies they are not willing to work for Indians and will not even attend an interview. I know some some Indians can be demanding employers but we are not all the same. My current maid only got the job because she was willing to work for an Indian but she has whole raft of credit problems which she did not disclose to me when interviewed. Therefore I am trying to recruit someone else and having these problems. I have to go through extra lenghts to be accepted as an employer and find myself having to explain my personal circumstances that I am married to someone white and I am British asian and have totally western views regarding DH's. So you can see I am very fustrated and just wanted to share my experience with no hope in finding someone suitable who is willing to fit into my family.
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Nuri
17 yrs ago
My Indian friend had the same problem :-( She had to hire a girl directly from the Philipinnes. Some of my Japanese friends face the same problem sometimes as the helpers are not confident that they'd be able to cook Japanese food. Cara has mentioned her own experience, too. So do not take it personally :-) Good luck and Happy new year!
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jwm
17 yrs ago
Why do you suppose they feel that way?? I have asked our helper why and have gotten some very candid answers (yes they are general and do NOT apply to all non gwiellos), but most of her comments were the way in which they were treated by each of the respective families. She and a few of her friends felt that the "westerners" treated the helpers much better and were more respectful of who they were and the job that they do. Again, this I know is not representative of all employers who are not westerners, but I am sure some of you will agree that some employers do not treat their helpers properly...
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cbdc
17 yrs ago
a canadian born chinese friend of mine and her husband were surprised when their helper went to canada and they were having troubles getting helpers to come in for interviews.
they eventually asked their helper to write them a "reference letter" in tagalog and faxed it to the employment agency they were working through so that prospective employees could see from a former helpers opinion what sort of a family they were to work for. within hours of faxing through the letter to the agency, they had people lining up wanting to interview.
i hope this helps.
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I think the first post perfectly describes the reason as to why domestic helpers are 'selective' about their employers. Terminating a helper because of credit problems does not seem right as that is a personal issue.
My credit issues have no impact on my Job, and my boss should not care about my personal financial standing, unless it is directly effecting the quality of my work (not showing up, not completing assignments, etc.). The helper does not have to disclose the states of her personal finances to you, and as an employer the only finances of hers that you are entitled to even think about, is the pay check - thats it.
maybe this is why helpers are selective, if i didn't like a company, i wouldn't work there either
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maxis
17 yrs ago
Of course people from particular backgrounds have statistically greater likelihood to behave in particular ways. If that "trait" is one you don't like, then objectively you would veer towards a background having "traits" you like.
In some cultures, having helpers is very common for the more privledged, and the more privledged are more likely to have an ill-founded sense of entitlement, and the helpers are likely to be uneducated and uninformed.
Those with that sense of entitlement often take things for granted, and have never actually had to do the tasks they readily demand from others quite readily, and are used to having people jump to do minor trivial acts
Thus, those people often are unreasonable and overly demanding and quite particular, and do not appreciate how long something may take or how tedious and tricky something may be.
An avergage westerner expat does not have helpers back home, has experience in doing the tasks themselves,and as such, is more likely to know how difficult or tedious a task may be.
Many Filipinos are educated, have more western attitudes, and thus are more likely (statistically!) to gravitate towards that type of employer. Their choice entirely.
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On the contrary scrugby, although you believe that the financial standing of a domestic helper is nothing to do with her employer, think again. If you have a DH with financial problems ... overdue loan payments etc ... you may have the loan company knocking on your door demanding the payments from YOU! As her employer you will be held responsible for her outstanding debts. I experienced this recently, and not from my own helper, but from the helper of the previous tennant where I live. They moved from HK taking their helper with them ... she had outstanding debts, and I had the loan company pestering me for the payments ... they assumed that I was her employer and demanded that I pay the money, I was called a liar (and worse!), and it took some sorting out ... not a pleasant experience!! All I'm saying is beware, because if anyone has a DH with a debt problem, as her employer, you could end up being liable for it ... fact.
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I understand your frustration, but I can see why this happens.
My husband and I have been working in HK for the past 3 months (and plan to work here for a few years). We were both raised in NZ and Australia respectively; my husband is of Malay heritage.
