Posted by
hkjazz
15 yrs ago
My family and I are considering moving out of the high rise living situation, even though we are in a great estate at the moment, and moving into a larger house in a village somewhere. We're basically sick of living in a shoebox. But we would like some advice from those who are currently living in village situations. We can't afford that much, probably $30k is our limit, so Sai Kung and Clearwater Bay are most likely out of the question. Can anybody recommend any other nice areas that would have a few expats sacattered around. I've also heard through the grapevine that some villagers are quite hostile to outsiders. Can anyone confirm this and if so what areas should we avoid? Transportation convenience is also a concern as our kids are at schoool in Kowloon Tong and we both work. Although, we do have a car which will be very helpful I guess.
Anyway, any advice/information would be greatly appreciated.
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You can definitely find something in Sai Kung for that price. Just as long as you don't expect a pool or manicured lawns! But there are townhouses/village houses you can get at that price.
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30k a month? Try Tai Po where I live. We pay 7000 a month and it is all we need - family of 5! The village people (haha) are just fine. All we have problems with is the language barrier. The neighbours who are either expats or english speaking HK locals have been more than welcoming - invites to parties etc.
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vak
15 yrs ago
we have been in cwb area for 18 years of which 8 have been in villages. never had any problems with locals or expats except one nutty woman who hated everyone equally. We shared experiences like OAshanghai where NON English speaking locals invited us to communal barbeques specially over CNY. Spoke in sign language but I feel having kids breaks a lot of barriers. village houses come as 700 sq ft per floor or 400 sq ft per floor. Some houses are just one floor and others are 2 floors or 3 joined together. If you are not too fussy about a sea view or garden you can certainly get something below 30k for a 2 floor house. only thing to be careful about is to get a guaranteed carparking from the landlord as this is the common cause of arguments. Second problem is wild dogs in certain villages. I lived in Ng Fai Tin a few years ago. On one occassion Counted 27 dogs fighting and barking all night. There are a bunch of villages near the Roundabout of Taipo highway near Hong Lok Yuen. I met a few expats at a daipaidong there a few weeks ago. Its great value for village houses there and many expats living there now (specially single income households). less than 15k for a full house . explore......and good luck
Cara seems to have a great deal. Its a lifestyle choice at the end of the day.
Its definitely worth the move. I have met so many families with kids who have done it in the past 2 years and their only regret is not having done it earlier for the kid's sake.
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Would totally agree with Jushay. Check it out properly before making any decisions. Go for a walk around the village and see if you can get a feel of the place.
Who else is living there? Who might be your neighbours? How close are you to them i.e could you pass a cup of sugar through the window?
Go in the day and follow up in the evening around dinner time and see what is going on. Where is the cooking exhaust going? Into your window? Air-con exhaust?
How close are you to the rubbish collection point? Not too far but of course, but not next door. Where would you park your car and can you see it from your house? etc etc.
Lastly, if you can find it, be the same as Cara, that is, rent the whole house, all three floors. This is the best idea and will cut out a lot of the problems. This will afford you the most space and alleviate parking problems, noise problems and some neighbour problems disappear.
Clearwater bay is great, 30-45 mins to Central by mini bus and train from Hang Hau.
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190k
15 yrs ago
have a look at Fairview Park in Yuen Long, good estate bus service to Central, Kowloon, Tsuen Wan, Tsing Yi, Yuen Long west rail and Sheung Shui East rail. Own shopping centre and food court as well as country club which is cheap to join if you are renting. $14K gets a 1150 three bed house with garden and ample space for parking two cars
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Thanks for the good advice everyone. Bob The builder we definitely don't want to share a house with anyone, that'd just be asking for trouble I think, so I guess that rules out a few problems. You're also definitely right about checking the place out at day and at night. I think I'd do that for any place after my current experience. Our apartment was nice and quiet during the day when we looked at it and then after we moved in we discovered our upstairs neighbour likes to wear her stilettos inside at night and refuses to change her ways. I've seen a few houses advertised that have the walled area around it. This would be ideal as our space would be defined and would deter neighbours from getting too "friendly". The whole family goes to school / work on the Kowloon side so Tai Po wouldn't be too yonder I don't think. Does anyone know roughly what the commute from Tai Po to say, TST would be? Also, what about security? Friend living in CWB has had her house broken into twice now, police blamed illegal immigrants living in the mountains (???) for it. She's since bought a dog but, we have a dog allergy in the house so don't think we could do that.
