Posted by
nirizawa
20 yrs ago
Anyone out there care to debate childhood vaccinations? For or against, and why?
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@@
20 yrs ago
If you do a search you should find this has been debated before and hopefully get the answers you are looking for.
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Yes, I have already done a lot of research and am now waffling more than ever. I don't know why I am torturing myself--the more I read the more indecisive I become. I'm afraid it's the 'damned if I do' situation...
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Please don't call me selfish for trying to educate myself and get a different opinion. Afterall, I'm a person, not a sheep. It's just a tad frightening to see some of the info. out there is all. Also, if you do the research you would find that many who contract these infectious diseases have been immunized. I'm finding that many medical personnel can't seem to face the vaccination issue head on. And why do they call shots 'immunizations' when they are not guaranteed to boost the immune system? Ugh.
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Get them immunised. In the west, you MIGHT be able to rely on everyone else being immunised (not as much as you used to) but as soon as your kids travel (holiday in Thailand, mainland, backpacking trip to India as uni students) they will come across unimmunised people... and can be left infertile (measles), with a deformed child if pregnant (rubella), crippled (polio), brain damaged or dead (measles). The following is an excerpt from the Victorian department of Human Services (Australia), which has a Better Health Channel. There is a lot more info there if you do a search. www.dhs.vic.gov.au
The Australian Bureau of Statistics reported that only 53 per cent of Australian children aged three months to six years were fully immunised in 1995. Declining immunisation rates has led to the revival of some serious childhood illnesses, such as pertussis (whooping cough). Less than 350 Australians contracted pertussis in 1991, but cases now number around 4,000 per year.
Vaccine safety
Vaccines are safe and efficient ways to prevent the spread of many communicable diseases. Every vaccine used in Australia was thoroughly tested for safety and effectiveness, passed for use by the Therapeutic Goods Administration, and subject to ongoing monitoring and evaluation. However, vaccines are like any other medication - they may trigger side effects. This is why parents are generally advised to remain at the clinic for at least 15 minutes after their children are immunised. In the majority of cases, side effects are mild.
Autism, sudden infant death syndrome (SIDS) and diabetes
Some researchers have proposed that vaccinations can cause certain disorders, such as autism and diabetes, or else contribute to the risk of sudden infant death syndrome (SIDS). These theories have since been investigated and dismissed. Immunisation reactions are generally mild and resolve by themselves without needing medical treatment. Reactions may include fever and soreness at the injection site. Serious immunisation reactions are exceptionally rare.
The risk of childhood diseases
Parents who are fearful of autism or SIDS may choose not to have their children vaccinated. If vaccination levels fall too low, disease epidemics can flourish. Since most people have little first hand experience of childhood infectious disease, they underestimate the effects and complications. Childhood diseases such as measles and whooping cough are serious and potentially fatal. The risk of complications from disease is much higher than the risks of immunisation. For example, some parents are worried that the Measles Mumps Rubella vaccine can cause brain inflammation (encephalitis). The risk is around one in 1,000,000. However, one in every 2,000 children who catch measles will experience encephalitis. Of these, 10 per cent will die and 40 per cent will be permanently brain damaged.
The effectiveness of vaccination
Some parents don't have their children immunised because they believe that vaccines don't work. It is true that some people still catch a disease even though they have been vaccinated against it. No vaccine can offer complete immunity against disease for everyone, but effectiveness rates are high:
Diphtheria - out of 100 vaccinated people, 84 will be completely immune.
Haemophilus influenzae type b (Hib) - out of 100 vaccinated people, 95 will be completely immune.
Measles - out of 100 vaccinated people, 95 will be completely immune.
Pertussis - out of 100 vaccinated people, more than 80 will be completely immune.
Polio - out of 100 vaccinated people, 95 will be completely immune.
Meningococcal C - out of 100 vaccinated people, 96 to 98 will be completely immune.
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@@
20 yrs ago
I support vaccinations as a rule and as soon as I get my act together I will get my kids up to date!
I have a somewhat biased opinion since my father worked in an infectious diseases hospital during the 50's and was also infected with polio as a child in the early 1930's.
While I would say there is a valid arguement against some of vaccinations there are those which I believe are vital, TB, polio, DTP.