We both work in Hospitality - managing two seperate restaurants. I have to say we have never experienced the levels of rudeness and social dysfunction of people (customers) than we have with the general Indian population in Hong Kong. It is not just the way they treat us personally, it is the way they treat our staff (who are predominatley Nepalese & Filipino)
I like to pride myself of not having a racist attitude (and being Australian, I am sure some people would automatically assume I am) - but now when I see Indian people come through the door, my heart sinks. Of course, I treat everyone the same and it is a delight when they prove me wrong and turn out to be reasonable people - but this so rarely happens. Why is it that the majority of Indians feel they are superior to everyone else? Do they feel that politeness and manners are only for servants to display? Why are their children so incredibly misbehaved?
I have a NZ friend who is a nurse in a private hospital here - they draw straws to see who has to look after the Indian patients (it's THAT bad)
So, as a Westener who serves the general HK population, I completely understand why the DH's avoid Indians - I would too. I know this doesn't help your predicament, but it may help you understand why this happens....
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MayC
17 yrs ago
I can see why helpers prefer to work for expats (or western expats).
Countries like China, HK, India and Malaysia have been using helpers for decades. They've always viewed "helpers" as people who are there to serve them or wait on them. These helpers usually only get a small fraction of their employer's salary so some Asian employers would see them as second class citizens. The helpers know this.
Now with a western employer, things are a little different. There is no such thing as a "domestic helper" in Australia, NZ, Canada or the US. So any help that we get here is paradise and western employers are usually VERY grateful for even the tiny bit of help that they get from their helpers.
As a result, for the same kind of work a helper performs, she'll get more praises and benefits from a "western employer" than a local one. If this is the case, isn't it better to work for someone that shows more appreciation? Sure, Asian employers appreciate their work as well, but the chances of a western employer showing their appreciation is greater than an Asian one.
It's not really racist, it's just a helper trying to find an employer that will treat her with respect. What's wrong with that? We all want that too.
More often that not, western employers are on a high pay package that could mean more salary for them as well.
Everyone's just looking after their own interests. You would too, if you were in their shoes. After all, we all choose our jobs too, right?
Rest assured though, that there are lots of helpers out there who may not want a "western employer" because it usually means short-term employment.
Good luck :-)
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hkdd
17 yrs ago
Just to reiterate I was born and educated in the UK, my views are totally western and I am married to a gweilo. It seems quite sad that a few of the threads yet again seem to have decided to paint all Indians with same brush.
By the way Scruby, I agree with your point that a DH's personal financial standing should not come into account on employment, however it does when the DH who has worked for me less than 6 wks wants a loan in the first month (which I helped her out with) and then the following month asks again for HKD3000 as she now only discloses that she has credit problems. Well then, this does have an impact on me!!!
So, not only do I have a maid not meeting my expectations as an Expat Western employer, I also have to take on her credit issues thats why I have to terminate her!
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-sa
17 yrs ago
hkdd, I feel a little sad that you need to justify your views being totally western. Being Indian is not only dancing to Bollywood numbers and wearing sarees at weddings, I hope. I find it hard to believe that anyone with western thought would automatically treat their servants well. I am Indian, proud to be so. And yes, I agree with views here on the forum when you cringe to see your fellow country people behave the way they do. But like a post pointed out, we (rich or not) have had the culture of growing up with help in some form or the other. There are some of us who have had same loyal, loving helpers for 30years+ and some who mistreat them as if they were animals. And though very protective of my heritage; I am aware how racist India as a country really is. Look at how we judge our own people by our last names(caste), skin color and professions. So, there are historically good reasons for some of these biases to exist among helpers in HK. All we as educated people (not necessarily a westernized perspective) need to do is to make sure that we treat our employees fairly and have respect for what they do.
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Good post -sa. I agree with MayC. We are not used to Helpers and are therfore very grateful for any help. You would all die laughing when I tell you what my wife and I did for our helper in Singapore!
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When I read the title of this post, it bothered me...racist helpers?
I've lived in HK for 19 years now and have a fair amount of experience of the word racist. I would say some cultures are very "strong minded" rather than racist. They have expectations that people who work in a certain type of job have a certain type of behaviour. DH fall into that category. They must be obedient, humble, respectful, hard working and honest. In some cultures, if they fail in any of these areas, life can become very hard for them. This is especially true for families who hire a DH that also has a live in mother or mother in law in addition to children and the employer. An extended living family situation is very common to Chinese and Indian families and most DH dread dealing with the Matriarch. So I suggest that rather than racist, you mind think about "discriminating" In fact, I feel your frustration regarding this type of behavior, but the reality is that the DH is looking for a situation that is best for them, not you. There are many DH who start out with a servant heart, but have been badly treated and become jaded in their approach to employers.