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"Friend living in CWB has had her house broken into twice now, police blamed illegal immigrants living in the mountains (???) for it"
Yepp, there are in fact such. Then again I think they were more common 10 years ago.
"She's since bought a dog but, we have a dog allergy in the house so don't think we could do that."
Poodles and Labradoodles are not a problem for allergies since they don't shed. These dogs come up to around 30-35 kg so could be a decent guard dog if well trained.
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cd
15 yrs ago
There are a lot of expats living in villages around the Tai Po/ Hong Lok Yuen area.
Travelling is quick now with the Tolo highway. Less than 10 mins to Sha Tin.
You will struggle to find a whole village house in Sai Kung/Clearwater Bay for less then $30k, unless you go way way out like Cara. Also if you were looking at schools in the area, it is really, really hard to get a place at the moment.
For that price you could probably get a whole house in one of the villages down the Sai Sha rd, between Sai Kung and Ma On Shan.
Agree with the others, parking is often a problem. Its not that often included, you will usually have to pay the village elder, around $500-600 a month per space. Barking dogs are a big problem. Breakins do happen, I've lived in CWB for 8 years and only know 2 people that have had breakins, and yes II's do camp out in the hills.
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vak
15 yrs ago
despite all the above comments I have not heard of ANY expats moving from CWB or TAIPO back to the island. The migration is 1 way. CD that is why schooling in CWB has been a major issue this year. The no of applications that was 5% more than the seats jumped to 100% more than the no of seats for the coming school year.
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cd
15 yrs ago
I know, apparently CWBS had 160 category 1 applications for 120 places this year. Even having a sibling in the school was no guarantee.
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If you work on Hong Kong island, I suggest to take a look at Mui Wo.
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Axptguy38, it is NOT the shed hair that causes the allergic reaction, it is the dandruff from the dog's (or cat's, or any furry pet's) skin and the proteins in its saliva that are the problem. The saliva gets on and dries in the fur when dogs lick themselves, and the protein particles and dandruff spread in the air when the dog moves around, shakes itself or is brushed etc.
As to the actual question about village living, I have lived in village houses for all my 15 years in Hong Kong and would never even consider a highrise. Presently in a village house along Tai Po Road between Shatin and Tai Po, I have 700sqf, a big balcony and a roof top for $5K a month. Villagers are nice (well maybe having a local for a husband and some Cantonese conversational skills have helped build the relationship).
The house is "independent" standing, meaning there's several meters open space between mine and the neighboring houses. Nice views of lush vegetation, wonderful to return home to the "countryside" after workday spent in urban Kowloon.
True, even this house, and my neighbors, has been broken into, but it was my downstairs neighbors who had left a window (without bars) open for the night, and the opposite side unwisely left their balcony door unlocked.
It did not help them that they had two rottweilers on the roof top, the burglars were so quiet climbing in thru the balcony door and ransacking the apartment that the dogs did not even stir.
So, take a look around the village and the actual location of the house you plan to rent, make sure you have proper locks and bars for doors and windows, use common sense and be friendly and helpful with your neighbors and you will surely enjoy the relative tranquility of village life. And do also be prepared to tolerate the firecrackers and gongs during Chinese New Year and other special days; they're illegal but widely used and accepted in villages!
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All my 27 years in HK have been spent living in villages of one description or another - high rise boxes are not for everybody and I certainly would highly recommend living the village life. There has been a lot of good, sensible advice posted on the subject, which I agree with, most certainly pick a village, which you have researched in terms of transportation links, barking dogs, car parking situation, overbearing village elders, PCCW broadband accessibility etc, etc.
I currently own an entire village house, with sea views, in CWB and I dont think I will ever move...........
