Friends: I am to finalize details of my contract within the next weeks and a few questions... the position created for me is Director of Major Projects working for an extremely large international construction supply company... based in HK and traveling extensively throughout the AP region for at least several years.
Salary range is hovering within a few bucks of 1.1M HKD for my first year with the Co picking up the cost of a furnished/serviced condo and the usual sr exec expenses and perks...
Questions are (and thanks for your time in response!!!):
What detail (s) was/were left out of your contract that you sorely miss or wish now you would have included it in your negotiations for living in the region?
Did you find other natives to your homeland and natives to the region friendly and helpful during your transition?
Is the salary you left back home something you now miss or does your current offer afford you a lifestyle of similar quality from "home" to HK?
If you're a female-hunting-bachelor (as I am), do you find the locals lady's approachable and friendly towards Americans or Anglo's (and no I don't mean the ones selling their services!)?
Have you found any single and available lady's in HK from your homeland? Are they out "hunting" too?
Would you consider the "nightlife" in bars and clubs to be sufficient for your personal socializing or do you prefer something akin to the (rediculously expensive) Amercian Club or HK Yachting Club?
Is your career goal to remain in the AP region, or is it a step up your ladder back towards home?
Any other pertinent offer or advice?
Best regards!
Tiger T
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"What detail (s) was/were left out of your contract that you sorely miss or wish now you would have included it in your negotiations for living in the region?"
Paid school. But it's no biggie for us. Private schools in HK are way cheaper than in the US.
"Did you find other natives to your homeland and natives to the region friendly and helpful during your transition?"
Well, not really natives of our homeland since they are not THAT common. But other expats are friendly and helpful. Locals are indifferent at best.
"Is the salary you left back home something you now miss or does your current offer afford you a lifestyle of similar quality from "home" to HK?"
Quality of life is much better due to having a helper and other things. The salary is not a problem. HK requires a higher salary due (or paid housing) to high housing costs. You will most likely have a smaller place than you are used to.
"If you're a female-hunting-bachelor (as I am), do you find the locals lady's approachable and friendly towards Americans or Anglo's (and no I don't mean the ones selling their services!)?"
I don't have personal experience but from what I have heard local ladies are quite friendly towards foreign men as long as they have some money.
"Have you found any single and available lady's in HK from your homeland? Are they out "hunting" too?"
Again, no personal experience, but no (homeland not that large), however if you are from the US/UK/Australia it should not be an issue. And yes, there is plenty of hunting.
"Would you consider the "nightlife" in bars and clubs to be sufficient for your personal socializing or do you prefer something akin to the (rediculously expensive) Amercian Club or HK Yachting Club?"
This is enormously subjective but I think you'll find the nightlife plentiful for any needs you may have. I don't have personal experience either way.
As for ridiculously expensive clubs, that is also subjective. Plenty of people have memberships paid by their employers, or have investment banker salaries. I would think that for the type of socializing you seem to want, the clubs are not a place for you. It's more of a family crowd I think.
"Is your career goal to remain in the AP region, or is it a step up your ladder back towards home?"
To remain if possible. Great place to live.
"Any other pertinent offer or advice?"
Don't try to make a carbon copy of your "previous life" as you come to HK. It is very different in many ways. If you understand that, you will probably enjoy you stay here.
Get a helper unless you really never are home. It's a game changer.
"Salary range is hovering within a few bucks of 1.1M HKD for my first year with the Co picking up the cost of a furnished/serviced condo and the usual sr exec expenses and perks..."
Not to rain on your parade but this is very far from senior executive salary levels for the investment banking crowd that roams the nightlife of LKF and so on. You will be well off though, no mistake.
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HK$55k housing package is not hight at all - would struggle to get a two bed in Midlevels for example (that;s is where I would be if I was a single man). So, no way, dont ask for less for sure - i would say almost more...
by the way if you are American or "Anglo" - shouldn't you spell "ladies" rather than "lady's" - you do mean plural, right? was juts wondering...
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"it is a VERY weird package. In your previous post you mentioned housing of HK$55k+. That is a very high housing package as it is more than 50% of your base salary."
There are in fact expats with disproportionately high housing allowances, sometimes more than their salary.
"What are the "usual" snr exec expenses and perks?"
Depends on the industry. For investment banking you'd have some or all of paid housing (but much more than 55k for senior mgmt), paid schools in some cases, relocation expenses, cultural training, housing search, management of house/apt in home country, car allowance, health insurance, utilities allowance, paid travel home a few times a year, etc...
"HK$55k housing package is not hight at all - would struggle to get a two bed in Midlevels for example (that;s is where I would be if I was a single man). So, no way, dont ask for less for sure - i would say almost more..."
Certainly.
