Posted by
TJMcQ
17 yrs ago
The news is reporting that the government has shut down all primary schools starting tomorrow due to an outbreak at oneof the schools. So far, I have not seen this posted on the Education Bureau website nor have I seen it on our school website. Any thoughts? Will other venues be closed down such as birthday party places (paintball for example). My son's party is tomorrow!!!
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I have heard this as well. But the Education Bureau website is still mum.
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The SCMP is reporting it as well.
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cd
17 yrs ago
I've just come back from picking my kids up from school. Its really sad, all the P6 kids are in tears, they've spent weeks rehearsing a play for the parents which they can no longer show, they're all sad because they're not getting a chance to say goodbye to their friends, or have their leaving do etc. I nearly started crying watching them, and I don't have a child in P6. Even the kids in the other years that are leaving thought they had time to organise farewells with friends etc, now they don't. The teachers that are leaving don't get a chance to say goodbye, (one of them after 30 years), It was a very sombre mood up there.
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This strain is not as fearful as SARS, some even describe it as mild (not a killer). Still, this is the prudent thing to do.
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what horesh#*t Posh Dog....local school is on for another month (July 10), territory wide assessments that determine band one allotments, and P5 exams to determine Form 1 places have been cancelled...THIS IS A BIG DEAL for local parents (maybe not for a disgruntled former NET like you)...and this month is FAR from babysitting....some exams still to go in schools (don't speak for every school as if your experience is global), reports to be done and distributed...
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Ed
17 yrs ago
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB124469834684805419.html
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who declares pandemic level maximu 6
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I have a child in kindergarten who has been practicing her lines all month for her graduation ceremony and it's very sad she and her classmates won't be able to show the parents the results of their hard work. I feel sorry for all the kids in schools who haven't been able to properly say goodbye to their friends, finish exams, perform plays etc. not to mention being an inconvenience to the parents! What I don't understand is that the flu cluster was found at secondary school, but the government is only closing down the primary and kindergartens, which to date haven't been affected. That doesn't make a lot of sense to me...
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They would like to close all schools but imagine the impact if F5 or F7 kids don't get to go to where they want 'because' of school closure!
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I think all this is a load of crap!!! All this happens after it has been announced that a vaccine is in the making and will be available before next flu season!!! I can understand that closing the schools are within the best intention but really, most schools had in place really preventive measure, it's up to parents to monitor their kids health and not send them to school if they have even just a runny nose!! Because now having all these BORED kids on the loose in HK in playrooms, Ocean Park, Disney Land, pools, etc.... is not a germ nest? As far as I know, a lot of people are gonna take this opportunity to change flights and g home early. So, really, calling the kids back to school on the 26th? for the morning? are you kidding me!!!! I'm am also choked that nothing is done as far as tuition and bus fees are concern. Really shouldn't 2 weeks of fees be forwarded to next year tuition? ESF now demands that we pay August terms in advance to secure the kids place in the school, even if the kids technically go to school for what a whole 10 days in August we're still paying a full month!!!! It's a recession, people have taken pay cuts, unpaid leave, some companies don't pay for school anymore... Really as any of this been taken in consideration and dealt with?
Most definitely it's a very abrupt way to end school year at any levels as the kids have work their a** off (pardon my french) and deserved to see this through!
Anyways, this is just my personal view on something that I don't think is as dramatic as they're leading on.
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As I recall, the same thing happened last year, H1N1 not even being on the radar.
"I'm am also choked that nothing is done as far as tuition and bus fees are concern. Really shouldn't 2 weeks of fees be forwarded to next year tuition"
It's not the school's fault. I bet if you read the contract carefully it will say something about "no refunds for matters beyond our control". It's like that for any business. You were expecting to be out that money anyway.
"It's a recession, people have taken pay cuts, unpaid leave, some companies don't pay for school anymore... Really as any of this been taken in consideration and dealt with?"
Dealt with by whom? This is just the reality of the situation. It's not the school's fault there is a recession. In any case most private schools have no problem filling their classes. Plenty of people on the waiting list if some of the current parents can no longer afford it.
Who should foot the bill? The school? Private schools are businesses, not charities. The government? I'm sure there are better ways to use tax money than to subsidize schooling for the middle and upper class.
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Most unfortunate timing and what a shame for all the P6 students and those that are leaving Hong Kong for good. That said the government has made a very wise decision. Younger children apart from being more suseptable to flu etc. they are also not able to manage their personal hygiene very well. Sneeze on their hands, wipe them on their clothes, then open the door handle for all the other littles to touch then suck their thumbs. High school kids are much more able to handle their personal hygiene.