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I've only got two things to add which haven't already been said above:
1) We live in Clearwater Bay, have a whole house with a garden (about 400sq ft) and pay $15.5k a month. So your $30k/month budget is doable, you just have to be patient (we were in no rush to find our place).
2) One of the things we liked about our village (Ha Yeung) is that it isn't a long, long trek to the main road to catch the minibus. We've got a car but I take public transport to work and our helper takes our daughter around by minibus sometimes. It's a short walk up a not too steep hill for us whereas some villages (I'm thinking Sheung Sze Wan in particular) are a long way to the road. Great if you have a car but not for your helper unless you're willing to pay for a taxi all the time.
Finally, wouldn't move back to the smoke if you paid me ...
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Thanks this is all really good advice. But Britsabroad how on earth do you find out about overbearing village elders before you move in, especially if like me you've got very little Cantonese?
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HK Jazz, what many "Expats" don't know is that it is Chinese tradition to offer a small gift to the village elder when moving into a village. Such gifts are usually very humble, maybe foodstuffs, or a small plant or tree etc. The purpose of the gift is merely to show respect and recognise the elders status within the village.
Many "Expats" forego this tradition in many villages within hk, especially in the sai kung and CWB areas - this is either through ignorance or a lack of respect in keeping with Chinese tradition.
In some of the more traditional villages foregoing this tradition can cause problems with villagers, particularly the village elder - I know of 1 case where the entrance to a friends house was blocked as he had refused to give a smal gift in recognition of the elders status and this wa seen as a big loss of face - he has lived in the same village for 2 years and continues to have problems.
Assuming you have some Chinese friends or colleagues, you should consult them on the issue and sek their advice. A lot of the advice that is given on this forum is very good but its very much from the "Expats" perspective...............
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Currently I am living in Tai Po Lam Tsuen nearly 1 year now. Last night someone throw red and black paint liquid to inside our garden and garden door about 12 midnight . We call police to investigate the case. When we discussed with house agent and friends they said , this is one of the neighbour did it . So I could suggest that there are some bad neighbour living in Tai Po. Try to find the house not very close to one another with more privacy . Some people who stay home without job people are trouble maker.. Yuen long is more preferable and professional place so far I found out such as fairview park.
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Silkfabrics, sorry to hear about your problems, this sounds fairly typical of what can happen if you inadvertantly upset your village neighbours.
FYI - Fairview Park is not a village, its an estate with an estate management company and security service, you cannot compare living there with living in a traditional village. If people want the security that estates like Fairview Park offers then quite simply they should not consider moving to a traditional style village.
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Thank for your info Britsabroad.
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Thanks Sai Kung Res, we are still in the will we or won't we stage of thinking about a move from where we currently are to Sai Kung/CWB. But I will definitely keep your details and check out your website.
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Jams
15 yrs ago
I live in Ho Chung New village Sai Kung it’s a great place the rent is cheap just under 10K.. I have 7000 carpet and 700 terrace, with 3 bedroom and 2 toilets.
I use to stay in Lamtin in a pigeon hole. Moved in mid January 2010.
I regret why I did not move 10 yrs ago.
The air is great it’s like living in a hill station you won’t believe that there is place like this in Hong Kong.
My daughter goes to School in Kowloon Tong. There are school buses.
It takes me 20 minutes to Choi Hung and there are mini buses 24 hours from Choi Hung. I don’t own a car
But there is problem in Ho Chung new village as there is no excess road due to some selfish builder blocking the way
There are some property agent who quote you 3 times the price. So look at small ones I can recommend you one. Try this agent BMC the guys name is CK great guy will show you great places. Its bang opposite Sai Kung grounds in Sai Kung center.
My suggestion is buy the place the mortgage is less than the rent but for village houses you get only 70% loan.
There are many good places below 10K.
Nam Wai. Nam Pin Wai. etc. If you have car you can stay in better places
You can get places for less than 7.5 K too. Just survey the place
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@cara
"that hill is a killer to walk up, though"
We lived in Hing Keng Shek, just past Marina Cove but on the other side, before Ha Yeung. Now THAT hill was a killer. Ha Yeung is a gentle stroll for me now.
