helper asking so much all the time AGAIN

Posted: Mon Jun 12, 2006 7:49 pm Post subject: whinge about helper


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i'm sorry but i have to get it off my chest. try to be as precise as possible. from what i understand from the labour dept, helpers are allowed 7 days after completing each year of work. therefore for a 2 yr contract, they are entitled to 14 working days, the first 7 to be given after the first year is completed.


we were nice to our helper (even though there were so many things that had annoyed us with her habits and money borrowing)and allowed her a 14 day holiday back home in one go, before her 1 year was up. we were away for almost a month so thought that we'd allow her to take all 14 days and she had said there is nothing about waiting til the end of the first year to give a week.


in fact, she took a total of 17working days. we had asked if she was sure she wanted to take all her holiday in one go as there will be 1.5 years that she would be without any holiday. she said that is fine. now, 1 month after we have arrived back. she has said seeing as we will plan to be away in sept or oct, and if she can afford a ticket home. can she go.


i basically just said to her that Sir will not be happy as she has already exceeded the amount due her at the END of 2 years let alone hving it before 1 yr is up.


if you were in my shoes, what would you do? it is evident to me that she will continue to try to get more holiday or more advantages to her.


i'm not even angry anymore as i know she is like this and have just told myself not to waste energy being mad.



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to make a long story short:


i called the labour dept about DH holidays and have been told that AFTER the completion of 1 yr, they are entitled to 7 days leave.


my helper asked for holiday from easter sunday and seeing as we were going to be away for a while, she asked to take all her 2 weeks holiday in one go. at the time, it was silly for us to take her word for it, but when we said we thought that we need not give her leave until after she finished 1 year of her contract. she had only completed 8.5 months prior to her holiday. she said (we didn't check with the labour dept until after she had come back) that it is not true that we have to wait til the end of the first year, so we decided to let her take it. partially through our being unable to be strict and try to discipline habits that we did not want in our household, or slackness... things had gotten worse over the 8months, with money borrowing, asking for advances, days off, not being smart about things ie leaving stove on, locking us in (we cannot unlock door from inside) and numerous other things.


now only 1month and 1week after her return, she brought up our plans to go away in sept or oct, and asked if she could go away. i did state that she had already take all her holiday, in fact more then her entitlement of 14 days, and that in fact, we did not have to give her 7 days leave until she had finished the first year. i'm not sure she really thought i was angry, but i have come to the point where i do not want to waste my energy getting mad over things she does or says, otherwise i'd be miserable every day ever second.



she sleeps earlier then i, wakes later then i most times and she has such an easy job really, doing only the cooking and cleaning while i take care of my baby.


i guess, after all these posts and getting it off my chest, i really need to do something about it, but i just don't know where to start looking!


can anyone pass any references?


thanks!

Fire her.



And learn that doormats get walked on.

Sorry to hear about your pain, but you need to let her go!

I once had a helper with the same situations.

she always asked for advance (every month) and after working for us about 7 months she wanted to go home to see her sick mother. We let her go home, bought her plane ticket gave her 2 weeks holiday with pay and at later date I found out that she went home for a wedding!

She always pretend not to understand anything, her only job is to clean the house and ironing, groceries shopping only once a week (bread, milk and eggs)becasue I bought all my groceries before coming home and she never once cooked for me or my husband (I prefer to cook myself) so her only time of work is from 10am to 12pm and she will go to her room sleeping till god knows how... the only time she's out of her room is when I'm home around 7pm. She will clean after I cooked and when to her roon again at 9pm. I gave her every other Saturday off plus her weekly sunday off. So she gets extra day off every 2 weeks, and she's complaning too much work! I don't think she's over work becasue we don't have kids, no cooking and very good working hours. We finally decided that she has to go as it cost too much pain for me talking to her all the time about her advance salary.

She even bang the table once because I will loan her anymore and she later slam the door at me!

When terminated her she beg us to let her go but our decision is final so I gave her another plane ticket plus 1 month salary and her vacation as we don't want her anymore in our house!!

So I hope this helps and you can decide what to do. It's very painful to live with someone who cause too much pain in teh family si I think you are better off letting her go.

Good luck!

She eats what we eat (salmon, alsakan king crab, imported food from Europe and the US)she even finish up all my alaskan king crab in 1 sitting (cost 1200 hkd) so I told if she does that again I will never let her eat the king crab anymore!

Off-cousre she's not happy with me and walked away woth out even clean the table. 2 months before we let her go she wanted to got o Japan to see her sister (married to Japanesse)and she wanted us to sponser her to stay in Japan and pay her airfare and give her 1 month holiday time so she can enjoy her stay with her sister. When told her we are not going to do that she went off to my next and complained to the other maid how bad me and my husband treated her! She even told every maid in the area that she we are bad people. Soon after we let her go my husband changed the lock!