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Ed
14 yrs ago
Report: Study tying vaccine to autism was fraud
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/40930256/ns/health-mental_health/
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Puti
14 yrs ago
I am mother to 2 boys - my eldest with Autism and my neuro-typical youngest. Both are fully vaccinated. While the eldest was vaccinated to schedule my youngest was not.
The difference - my eldest showed signs - small but significant - that all was not as it should be from about 8 months. Being our eldest, we thought everything he did was fantastic. Sadly - although bright and amazing he is autistic.
We did the MMR at 15 months, and he regressed. But - I also know that with or without the vaccination he would have done that anyway. But - I still have a guilt feeling about the MMR and that I did this.
I was hesitant to vaccinate my second boy. Our marital compromise was to find a fantastic GP and vaccinate our youngest, and finish vaccinating our eldest according to a carefully devised schedule that made me comfortable. We blood tested, so any booster shots that were not needed were not given eg, my eldest first MMR took, so he did not need the second.
Upshot - our kids are fully vaccinated - thank goodness. While I will always have doubts - my eldest was vaccinated with his first MMR, just as the Andrew Wakefield original findings hit the headlines. I know that vaccinations are best - I know the alternatives are worse, I know that many smart folk work really hard to keep these diseases away from our kids, I also know that I need to sleep at night.
Upshot - my kids are fully vaccinated, but on a schedule my doctor and I found comfortable.
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Ed
14 yrs ago
Anti-Vaccine Doctor Planned To Profit from Scare
http://news.discovery.com/human/anti-vaccine-doctor-planned-to-profit-from-scare.html
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LAH
14 yrs ago
"Deer reveals how Wakefield met with medical school managers to discuss joint business deals even while the first child to be fully investigated in his research was still in the hospital. Wakefield planned to make a fortune developing his own supposedly safer vaccines and diagnostic testing kits once the public's confidence in the safety of current vaccines was shaken"
What is the problem? Why is it an issue if he stood to make a "fortune" from developing somehthing "supposedly" safer. If he was allarmed enough to think this plan out (honestly) what harm would have it made? He only would have made a fortune if it was research based and was able to prove to be safer. I bet Hannah Polers parents (the child in the U.S.A just awarded 1.5million for vaccine injury) would have loved someone like Dr. Wakefield to have researched diagnostic kits further.
Instead, who IS making the fortune? & who stood to lose a fortune if Wakefield was able to continue his work?
No family chooses autism for their child.
I have a vaccine injured son and come hell and high water NO ONE will tell me that it is a result of anything else. The injuries are mild to severe, sometimes many parents do not even assosiate the excema, the irritable bowel, the "isms" a child experiences as an injury and those who do are "grasping at straws" in the minority and damned because somewhere deep down they choose to ask questions of the establishment and research a little further than what is presented in the press.
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Of course vaccines have side effects. This is well known. However the side effects for a small proportion of people are nothing compared to the massive deaths caused by typhus, measles (still one of the top 5 causes of child death worldwide) smallpox and so forth. Vaccines have risks but it's that or epidemics that used to kill every 5-6 kids before they reach the age of 10.
"Why is it an issue if he stood to make a "fortune" from developing somehthing "supposedly" safer."
Because it is a clear conflict of interest. It was in his interest to make the existing vaccines seem less safe. That research will always be tainted and thus cannot be trusted.
"No family chooses autism for their child."
Of course not, but since there's no evidence that MMR causes autism it's a moot point.
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Z
14 yrs ago
I'm sorry, but when you say
"I have a vaccine injured son and come hell and high water NO ONE will tell me that it is a result of anything else."
do you really mean that even though the one study that seemed to show that vaccines cause autism has turned out to be based on not just cherry-picked but also FALSIFIED DATA, you will still choose to believe it, regardless of the huge heaping pile of evidence to the contrary?
I feel ill. Your poor kid.
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LAH
14 yrs ago
Z - stop feeling ill and stop being so offensive.
My son was vaccine injured, here in Hong Kong as the paediatrician gave the wrong dose at the wrong time and did not bother to check what she was administering to my son (I feel ill everyday that it happened right before my eyes). I never stated my son had autisim. The paediatricaians were so concerned at the time and the effect is very evident.
My original "mute" post was in response to the article and I was merely bringing another thought to the disussion. Conflict of interest - sure, you could certainly look at it that way. Unfortunately the original title read vaccine pros and cons and I guess a new thread should have been started to discuss the BMJ article and what it means.