"by the way if you are American or "Anglo" - shouldn't you spell "ladies" rather than "lady's" - you do mean plural, right? was juts wondering..."
Depends on the meaning. I think he means "of the ladies", in which case "ladies'" (plural and genitive) might be more correct.
"One thing that does put people off in HK is expats talking themselves up. As long as you don't bring the "I am a superstar" attitude that many Americans unfortunately do bring with them, you will be warmely welcomed.."
Indeed.
"The other weird thing I sense is that you have mentioned that the comapny is "extremely large international construction supply company", but they do not seem to be putting your mind at ease. An "extremely large" international company would have an HR dept with very experienced people managing this process for you."
Very true.
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There are expats here whose housing allowance exceeds half of their cash package. The original post is off though, sounds like a person bragging about something he knows nothing about.
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"it is a VERY weird package. In your previous post you mentioned housing of HK$55k+. That is a very high housing package as it is more than 50% of your base salary."
"There are in fact expats with disproportionately high housing allowances, sometimes more than their salary."
completely true - i know a lot of case like that, including us. not unusual at all.
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Yeah to be honest, I would see if I could get a larger housing allowance. You will get something decent for 55k but its not going to get you that far. For a single man though it is ok.
and on the ladies front, you might have trouble with expat single women, If you are interested or become interested in Asian women, then as long as you have a bit of dosh, you will have no problems.
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"and on the ladies front, you might have trouble with expat single women, If you are interested or become interested in Asian women, then as long as you have a bit of dosh, you will have no problems"
totally true in most countries i think - whether this is what you want however, is another matter...
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I say he might have trouble with expat single women, simply because of the numbers, they are far less of them here then there are Asian women. Though there are other specific problems, I am not getting into that debate here.
I understand what you are saying, most women do prefer their men to have some cash. That is not what I meant, its mercenary in Hong Kong, or South East Asia in general for that matter compared with the west. I mean how often do you see a stunning 20 year old waif, with a balding 40 year old fat man who is on a mediocre salary. Not that often in New York or London if ever, but happens all the time in Hong Kong.
If you have a bit of cash in Hong Kong, there is no shortage of women, whether you find those women suitable is a whole other ball game.
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You are kidding right?? perhaps a man on HK$350 K PA represents a complete lifestyle change for them. Do I blame them, hell no.
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These girls are not stupid--as spiritual as they maybe--they wouldn't be out there with those guys if they weren't economically better off. How's one better off is relative, for them it may not take that much.
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Bit hard to pick up on sarcasm sometimes on the internet. besides who knows, you could have been a 40 year old balding fat male expat who was in love with a 20 year old waif and been completely serious. Not that there is anything wrong with that either
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"I mean how often do you see a stunning 20 year old waif, with a balding 40 year old fat man who is on a mediocre salary. Not that often in New York or London if ever, but happens all the time in Hong Kong"
Well that stunning 20 year old waif that you are talking about.. might be well off 30ish... Asia women do often look younger than their age. Less suntanning I guess...
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"On the other hand (if we get back to the topic) one reason for expats form such relationship that you wouldn't have back home, is that when you are abroad you are more free from social expectations of the society, in which you grew up. Thus you just start relationship with someone you like (for one or another reason)"
The differences in culture and the surprises that you get from time to time because of again the differences in culture add up the excitement to a relationship too....
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Well, back to the original thread, you mentioned "extensive travelling". I am sure you will fly on business class or above, yes? If not, this is a must then.
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That description is true for a lot of my friends and acquaintance's, Some are loaded some are not, there is nothing wrong with it. and yes its true being in Asia means you are free of what a western society expects as normal behaviour, but sometimes its perverse. I know this one guy who is 63 years old, bald, fat and has a skin condition which freaks me out, and he spends every weekend, sleeping with 20 something asian chicks, he's not even particularly wealthy and he does it simply because he can. I have no idea how, but fair enough.
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Heard the latest re Bill's outburst at a journalist stemming from the profile he did on Bill in Vainity Fair? Apparently, will get my hand on a copy asap, one of the unflattering accounts detailed in the article is that Bill's been seeing plenty of women on the road while campaigning for Hiliary. Seeing as in seeing the women's heads from a certain vantage point? ;)
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'I know this one guy who is 63 years old, bald, fat and has a skin condition which freaks me out, and he spends every weekend, sleeping with 20 something asian chicks, he's not even particularly wealthy and he does it simply because he can. I have no idea how, but fair enough.''
Yes, would anyone know how? And might this man have other conditions too?
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i did not even realise that Bill was campagning for hilary - i though they kept him away from the whole thing (I mean - has anyone seen him ONCE during the campagn?) - for that particular reason!
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am surprised we all have not been deleted from this forum yet, Ed must be busy with other things! just a matter of time...