I also don't understand why there will be bored kids around... plenty to do to keep mine occupied.
If you are given a refund who is going to pay the teachers and the bus drivers? I would rather my children are kept safe and healthy I am not prepared to take any chances where my childrens health is involved.
The Hong Kong government did an excellent job with SARS and looks like they are doing the same again with the Swine Flu and I would like to thank them for taking every possible precaution to keep my family safe.
Guess there are is no pleasing some people which in this case where it involves thier childrens health I am just amazed.
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MayC
17 yrs ago
My daughter's assessment does not start until the 22nd of June. She is also graduating this year to go into ESF and has been rehearsing for it. While I hope that she'll be able to say goodbye to her friends, I don't blame the government for closing the schools.
If you think about it, the govt was criticised during the SARS period for doing too little. I think they would rather be criticised for doing too much rather than doing too little.
It is true that closing schools does not stop parents from finding alternative plans for the kids such as Disney, Ocean Park etc.... however, there are parents out there who would rather play safe and keep the kids home - this would at least reduce the number of affected cases IF they are going to occur.
I agree that smaller kids are more at risk because they still do not know how to watch their own hygiene. My daughter for example touches her face, sucks her thumb, wipes her wet hands or mouth on her sleeves etc. Awful and am working on it... but before she's able to watch her own hygiene, I think it's good that a decision such as this one came about.
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I still think the government have made the right decision - no doubt about it!
Huggy, I hear what you are saying in regards to Mrs Ma and yes it is likely unless she works she will loose her job. The Govt should be assisting low paid workers in this situation absolutely!
Hopefully these families will have some relatives or friends that can help them out and in the case of Mrs Ma I am not sure what the answer is only that the Social Welfare Dept should provide them with some sort of protection.
I often wonder what the likes of Mrs Ma does when her children are ill?
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"I often wonder what the likes of Mrs Ma does when her children are ill?"
Like most others she sends them to school where they pass on whatever they have to the other kids.
"it's up to parents to monitor their kids health and not send them to school if they have even just a runny nose!!"
As above, they do and it spreads. You can't rely on other parents doing the right thing.
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Will they start closing schools every time a bug starts circulating in the populace? Isn't exposure to germs supposed to boost kids immunity and give their immune systems something to work with so they don't turn on themselves with auto-immune diseases and allergies?
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edelg
17 yrs ago
Noticing all the posts here and think the government absolutely did the right thing by closing schools. As someone above suggested I don't think exposing kids to a virus that we don't fully understand is a good idea. No one knows how this bug will mutate and I think it's BS that anyone would worry about what their child will miss if they are out of school a few weeks. Surely their health and safety is paramount to missing an exam or school play. People have died of this flu, perfectly healthy people. Just because it may not effect you or anyone you know directly does not mean a complacent attitude should be adopted.
Also, Hong Kong parents need to calm the hell down about eduaction and get their priorities straight.
Having said all that one huge flaw in the governments school closure..the hundreds of learning centres / tutorial centres remain open. Stupid beyond words.These places are smaller and just interested in profit and by and large not children's health. Which goes to show the good old dollar is king in Hong Kong, not people's health and safety. A bit shortsighted on the governments part...or do learning centres have special powers of immunization to disease?
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Maybe these review centers are not covered by the Education Bureau's powers. Maybe a different agency is responsible for them.
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"Noticing all the posts here and think the government absolutely did the right thing by closing schools. As someone above suggested I don't think exposing kids to a virus that we don't fully understand is a good idea."
but is it really a good idea and fool proof solution ? yes you've taken kids off school to prevent the virus being passed around. yet no one knows if the virus lays dormant in one of these kids so who knows where they'll possibly going around during these two weeks, and to who they will be passing on the virus in the community.
and those who take advantage of the situation simply defeats the purpose of closing schools like disney who is offering HK250 unlimited visits during this period.
Disney Website
All students who study in kindergartens, primary schools or special schools now can enjoy our new June Pass with unlimited admissions to the Park for just HK$250! Offer period: 12 - 30 June, 2009
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MayC
17 yrs ago
"yet no one knows if the virus lays dormant in one of these kids so who knows where they'll possibly going around during these two weeks, and to who they will be passing on the virus in the community."
True, such an act may not prevent the flu from spreading into the community but it will at least reduce the chances of the majority of the population getting it.
With interest classes, they are as the name suggests, "interest classes". They are optional. Mothers can choose to let the kids attend or not to attend.
"Isn't exposure to germs supposed to boost kids immunity and give their immune systems something to work with so they don't turn on themselves with auto-immune diseases and allergies?"