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Look around Tai Po as you can find a whole house of 1400 or 2100 sq ft with a garden for around 20,000 or a lot less depending on the location. With a car, it takes me 20 minutes to TST, 15-20 minutes to Kowloon Tong and 35-40 minutes to Central, depending on traffic. I live off of Ting Kok Road halfway to Tai Mei Tuk.
As with any house in any country, burglaries depend on how secure your house is and access to roads or paths where strangers can see whether you're home or not. No problems with neighbors and after living for years in high rise buildings, I have much better relationships with my village neighbors than in buildings. Look how many wild dogs are in a prospective village as that is an issue.
We looked at Sai Kung, CWB and Gold Coast before decided Tai Po was much more convenient for transportation with the highway as we often have work in Kowloon Tong area or on HK Island. Plus much, much better value for money.
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Agreed - In the past 10 years or so Sai Kung and CWB have had their prices driven up by expats willing to pay top dollar, the area is now overpriced and does not represent good value for money.
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It's not "overpriced" if people are willing to pay those prices. It's just "market priced".
However if the house is sitting empty for ages because no one wants to pay, THAT is overpriced.
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I pay $3500 per month for my flat in SK.
If people who do no research come in to town and throw 'big money' on rent, it won't stay that low for long.
Please get a clue.
Also, with the 4 lane highway and the MTR coming soon to cope with all the new residents that spend too much, we can kiss goodbye to the green bits anyway.
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Season's palace on Kam Sheung Road? there are 120 houses in one site, size is about 2100 sq ft, 3 bedrooms, 3 bathrooms, garden, roof, communial swimming pool and 24 hr security system with guards on shift. there are some English speaking families there, bus service to Kam Sheung Rd station is very frequent and not too far away from Kowloon Tong. The rent, I think, is from 15K/month. I am not very sure.
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Ringo 321, you must be in a very small apartment in a very remote area for that kind of money - you cant get a decent night out in HK for $3,500 !!!! not in n my 28 years of experience here anyway :-)
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Agreed Mr H.............but like I said very small and remote - if location is not a problem and you dont mind the limited space then more power to you. Personally I like my kitchen to be at least 350 sqft :-)
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Bexly
15 yrs ago
WOW the debate on Tai Po is split 50/50, however many expats are moving in this direction. The English is not always as fluent as you get used to in other parts of Hong Kong but it still has a great cultural feel to it which I love. And no after 3 years in Tai Po I still havn't learned the language.
The comments on village elders is also quite interesting as I entered my village completely unaware of culture and traditions and there were no other expats at the time. However the old couple who live at the bottom of my village house (my landlords) are incredibly sweet, and yet still old world Chinese. They adopted my son, and have since learned small English phrases to communicate with him, they feed him if hes playing outside and do not seem fazed by the weird gweilo woman who has no idea whats going on. As my son and I left for 2 months over the summer, they also kept an eye on my house. After the big typhoon hit they came up to check everything and found a leak in my balcony door, it leaked on my couch and all over my floor, which they completely cleaned for me and everything looked perfect when I got back.
So in my opinion Village house in Tai Po, a great move. Yes there are a few annoying dogs from time to time but that is usually taken care of by the locals if it gets out of hand. A sacrifice I am more than willing to put up with.
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We are currently living in Sai Kung in a village house type environment for 9000hk/month. We're considering moving to Tai Po when our lease is up in July. Sai Kung is fine, but the traffic in the rush hour (AM and PM) is driving me a little crazy and I wonder what the traffic will be like if/when they start construction on the road expansion that is supposed to start in the next year or so (is this still happening?).
I wonder if anyone can recommend a specific area in Tai Po where we could rent a place that would not be in an apartment building (we've got dogs) and would be convenient to commute to Kowloon. We don't want to pay significantly more than we are paying now, so a village house top or bottom floor would be fine.
We already live in a village with lots of elderly Chinese and we're fine - so we're not too worried about that situation in Tai Po. It's the green space, rent and commute we're concerned with. Any suggestions?