But being personally attacked by someone not knowing my story is so offensive it leaves the purpose of this forum up for another discussion all together. I won't steep to that level.
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LAH
14 yrs ago
Oh and just before I bail out,let me correct something.
I mentioned originally that "no family chooses autism" I guess that may have led to asiaxpatguy38 and Z assuming that my son had autism. I also guess that I should not have used the general term of Autism and rather used "spectrum disorder" as it clearly caused confusion. Anyways best not to question anything, look what happened to that poor Wakefield bloke!
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Z
14 yrs ago
Yes, I did read your post to mean that your kid had autism, sorry for the misunderstanding.
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Let's not forget:
5) Directly or indirectly caused thousands of kids to get dangerous diseases that are easily preventable.
"I mentioned originally that "no family chooses autism" I guess that may have led to asiaxpatguy38 and Z assuming that my son had autism. "
For the record, I never assumed that.
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Nirizawa: There is no valid scientific debate.
It's basically the entire legitimate medical community vs the discredited Andrew Wakefield and, um, Jenny McCarthy.
There is no link between vaccines and autism. None.
There are however, a nice slew of people dying or suffering complications from vaccine preventable illnessness:
http://www.jennymccarthybodycount.com/Jenny_McCarthy_Body_Count/Home.html
http://www.danamccaffery.com/
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Wakefield's research on the MMR vaccine has been replicated on a number of occasions and he is now demanding an apology.
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Care to share your sources Christeve?
As Tehanu so eloquently put it: "It's basically the entire legitimate medical community vs the discredited Andrew Wakefield and, um, Jenny McCarthy."
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Today, the International Medical Council on Vaccination (www.VaccinationCouncil.org) has released, exclusively through NaturalNews.com, a groundbreaking document containing the signatures of over 80 family physicians, brain surgeons and professors of pathology, chemistry and immunity, all of which have signed on to a document stating, on the record, that vaccines pose a significant risk of harm to the health of children and that there is no real science backing the "vaccine mythology" which claims that vaccines are somehow good for children.
Learn more: http://www.naturalnews.com/031173_vaccines_science.html#ixzz1CinrP5f8
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Dr Wakefield states
"I stand by the Lancet paper's methodology and the results which call for more research into whether environmental triggers cause gastrointestinal disease and developmental regression in children. In fact, despite media reports to the contrary, the results of my research have been duplicated in five other countries (to see citations to studies, visit http://tinyurl.com/4hrdt5y.)
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So 80 physicians versus the other hundreds of thousands. On a website full of pseudoscience. Note especially the so called anti-flu remedy book.
Here's a simple question: If vaccines are ineffective, how did polio and smallpox practically disappear from modern society?
I'll take my chances with vaccines.
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Axptguy38 .......
"Here's a simple question: If vaccines are ineffective, how did polio and smallpox practically disappear from modern society?"
Those diseases, and others, disappeared as a result of clean water, clean/nutritious food, sanitation, and hygiene. The proof of this can be seen in the following graphs of the official deaths recorded for the Commonwealth of Australia. As you can see, the major portion of the decline in death rates from infectious diseases had occurred BEFORE the introduction of vaccination. But yet, vaccination erroneously gets the credit for the decline and disappearance.
Please note that typhoid fever and scarlet fever -- of which there are no vaccinations -- has been eradicated WITHOUT the use of vaccinations.
http://www.vaclib.org/sites/debate/web1.html
It's time to stop believing the lie that "vaccines saved/saves humanity".
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- Scarlet fever is not eradicated. Kids still get it all the time.
- There is a vaccine against typhoid.
Certainly sanitation and so forth played a role. But it is not the only explanation for the decrease in mortality.
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"Scarlet fever is not eradicated. Kids still get it all the time."
True. I should have more accurately written the following ......
Please note that deaths from typhoid fever and scarlet fever have been practically eradicated WITHOUT the use of vaccinations.
" There is a vaccine against typhoid."
Again true. But since that vaccine is not in widespread use, the practically eradication of deaths due to thypoid cannot be credited to the typhoid vaccine.
"Certainly sanitation and so forth played a role. But it is not the only explanation for the decrease in mortality."