Here are a couple of things I've heard....
Made to sleep in the bathroom, under the table, not allowed to go to bed until everyone else has retired for the night, had things thrown at them for making mistakes, one example is threatening to stab at the face with chopsticks, throwing a dinner knife, experiencing heated domestic disputes including physical fights and trying to keep the children calm. If I experienced these types of things in my work place, I would become a "discriminating" employee knowing that I would be living 24/7 with my employer.
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Everybody here has the point. If you are a good employer, you are more likely an open-minded person. If you are a NOT really good one (of course no one would admit) you know ONLY whats good for you. Well then, an employee. i think has all the right to choose...if they choose to serve western employer, they have reasons of course, why they don't like local chinese? well maybe they had bad experience with their previous jobs. They maybe heard some of their friends who are working with western people and having a better treatment than they have. The bottom line is evrything depends on peoples behaviour. Why not treat your helpers as HELPERS NOT SLAVES .... we should try to differentiate the meaning between helper and slave in that way we can have better relationship with them.
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according to my experience talking to these helpers.....they said that chinese employers let them work almost 24 hours/day, have curfew when they go for day off, the house have to be spotless, and they treat them slaves....you know like they have this kind of disease...but again not all, I also heard a lot of stories about having a good employer, and most of the good chinese employers are the very very very rich ones.....maybe they are so rich that they have so many things in mind that they don't even have time to look at their maid...
And for indians...i don't know but they said they yells a lot, and most of them don't like the food, maybe thats also a reason why they don't want indian employers. I know this helper that I met at my son's school, everytime I see her she always have this scared look all the time...and I asked why and she said I am going back home again later and see my indian employer and the whole day she keeps yelling at me, and I told her why don't you find another employer, she said she have so many debts in Philippines( she used to spend to come here) that she can't go back home unless she can pay all of them.
And white employers are known to be very flexible with their helpers, they pay more above the minimum wage, give lunch break in the middle of the day, they are friendly, generous, and most of all they give a whole 24 hours day off.....thats the things these helpers are looking for. But then as I said not all people are the same. But you can't help these rumors go around at the helper's community because these helper's talk......they share their stories ( thats the way they find comfort)...they talk when they go to market, when they go to the bus station to wait for the kids, and when they get their day off......they talk and rumors are very easy to go around.
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I have this experience last time I was looking a flat for our german friend, we live in South Horizons, and I was looking for a flat here last month and when I went to the Real State Agency, they told me first thing that landlords don't want Indian tenants. I was so surprised....I know there are a lot of Indians here in South Horizons. Thats a story of real racism.
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thats a different story abby78.....but its deffinitely racism.
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i think it's much more better to hear answers from a filipina itself, it's not that we don't like indians, it's just because we find you guys a little bit demanding in terms of work and most of you didn't know or sometimes didn't bother to ask "how is your life back home?, did you also pay to the agency to get to here? how much?, how many kid's you left behind just to work here?" these kind of things that we have endure or surpass and sacrifice ourselves so they can live a normal life and a future of their own. And with a stroke of pen in our employer's hand, somebody's future is gone. I am not saying all indian employer's are bad, some indian are good people too especially this generation it's much better than before. so HKDD, don't be too hard on yourself, if your not one of the indians that we once knew so be it , we filipino's are smart enough to know the difference. thanks
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i think why the fdh is very selective to the employer,because to avoid a non stop working for the whole especially to the indians, as i know if you work to indian family you also work to thier parents,brother or sister and also even in the chinese family mostly fdh they will work at 6 am until 11 pm everyday. i am also very happy if i can get a expat employer someday because they have a very good hearts and very understanding. thanks
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Yes, have to say I do understand some helpers' reluctance to work for particular nationalities - my helper's niece worked for a family, she had to sleep on the sofa, couldn't go to bed until the family did at around 2 or 3 am, had to get up at 6, got given 8 hours off on Sunday, was underpaid and yet, bizarrely, even after being hospitalized for exhaustion, she still said that her employers were 'good people', just the work was a bit too much for her...
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