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Hi Can anyone give me some advice please?
I am in the process of buying a village house in Clearwater Bay. It is a ground floor and the owner had a car parking space outside the house (not in deed). Because it was too small for his big car he has allowed his neighbour to use it for the past two years. He says I can speak to the neighbour to ask if I can have it back but I don't imagine it is that easy. Can anyone advise me how this system works?
To complicate matters he has a garden at the side of his house which is fenced off and has double gates at the front and behind which you could park your car, if it weren't for the fact that the neighbour to whom he gave his space parks his car right in front of it so you would not have access.
Naturally the property agent tells me it is no problem and I can speak to my new neighbours and resolve the issue easily but even I realise that he would say that anyway, and after I sign the agreement it is no longer his concern.
Any advice or similar experience would be welcome.
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If its not in deed then it aint the owners to sell !!!!! ask for proof that he owns the space, if he cant then its a good chance that at some point it was common land, which he had been using and claimed "village rights" over. This is a common problem in many villages and not many properties have gardens of car parking spaces in deed - many are additional plots of land, which aree rented from the land owner (usually the government)................
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Hi Britsaboroad. Thanks for your comments.
You are right that it is village rights and there is no legal ownership of the land. What I am trying to establish is what happens when the owner has a space directly in front of your house which is accepted as his car parking space but he allows his neighbour to occupy it as he didn't use it. When a new owner buys the property can he park his car in this space or is it now the neighbours' space under rules of village rights!! The property agent is vague and unable to give me a satisfactory answer other than the obligatory "no problem"
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if it's no issue, ask the owner to speak to the neighbor in your presence
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Supermfd - considering the Lands department are ineffectual and corrupt, a vague obligatory 'no problem' is probably the best answer you'll get. Trying to sort this out with your neighbour on a friendly basis is the best way to go, especially as you live next door to each other and will have to for many more years to come.
To the Lands dept corruption, one only needs look at the current fiasco in Ho Chung to know they are useless.
Britsabroad - you are right- ish. I have a 500 sq ft ground floor flat. It has an extra 3-400 sq ft of enclosed yard and storage shed, so it is fine for me and my dogs.
I'm thinking ahead... the way the developers are going and with the greed of the landlords, I see the day when a 500 sq ft flat will be 'spacious'. ;-)
As for $3500 for a good night out... I've spent more on worse and I've spent nothing on some of the greatest times of my life. It is what it is.
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Ringo - do you own the land, is it in deed, or do you rent it from the government or a landlord.
I didnt say that there are not properties, which do have in deed land as part of the property transaction agreement, I merely stated that if it isnt in deed then you don't own it, thats a simple fact - ish !
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Supermfd2 - if you have no legal right over the land your best bet is to either appeal to your neighbours sense of fair play (assuming they have no legal right to the land) and see if they are willing to give up the car park space - failing that you can apply to the government to rent the land directly in front and surrounding your property, which would give you the legal high ground, this of course would be the messy route and a direct dialogue with your neighbour is the obvious first step - my advice would be to do this before you buy the property so as to determine if the neighbour is the sort of person who is willing to see reason or somebody who you do not want to be living next to. You didnt mention if the neighbour ios the owner of the property - if not you could also consider contacting the property owner directly. Good luck but unfortunately this is typical of one of the downsides of village living.
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Thanks for your feedback everyone. I think you all make good points. I am going to ask the current owner to talk to the neighbour in my presence before I sign anything. This way I will at least have started the dialogue on a friendly basis before I buy and will get a feel for how flexible and accommodating the neighbours are.
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If this does not work (it probabley wont) buy a very cheap wreck and park it in the space in front of the property moving only as needed until your application to the government (it will take many years and lots of determination on your part) is finalized. This of course will not make you very popular unless you are outgoing enough to make your family popular in other ways. Cute kids and being gemuinley friendly helps as does employing local baby sitters etc.
The easier way.
Money unfortunatley is normally the only the only solution to these issues and if you pay (use a cantonese speaker to assist) you will be able to solve the issue.
Sorry if this sounds cynical it is the way it works in HK
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