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ptk
18 yrs ago
just curious, do expats with good amount of housing allowances normally earn more than those hired as local base?
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It really depends on the employer and position you are talking about. Some employers if not a lot of them would prefer to pay someone hired on local terms more than someone comparable hired on expat terms in lieu of savings on housing and other benefits. If you take the overall worth of the package, the expat package is always going to be worth more.
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I agree with Digital Blonde. The expat package is so good because they couldn't find someone local AND they had to exceed all the barriers to moving. I mean even if I could make more by moving I'm not going to do it just like that. It's a lot of hassle. Hence the attractive package.
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Friends: what a remarkable series of responses!
Of course the very reason I posted the questions is for answers to honest questions and not for braggart or pompous or because I don't know if there's an HR director in a company with 11,000 employee's across the globe... and for the question of fat and balding... actually I'm quite athletic and have been told easy on the eyes... don't have much hair so I choose the Yul Brynner look...
In my position in Dubai UAE, the ONLY way to get a lady for a man like me was to pay... could not even look at the muslim women without getting into ALOT of trouble... so I never did look! And in 2 years over there... it sure was a dry hot desert and I don't just mean the climate.
Anyways: perhaps a few responses to clarify...
I was told my salary range would be in line with my requested amount for the first year... in $USD that equates to a first years wage of $130 to $150 thousand. The "benefit" of the co picking up my condo expenses is common... I have discovered that HK is listed as the 5th most expensive city on the planet for living costs and I have absolutely NO idea what HKD 40-50-60 thousand per month will get me. That's why I'm asking! If you folks here think that will get me something decent then fine. If it's going to get me something less then that's why I asked for advice. A fellow who asks for advice does not generally like to hear criticism or sarcasm...
The company has an extensive HR department... and I'll be presenting to them a fellow who has done his homework. No surprises.
Someones asked "whats the usual perks..." for me it is the co paying for:
co credit card for business-expense purchases
life/medical/health/dental/vision insurance
vehicle & insurance & gasoline credit card
4 weeks vacation per year with 4 RT plane tickets home to see my kids and friends
1 month's pay for mutual-agreed separation/severance
paid costs for continuation of technical trade school & certification
These also are very common.
In any case: no bragging here... wanting and asking for advice. Not spelling advice... professional advice and opinion.
Best regards!
Tiger Thom
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Mate
You will get a decent place for 50k-60k very livable and decent for a single man with no kids and your perks sound fine too. Salaryt is decent, you should have a good comfortable lifestyle when you are here.
One question, if you werent into muslim hookers, who as you say do not allow you to look at them, then why not one of the russian and eastern european chicks that seem to hang out at the hotel bars, and all seem to be on the game
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Mate
You will get a decent place for 50k-60k very livable and decent for a single man with no kids and your perks sound fine too. Salaryt is decent, you should have a good comfortable lifestyle when you are here.
One question, if you werent into muslim hookers, who as you say do not allow you to look at them, then why not one of the russian and eastern european chicks that seem to hang out at the hotel bars, and all seem to be on the game
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If you get a company car make sure you get a carpark at work and home of factor in the cost of one. Also get them to pay for your tolls especially if you don't work and live on HK Island. The best tunnel off the island is HK$40 each way, which ads up if you do it twice a day..
If your rental allowance is fixed make sure it will increase year on year. Rents in HK went up 30% in the last year.
IMO $55k pm will get you a good apartment in mid-levels but everyone's definition of good is different and the sky is the limit with accommodation here.
The numbers are stacked against you on finding a good woman that is not a gold digger but good luck with that...you only need One.
I would give up some perks if it meant securing business class travel as work travel gets very tiresome very quickly but you couldn't ask for better than the HK airport and airport express train.
Also passport renewal costs is one to think about. Especially if you need to go to China, each visa takes a page and now you can only get double entry so you can easily use lots of pages and if you travel alot you will need the express renewal service. Mine was about NZ$400 by the time I got the urgent service with Fedex both ways.
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Dig Blonde... some of my cohorts spent 1/2 their paychecks on the paid sex workers... some of us did not. I have never in my life been in the least interested in picking up a hooker of any nationality... just not into it at all. NOT that I have ANY darn thing against those women... that's what they have to make their money and god bless them it's better than starving.
But it does remind me of a very funny repeating incident... because I have an unusual blood type, the blood banks hound me to give a pint every 3-4 weeks... they ask the same questions over and over everytime... here's my favorite...
"Have you ever paid for sex?"
I respond... "I was married to a forensic accountant for 22 years... yes of course I paid for sex!"
TT!
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Good one tigertmoore. :)
I have not lived in UAE but in my uninformed opinion you will not have issues in HK. Anything goes here. The way it should be. I'm happily married and have no requirement for this kind of thing, but I still think this kind of freedom is important.
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