Burgundy is quite right - doormats do get walked on. Why is it that we cannot treat out domestic helper employees in a kind and generous manner without getting walked all over, taken advantage of, them doing less and less work, making less and less effort, walking around with a sour face most of the time, lying and generally acting in a very hard done by manner. Why are they not able to show the same kindness and generosity in return and just do the job they were employed to do, and left their families behind to do, without all the baggage. Why are they unable to treat people the way they would like to be treated themselves? It seems the more you give, the more they take - and some. I will never understand this attitude. Sure, not all domestic helpers are like this, but having read through many many threads on this site, it seems the majority are. Please - can someone explain this to me!

autumn, I would be very offended if you did not invite me over for dinner the next time you have Alaskan King Crab on the menu. I promise to leave you one claw :)

Mrs A - if you have ever visited the Philipines you will understand why all the why's - I have visited the Philipines twice before I had much to do with the Filipina people in HK - the people were lovely, however I always felt that while they were smiling and being kind to you they would quite easily take the clothes you were wearing off you and anything else you possesed....it was an interesting feeling of not being able to trust a fellow human being. There were a few people I met who I was able to trust - but they rip each other off all the time - the taxi's, the sales people, and lending and borrowing money - it has to do with how the government has led the people over so many years - they set the example of corruption and taking people for a ride..so what can be expected really - they do it to each other and have no compunction about it or feel guilty - so why should they when dealing with you - a rich person who has plenty (in their eyes). It is a cultural thing of basic work ethic, integrity, and honesty that is missing due to a very sad political history - in not only the Philipines but also other asian countries. The current generation of young people are also growing up without the guidance of their mothers while they work overseas....


This does not give them permssion - it just explains it.

What dimac4 said makes perfect sense. I have always had respect for the helpers who make such huge sacrifices to support their families, given their limited opportunities at home due to their ineffective governments. What I have never been able to understand is why, having made such a sacrifice, they do not work hard to 'get it over and done with' and get home with their money ASAP. As Dimac4 says, if they have been brought up led by people who have succeeeded due to such a lack of integrity, why would they believe that their success should come through hard work. We must look obscenely wealthy to many people and they may well feel 'entitled' to play the game by taking advantage of relatively generous employers. That said, there are plenty of honest helpers out there with heaps of integrity, you just have to find one of them.


Back to your situation divalicious, it sounds as if you have been having a horrid time and that you've been more than patient. If I were you, I'd take Burgundy's advice. It does not sound as if there is any going back from where you are. When you find a new helper, be a bit more businesslike about things, put everything (holidays, pay, advances etc) in writing. Be clear about your expectations. I used to pay my helper without even asking her to sign to say that she had received the money, not a mistake that I will ever make again.

if any of you know of someone who you could recommend, would you PM me pls?


thanks all for your sound words of advice. i hope to not make the same mistake twice. i am starting to look to interview and will try to tolerate while i can. once i have found someone i shall do what needs to be done.


thks agn

tsuiwah, we had our king crab last 3 days but will keep you in mind the next time we buy.

Our first helper tried all the same tricks that you read about here, our second helper is a joy. She has not once asked me for anything I felt even slightly uncomfortable about (she did ask for her salary a week early last month, but said it was absolutely no problem if I didn't want to do it - I had made this clear at the start, but seeing as how good she is I was happy to oblige). Her cleaning is pretty shoddy, her organisational skills are weak, but our son loves her and we find her a pleasure to have in the house. She doesn't have too arduous a job, I think, but when we ask her to do things at short notice - babysitting late on a Saturday night for example, she smiles and says no problem. None of this eye-rolling that I would get before. I understand that we may have just lucked out, but by the way she is Sri Lankan, while our first helper was Filipina.

Sorry, double post...

geiboyi did you find her through an agency?

To divalicious, your helpers attitude leaves a lot to be desired. But re the annual leave, they are entitled to 7 days paid leave per year of contract but that doesn't mean they can't take other leave unpaid. My helper normally takes 3 weeks a year, 2 unpaid and pays her own ticket. If you're away in the autumn and don't really need her at home, i.e to look after a pet or something there's no reason she couldn't go back if she pays her own way. But I would still look for a new one as her attitude is so bad, and if its got to the point where all your conversations revolve around your helper its definately time to let go. Mrs miggins is right, treat your helper fairly but don't treat them as a friend. Don't have them eat with you, or sit and watch television, go on days out etc. They are there to take the housework off your hands, and babysitting, to help make your life easier not cause more problems.

i think i have been more then fair with my helper. i gave some great lai see for xmas and chinese new year. i'v given xmas gifts so she was like part of the family. and i know that if i suggest that should she want to go away she'd take it, unless i said it's unpaid leave. i know what she is like. i know they are entitled to 7 days per 1 year. she has taken 17days and has not worked a full year yet with us. her work leaves a lot to be desired.


in anycase, i feel that our relationship as worker end employer has broken down to such an extent now, that it is beyond repair. i am chking with friends if there are any friends of their helpers that they would rcommend. i'd rather not find one off asiaxpat as i'v been told that most have been here a long time and are looking for expat employment for whatever reason. in any case i'v been advised agst it.


geiboyi - can i ask, you prefer non filipina then?