Some strains of viruses kill as we've witnessed during the SARS period. The reason for closing the schools is because we don't know how "deadly" this one is. If it is nothing, then we can count our blessings, despite the fuss. But if it is serious, at least we know that the govt cares enough to react quickly to it. Even normal viruses can kill, I understand this... but sometimes it is better to be safe than sorry.
It is, after all, only 2 weeks and as I've said, my daughter is supposed to graduate this year and she hasn't done her finals which is supposed to be held in a week's time. 2 weeks is really nothing in the life of a student. Yes, it may affect school placements and all.. but I am sure these schools would be able to find alternative means of screening children. Surely health is more important?
And during the SARS, weren't we angry that the government didn't close the schools earlier? If they had, wouldn't less people die? How many of those who lost loved ones due to SARS thought about missing 2 weeks of school?
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What amazes me is that so many people still choose not to give their kids flu shots. Other strains can kill just as much as H1N1, and yet all people do is focus on that one.
Half a million people die yearly of the fly worldwide. Compared to that, 140 known deaths from H1N1 this year is just a drop in the bucket.
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cd
17 yrs ago
Sars was an identified strain of pneumonia, no more people died that year from pneumonia related illness than any other year, and of the 300 that dies from Sars, many had a chronis underlying illness. 50 thousand people die in the US every year alone from flu, why is there not panic and I suspect several thousand in HK, why is there not panic and school closures every flu season. People need to put in into perspective, take precautions, and 'observe good hygiene' as the ad goes.
As to closing schools, I have primary and secondary age kids, so my teen is still going to school, mixing with 1400 others and is coming home, seems strange, agree with above poster, either close all or none. What about all the parents going out to work in very large open planned offices, kids can be exposed in a hundred different ways, if its going to spread I really don't think closing schools is going to stop it.
As to today, my kids are enjoying the time off, have had 3 kids in to play this morning and now they have gone round their friends for a playdate, so although not mixing in such high numbers, they are certainly mixing.
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Huggy, let's try to answer your question – so that you can understand why the government made such a WISE decision. No Secondary or Universities have been closed because the rate of infection of young school children is more than double that of older teenagers and adults. However, individual Secondary schools that experienced an outbreak would be closed according to govt. The govt believes that by closing primary and kindys for 2 weeks will substantially slow down the community spread, protect the very young and reduce the risk to the public, reducing the worries of parents, families and teachers as well as the burden on hospitals & clinics. According to newspaper HK microbiologists believe that by closing schools, HK could delay the peak of the flu for another 2-3 weeks which could reduce the burden on public hospitals. A Professor Ho said it would not be surprising if swine flu killed young children in HK. So let’s get things in perspective here, two weeks off school, two weeks of lost fees, a little inconvenience – a child’s life – a no brainer as far as I am concerned.
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"The reason for closing the schools is because we don't know how "deadly" this one is."
One never knows how deadly viruses are because they mutate like crazy - "un-deadly" ones become deadly, deadly ones "un-deadly". Closing primary schools in Hong Kong will not make this virus less deadly.
"at least we know that the govt cares enough to react quickly to it." - wow, so much faith in and desire for a nanny state.
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Of course at the other side of the fence would be people asking the government why it didn't do enough, or why it acted late :) ,there's just no pleasing everybody!
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but why, for once, not please the level-headed?
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but look at where these school kids are.... with their parents having a blast of a day!!! if they had the flu - they would have spread it to the community in any case and the small kids would have easily caught the flu too
Parents ignore health warnings RTHK News
Dozens of parents and children queued up outside the Disneyland theme park this morning, to take advantage of a controversial promotion targeting primary school and kindergarten students, whose classes have been suspended.
======
and in another news
Health officials have confirmed another two local cases of human swine flu. They are relatives of two students from St Paul's Convent School.
At least they could trace the source of the contamination. if the kids are let loose so to speak in the city for two weeks, it will be harder to trace where the source of the flu came from and contain the outbreak.
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"A Professor Ho said it would not be surprising if swine flu killed young children in HK."
"Ordinary" flu strains kill children in HK. 1-2 last year if memory serves. Is the government mounting massive campaigns for flu vaccination of children?
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By which time the flu season will be over. Sigh...
Flu vaccines in HK should be given in November, so that they "cover" both flu seasons. That's right, one of the advantages of living in HK is two flu seasons a year instead of just one.
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I have two kids in High School and three in Lower School and one in Kindy. The older two are far more aware and are responsible for their personal hygien the littles not so. Yes they are playing with their friends and they have an adult with them who can advise them when to wash their hands and what not to touch etc. Very different to being with a small group of supervised friends than being in a classroom with a large group.