Since the lion's share of the decrease in mortality had occurred around 1940 for whooping cough & diphtheria, around 1956 for polio, and around 1970 for measles, what other factor(s) contributed, in your view, to the obviously downward trending mortality graph?
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Obviously it is a personal choice whether or not to vacinate your child, but I think it is important to bare in mind what is written below.
Most, if not all Peditricians in Hong Kong would recommend you to vacinate your child in the set vaciantions as set at by W.H.O. Naturally they believe this is in the best interest of any child. These Dr's are also the ones you would run to and expect to treat your child if they became sick with any of the illnesses they recommend you to try and prevent. In these circumanstances you would totally trust their judgement in treating your child, so why would you not trust their judgement in their recommendation in vaccinating your child?
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I can remember children in my class at school dying from infectious diseases, a little girl I used to play with in our street died from polio when we were both 10.
That world has gone now; at least it had gone but as more people who can’t remember child mortality being much more frequent choose not to take part in what has been a fantastically successful worldwide immunization campaign for their own selfish reasons or from misguided fears propagated by scaremongers, we may live to see in return not only in the undeveloped world but everywhere. My kids and all my family are fully protected, note the word PROTECTED. Will you protect your kids and in doing so help protect the rest of society or not?
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UK1971 ....
"Most, if not all Pediatricians in Hong Kong would recommend you to vaccinate your child in the set vaccinations as set at by W.H.O. Naturally they believe this is in the best interest of any child."
Despite what you may want to believe, the drug/medical cartel is not organized to heal and to cure disease. Instead, it is a commercial venture organized to make money for its practioners ( http://www.newswithviews.com/health_care/health_care4.htm ). Money for the cartel, not concern for your health, are the forces motivating the decisions of this cartel (but can't that be said for all cartels?). Once you grasp that concept, you will then be able understand the seemingly bizarre reactions by the "medical profession" in the example I will use to illustrate my point.
The following broadcast, aired on New Zealand television, documents the story of a man with swine flu who came back from death's door due to the administration of mega-dosages of vitamin c. Look at how the "medical profession" reacted to this situation ....
http://www.3news.co.nz/Living-Proof/tabid/371/articleID/171328/Default.aspx
"These Dr's are also the ones you would run to and expect to treat your child if they became sick with any of the illnesses they recommend you to try and prevent. In these circumanstances you would totally trust their judgment in treating your child, so why would you not trust their judgment in their recommendation in vaccinating your child?"
What do you think the family in the above broadcast has to say about "totally trusting in the judgment of their doctors?" Understand one thing: YOU are responsible for the health of you and yours. You have a brain, you have common sense, don't be afraid to use it. Educate yourself. Get on the internet and do research. Ask questions and draw your own conclusions. Don't be buffaloed by someone in a white coat with letters behind their name. Does the fact that people are maimed and killed taking vaccinations raise any red flags with you? It should. Does that not motivate you to research if there are safer, cheaper, more effective alternatives to vaccinations?
cowleyp .....
".... what has been a fantastically successful worldwide immunization campaign ..."
Would you be kind enough to provide some statics about that "fantastically successful worldwide immunization campaign"? I would venture to say that whatever disease conquring success story you attribute to immunization, I can come up with a proven, cheaper, safer, more effective, alternative to that success story. For example, let's use your polio choice:
Aside from the fact that deaths from polio were clearly on the way to being eradicated when the polio vaccine was introduced around 1956 http://www.vaclib.org/sites/debate/web1.html, were you aware that polio could have been easily prevented by a simple change in diet? http://www.mercola.com/article/sugar/polio_sugar.aspx (This is on Mercola's site and you may have to register to see this article. Please do so.)
And even if someone did manage to get polio were you aware that the disease could have easily been cured with mega-dosages of vitamin C? http://www.whale.to/vaccine/polio.html .
Now, on the down side of things regarding your beloved vaccinations:
Are you aware there are instances of people actually getting polio as a result of taking the polio vaccine?http://news.change.org/stories/the-polio-vaccine-is-causing-polio-oops
http://www.conspiracyplanet.com/channel.cfm?channelid=47&contentid=7773
And are you aware that the polio vaccine is causing cancers?.... http://lifeabundantly-alim.blogspot.com/2011/02/polio-vaccine-causes-cancer.html
So in view of the fact that polio can easily be prevented with diet, or, cured with mega-dosages of vitamin c, and using these protocols does not expose one to getting polio or cancers as a result of the vaccine, don't you think you should re-evaluate your love affair with vaccinations?