Gosh, you sound like you're having a hard time. I definitely know how you feel!


If you want to replace your current DH, I would suggest you allow about 3 months to be on the safe side. A good way of doing it if you're going away might be to terminate your present DH on the day before your departure and have the incoming DH arrive on the day of your return.


About your present DH always wanting vacation time - does she have a baby she's left behind in the Philippines? That might explain a lot. But of course she has no right to expect & demand paid vacation time above her entitlements.


For me, I travel quite a bit and if no-one's at home I either send my DH to a boarding house or back to the Philippines. All the vacation time is paid because this is about me not needing her services temporarily. However, my household is a busy one and she works very hard between vacations, so I tell her it's a case of swings and roundabouts.


It sounds like your case is very different, your DH not working hard and giving you grief. I'd say replace her before it gets unbearable.


With your new DH, make it clear what holidays she can expect. If you are able to offer extra paid holiday time you may wish to use that as an incentive to motivate her to perform extra well. After all, for most helpers, there's nothing like the promise of a trip back home and if you pay for her ticket she'll probably love you forever!

I don't think I can say (here)that I prefer one nationality over another - we needed a Sri Lankan helper specifically for language reasons, and it has worked out very well so far. Our first helper was from the Philippines and was a right pain. Might have just been bad/good luck...


We found our helper from this site - basically called every Sri Lankan helper, loads wanted live-out/part-time, so we only interviewed 3, one was scarily good, one was in the middle of a labour dispute that I didn't want to become embroiled in, and the third was the one we employed. We made it clear at the start that we were paying minimum wage, and all has been running smoothly.

Mrs Miggins and geiboyi - can I ask if employing a Sri Lankan helper has any difference in cost to you? i.e are the return flights home significantly more expensive, or are there any other costs that differ from hiring a Filipina? I must say from reading the posts on this site, it seems that culturally hiring a Sri Lankan might make things a bit easier.

Miffy


I don't think there's any difference whichever nationality you hire. It all depends on luck. I also hire a Sri Lankan maid and she gives nothing but grief lately. She started off well but then after several months the lying and slacking off began to creep in. She had recently been caught stealing which at first she admitted but then refused to acknowledge when issued a warning letter. We sent our maid back home in March and a return flight was just over $3K all inclusive.

I think it depends on a certain amount of skill on the part of the employer when recruiting and also luck. My friends have this really fab Indonesian, so I tried an Indonesian about a year ago and the one I got was so awful I can't even express it in words.

this is my first time hiring DH and i interviewed so many phils from this site. just when i thought i have chosen the right one she disappeared after signing the contract. my guess, she has a better offer elsewhere adn didn't bother to tell me. this gives me very bad impression of phils. friends adviced me to try indonesian and i did. she is such a blessing to our family. she is hardworking, never question me in what i tell her to do and very easy going. by the way, i got her from an agent instead of these free sites. i feel that indonesians are more hardworking and less crafty than phils, but then it's just my opinion. problem is that their english is not very good, therefore they are not so popular among english speaking family.

It's interesting: what dimac4 says about Filipina's bascially describes how I, as a westerner, feel about Hong Kongers - they are smiling and kind (not always, obviously, but certainly when you are in their store looking like you might buy something) - but you feel like they would rob you blind given a chance. Seven years here has basically confirmed this is true in many cases. I am wondering if this has less to do with culture and more to do with a general attitude people take towards those they see as obscenely wealthy and powerful. I don't think the attitude is unique to domestic helpers. Most people I know (unless they have very interesting jobs) try to get as much out of their employers as possible while doing as little work as they can get away with. I think it's just human nature.

Yes, but the loyalty required of employees differs from industry to industry. For example my hubby is a banker, at the place he works they're all in it for money and they would switch firms if a better offer came along. On the other hand, I was in teaching until very recently and the culture was very different. Every one did WAY WAY more than they were paid to do and people would stay in the same school / profession for a long time.


As for helpers, I think it's more like teaching in that at least I hope my helper will be loyal to my family. I don't want to switch helpers frequently, troublesome for me and bad for my kiddies. Whilst she is an employee, she is also valued and respected by us.


Loyalty is rewarded in that so long as she works well, we will not terminate her. There are plenty of people who terminate their DH after 4 years in order to avoid paying the long-service payment. But there are also plenty of people who've had the same DH for 10, 15 even 20 years. They retain their DH after the kids are grown up because she's been with the family so long and done so much for them.