Huggy - As I said a huge shame but children can say goodbye to their friends as most are doing but in small groups and just not at school. I believe most parents feel that their childrens health is paramont and thank goodness the HK govt do too.
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Huggy - Not quite correct - If you have the statistics to back up your claim that most of the the children affected are primary or kindy - like i asked earlier - please post.
What was written was -
No Secondary or Universities have been closed because the rate of infection of young school children is more than double that of older teenagers and adults. However, individual Secondary schools that experienced an outbreak would be closed according to govt.
Pls check front page of todays SCMP for varification of the above.
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cd
17 yrs ago
I was under the impressions from people that have already caught the virus that there has been very few cases among small children, and seems to be affecting teens and adults much more.
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i just heard from a friend that many restaurants are offering discounts and offering promotions to students during this 2 week period.
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reminds me of the snoopy and hello kitty queue at mcdonalds years back
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totally agree with sarahjames that younger kids are relatively more prone to get and pass on all sorts of virus so there's some sense in closing the primary schools and not the secondary schools.
As for people questioning whether this is a "foolproof solution" - anybody who's got one would be getting a nobel prize!!
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Even Disneyland has offered an unlimited pass for june 12th to june 30th for $250 for school kids! And my email is swamped with "special" extra activities classes for the next 2 weeks.......at least some people are making extra money while all us parents of kids in international schools grimace at the amount we are paying to have our all kids get an extra two weeks holiday! no guarantee that they won't catch swine flu at Disneyland....there is probably more kids there on a single day than the whole of the primary school anyway!
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I would suggest that any parent who values their childs health will not be sending them to Disney or any other crowded place. Having recently been to Disney on a quiet day, there are so many overseas visitors and the kids have too many things to touch, you would have to put sterilizing gel on the kids hands after every ride - what a nightmare! I don't intend to keep my kids at home they are going out and about but I will try to take them to outside non crowded venues as we did during SARS - What Disney is promoting is highly irrisponsible in my view.
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edelg
17 yrs ago
In reponse to the above posts: The WHO also said (well along these lines) that they supported HK's decision to close schools and these decisions were specific to each region, how they were affected etc. Given Hong Kongs huge population and track record with viral infections this seems in line with the governments decision.
As a teacher I think special interest centres are a huge issue - ie language learning centres, there are tonnes of them with tonnes of students.
The other morning I had a really sick little girl come into my class, she had a mask on and soon let slip that her school, (St. Puals primary) in CWB had been closed. Her parents 'failed' to tell us this. Again today another student came in wanting to take a trial class, her brother later let slip that she was a secondary school student who was from the very St Pauls. affected. This is on top of sick kids that get sent to class on a regular basis, swine flu or not the parents don't seem concerned their kids are ill and definetly don't carev that they can pass whatever they have on.
So yes Disneyland are irresponsible.
Private learning centres, ditto.
Parents, unfortunately, yes too.
Two weeks of school, spent away from theme parks (be that disneyland or the regular circus like circuit of extra curricular activities should not be the end of the world.)
Yes this virus is not yet deadly in Hong Kong, but that does not mean we should be complacent.
I guess when you have to deal with lots of sneezing coughing kids evry day and pushy parents, then this stuff becomes very apparent.
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seren
17 yrs ago
It seems very easy to get irrate about the closing of the primary schools. In hind sight it may appear that the decision may have been hasty. I do appreciate that many working parents in HK do not have care for their children. My heart goes out to these as it will be a struggle to find appropriate care. However I don't think those of you that are so angry about it appreciate how swiftly viruses go through schools. With the best will in the world children are not always careful with their personal hygiene. There was a school recently where they had to close the school for 2 days because of an outbreak of a gastric bug. It took out over half of the school and two children were hospitalised. it was beginning to spread across to another campus where there were older siblings. The Education Department closed the school down. This was so wise as it appeared to stop the spread although many siblings did become affected.
Parents have been advised that their children should be kept off school with symptoms of fever, coughing and sore throats. Under normal circustances a cold is nothing. Children DO build up immunitites over time to many of the yucky stuff that goes around the school. BUT flu, any flu is nasty, yet many parents were stll sending children in and are reluctant to pick them up when called. The absolute in selfishness I would say.
The timing of the closure was so unfortunate for many leavers didn't get a chance to say goodbye properly and so many activities had to be cancelled but I personally would rather that than many children becoming very sick when it could have been avoided.
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I had hoped that schools would have stayed open one more day as my son was to go camping overnight (last Thursday) It was a shame that his trip was cancelled as he was about to leave when the announcement was made.
He understands now as he doesn't like getting sick.
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