".... we may live to see it return not only in the undeveloped world but everywhere."
Knowing that polio can be prevented with diet, and, cured with mega-dosages of vitamin c, why should there be a return of it?
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cara .....
"... you tell us to go 'get educated' implying that because we do not agree with you or your views, we are somehow brainwashed by the "medical cartels" and must therefore be 're-educated' until we all agree with you."
Wow! And to think you were able to divine an construct all that merely from me telling UK1971 to 'get educated'. Such an impressive display of reasoning and deductive abilities (NOT). If I say "good morning cara", will you just as unaccurately divine and construct what the color of my eyes are, what I had for breakfast, or how I feel about the price of tea in china?
Since it is you who now mentiones the word 'brainwash', I have to agree it is quite the appropriate word. I must've missed it the first time, so explain to me again how you were not brainwashed into making your polio decision. Explain again that it was only logical, sound, and well researched analysis -- not brainwashing - which persuaded you to choose option #1 rather than option #2 ..
Option #1 .... the medical cartel's polio vaccination -
- it's dangerous
- it's expensive
- it's not effective
- it can cause cancer
- it can cause polio
- it can spread polio to others
- it can deliver other illnesses
vs
Option #2 ...... no polio vaccination -
- if diet can prevent polio, why take a polio vaccination to "prevent" polio?
- if megadosages of vitamin c can CURE polio, why be worried about catching polio?
Yep, no doubt about it. Option #1 is a much superior choice than option #2. No brainwashing needed to make that decision.
"I HAVE done what i consider to be research."
Good for you.
"I HAVE made the decision to have my kids vaccinated."
Good for you.
"why do YOU have a problem with that?"
What makes you think I have a problem with what you do to your kids?
What I have a problem with -- and it's a major problem -- is that you pro-vaccination people pass your propaganda and lies off as if it were facts and truth. Here's some examples of that from this thread:
"fantastically successful worldwide immunization campaign"
"If vaccines are ineffective, how did polio and smallpox practically disappear from modern society?"
"Directly or indirectly caused thousands of kids to get dangerous diseases that are easily preventable."
"Vaccines have risks but it's that or epidemics that used to kill every 5-6 kids before they reach the age of 10."
"I know that vaccinations are best - I know the alternatives are worse."
"If everybody decided not to have vaccinations and immunisations then we would have epidemics and pandemics which would result in the death of millions."
There are people who read these posts, like nirizawa, looking for information to help them make an informed decision on to vaccinate, or, not vaccinate. Letting the lies of the pro-vaccinate go unchallenged is, in effect, mis-leading her and anyone else seeking facts and truth. By challenging that pro-vaccinate nonsense I'm doing my part to dispell the lies and mis-information you all present.
"why do you continue to blast us with 'educational' blather that many of us consider to be scaremongering and non-educational?"
Scaremongering? That's a laugh! Whose doing the scaremongering here? --- From a pro-vaccinate person on this thread: "(if you don't vaccinate) we may live to see it return (polio) not only in the undeveloped world but everywhere." Exyogi: Polio can be prevented by diet, or, cured with mega-dosages of vitamin c. I ask again, who'se doing the scaremongering?
"do you honestly think you will change our minds?"
Not interested in changing minds. I'm interested in presenting facts and truth so that anyone looking to make decisions about vaccination are more informed to make that decision. I don't pass judgement on whatever the decison is. Why is that so hard for you to understand?
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cara .....
"you ONLY contribute to threads about vaccinations/vaccines..."
After having been injured by a vaccination at age 24 years old (temporarily paralyzed), and, somewhat recently denied employment for refusing to take one, l'll just say that that subject is most dear to my heart.
Please inform me what other threads I must contribute to ..... to meet your approval.
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I am new to the thread.... and dont post on anything except what I feel very strongly about. My neighbor back in the USA has 2 daughters with autism. Both of whom regressed after significant fevers post receiving the MMR vaccine. The US government and several drug companies have proposed a settlement of 6 million USD to this family.... They are one of many many families that have been given monies for this same reason. Now, do you think the United States Of America/ the FDA would chose to give million of dollars out if they do not have reason to feel some what responsible for administering a vaccine that is the cause of this?!?!?!? There is much research and studies proving things that the Drug companies wish to "keep in the closet".... Its the golden rule, "who ever has the gold makes the rules". There is too much at risk for negative research to come out on these vaccines making zillions of dollar. People need to open their eyes and use their brains... and stop believing everything that their doctors or media spoonfeeds them.
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Vaccines have side effects. This is well known and nobody is trying to hide it. They can be found online, even.
However there is no proven link between MMR and autism. I'm not saying it doesn't exist. I'm saying it cannot be proven. And this despite intense research for years. The initial research on MMR and autism links was fraudulent and unethical. It caused Lancet to retract a published paper for the first time in its over 100-year history.
Sure, drug companies (any companies) want to keep secrets. But the way peer reviewing works makes it very difficult to do this.
"People need to open their eyes and use their brains... and stop believing everything that their doctors or media spoonfeeds them."
Find me actual evidence assembled in a scientific manner, and I'll take a closer look. Non-peer-reviewed papers written in obscure publications don't count.
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asptguy38
Measles, Mumps, & Rubella are all 100% preventable and curable. That being the case, a more beneficial discussion would be why take a vaccine for something that's not necessary? Brainwashing perhaps?
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I'm not going to take your word for it. Show evidence from a peer reviewed journal.
And now we're going around in circles.
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Thousands of published research papers, from around the world, and, without looking at a single one, axpatguy38 dismisses them all.
Incredible.
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We're not going to agree on this so I think I'm done with this thread.
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I have read a lot of credible documents on Polio and a few stories that the Tabloids would be proud of "aliens cured my polio with oranges".
Bill Gates is a big source of funds through the Rotary organisation which with its partners have helped the world polio cases plummet by more than 99 percent, preventing five million instances of child paralysis and 250,000 deaths. When Rotary began its eradication work, polio infected more than 350,000 children annually. In 2009, fewer than 1,700 cases were reported worldwide.
But the polio cases represented by that final 1 percent are the most difficult and expensive to prevent. Challenges include geographic isolation, worker fatigue, armed conflict, and cultural barriers.
There is no cure for polio, only treatment to alleviate the symptoms. Heat and physical therapy is used to stimulate the muscles and antispasmodic drugs are given to relax the muscles. While this can improve mobility, it cannot reverse permanent polio paralysis.
Polio can be prevented through immunization. Polio vaccine, given multiple times, almost always protects a child for life.
That’s why it’s so important to generate the funding needed to End Polio Now. To fail is to invite a polio resurgence that would condemn millions of children to lifelong paralysis in the years ahead.
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cowleyp ...... "There is no cure for polio, only treatment to alleviate the symptoms."
About 60 years ago, Dr. Frederick Klenner of North Carolina, cured 60 cases of polio by giving his patients intravenous doses of vitamin C. Klenner believed in giving massive doses of vitamin C -- up to 500 grams (500,000 mg) -- a day to people who were terminally ill.
Here's a passage from a book which describes how Doctor Klenner, in 1951, cured a 5 year-old girl who was stricken with polio:
"This child had already been paralyzed in both her lower legs for over four days! The right leg was completely flaccid (limp), and the left leg was 85 percent flaccid. Pain was noticed, especially in the knee and lumbar areas. Four doctors confirmed the diagnosis of polio."
"After four days of vitamin C injections, the child was moving both her legs, but with only very slow and deliberate movements. Klenner also noted there was a 'definite response' after only the first injection of vitamin C."
"The child was discharged from the hospital after four days, and given 1,000 mg of vitamin C in fruit juice every 2 hours for seven days. By Day #11, the child was walking about, though slowly. By the 19th day of treatment, there was a 'complete return of sensory and motor function,' and no long-term impairment ever resulted. Vitamin C not only completely cured this case of polio, it completely reversed what would undoubtedly have been a devastating, crippling result for the remainder of this girl's life."
This information comes from the book, VITAMIN C, INFECTIOUS DISEASES, & TOXINS by Doctor Thomas Levy. Levy suggests that polio is one of the easiest diseases to cure with mega-doses of vitamin C.
http://www.doctoryourself.com/vitaminc.html
http://www.orthomed.com/polioep.htm
"Polio can be prevented through immunization."
In 1951 Benjamin P. Sandler, M.D. published the book "Diet Prevents Polio". This was at the height of the polio epidemic. The following is a small excerpt from the book ......
"Thus I arrived at a simple formula for preventing polio: eliminate from the diet sugar and foods containing sugar, and reduce the consumption of foods containing starch."
http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2000/12/24/polio-sugar.aspx
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Apart from being a desperate attempt to help (and that is understandable given the horors of the desease) This in no way qualifies as proof or even a valid scientific test. No validation, too small a sample, no bloodwork no follow up and no control tests. Oh and been largely discounted by later tests and research. I oranges were the answer wouldn't the world be rid of this horror by now?
Mercola! can't say anything that is not actionable
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Dr. Klenner reported curing 60 out of 60 cases of polio by administrating mega-dosages of vitamin c. That's a 100% cure rate. Never-the-less, you are of the opinion that .... "This in no way qualifies as proof or even a valid scientific test. No validation, too small a sample, no bloodwork no follow up and no control tests" . This little gem of insight is a fine example of why it's always frustrating trying to understand the "thought process" of the pro-vaccinate crowd. It'll give you a headache.
"Oh and been largely discounted by later tests and research."
How can anyone determine if this is true, or not, if you don't provide the references to those tests and research? Are we to just take your word?
"If oranges were the answer wouldn't the world be rid of this horror by now?"
#1 - Oranges are not the answer. The average orange only has about 70mg of vitamin c in it. To get the results Klenner and others reported, you'll need amounts in the magnitude of 20,000mg - 100,000mg (maybe higher).
#2 - The dosages may need to be administrated intra-muscularly or intra-veinously. Can't do that with oranges.
#3 - The medical/drug cartel --- after investing umpteen millions of dollars developing & marketing their polio vaccine to a guaranteed market, with no liability for any damages -- is going to come out and say, "Hey everybody, vitamin c is a safe, natural, and totally effective product that cost only pennies which can be administered by anyone to prevent and cure polio". That'll wipe out their business, so what do you think the chances are of them letting that happen?
"Mercola! can't say anything that is not actionable."
I"ve no idea what this mean. Please explain.
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Increased autism rates crush vaccine hypothesis
05 April 2012
CLAIMS that autism is caused by vaccines containing thiomersal have been floored by increasing rates of autism in children not exposed to the chemical.
No link has been found between autism spectrum disorders (ASD) and a mercury-containing compound known as thiomersal that is used in some vaccines. Nevertheless, since 2000, thiomersal has been phased out of most paediatric vaccines in the US. Now a report published by the US Centers for Disease Control and Prevention shows that, despite this, the prevalence of ASD has continued to grow.
The data, from 13 areas in the US, reveal that in 2008, 11.4 kids aged eight per 1000 had an ASD compared with 6.4 per 1000 in 2002 - a 78 per cent increase. "Since the [latest data] came from kids who had vaccines [largely] without thiomersal, this factor plays no apparent role in the increased rates of the disorder," says Emanuel DiCicco-Bloom of the Robert Wood Johnson Medical School in Piscataway, New Jersey, who was not involved in the study.
"Increases are likely to reflect better awareness of the condition," says Simon Baron-Cohen, director of the Autism Research Centre in Cambridge, UK.
link:
http://www.newscientist.com/article/mg21428594.100-increased-autism-rates-crush-vaccine-hypothesis.html
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Isn’t it sooooooooo reassuring to know that mercury in vaccines don’t cause autism (according to the study). That's enought to make one want to immediately run out and get vaccinated for somehting.
All that’s needed now - for the more critical thinker - is a study comparing autism rates in vaccinated kids against autism rates in un-vaccinated kids, yes?
Don’t hold your breath for that one ....
“ ... the mainstream will never do a study of unvaccinated kids. They already fear what it will show, and the results for them would likely be cataclysmic. Their best bet is to invent reasons the study can't be done.”
http://www.ageofautism.com/2009/02/unvaccinated-children-madness.html
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Infant Monkeys Given Standard Doses of Vaccines Develop Autism Symptoms
http://vran.org/in-the-news/infant-monkeys-given-standard-doses-of-vaccines-develop-autism-symptoms/
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