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Ed
12 yrs ago
Hoover’s Secret Files
The FBI director kept famous files on everything from Martin Luther King’s sex life to never-before-reported secret meetings between RFK and Marilyn Monroe, as a new book reveals. An exclusive excerpt from Ronald Kessler’s 'The Secrets of the FBI.'
“The moment [Hoover] would get something on a senator,” said William Sullivan, who became the number three official in the bureau under Hoover, “he’d send one of the errand boys up and advise the senator that ‘we’re in the course of an investigation, and we by chance happened to come up with this data on your daughter. But we wanted you to know this. We realize you’d want to know it.’ Well, Jesus, what does that tell the senator? From that time on, the senator’s right in his pocket.”
Lawrence J. Heim, who was in the Crime Records Division, confirmed to me that the bureau sent agents to tell members of Congress that Hoover had picked up derogatory information on them.
“He [Hoover] would send someone over on a very confidential basis,” Heim said. As an example, if the Metropolitan Police in Washington had picked up evidence of homosexuality, “he [Hoover] would have him say, ‘This activity is known by the Metropolitan Police Department and some of our informants, and it is in your best interests to know this.’ But nobody has ever claimed to have been blackmailed. You can deduce what you want from that.”
Read More: http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2011/08/02/fbi-director-hoover-s-dirty-files-excerpt-from-ronald-kessler-s-the-secrets-of-the-fbi.html
I'll spell it out for those who are unconcerned about the fact that the NSA has on file every sms, phone call, and email you have sent... and every web page of every site that you have ever opened...
The US politicians that Hoover had info on probably had done nothing illegal but there is no question that every last one of them had said or written something that would have compromised them with someone...
And every last one of them was controlled because Mr Hoover had that information....
Knowledge = Power ...
Once again, I don't care how wealthy you are, how big and powerful you are, I don't care if you are the head of the 14k triad gang - heck I don't even care if you are the President of the United States!
If I have compromising information on you - I can bring you to your knees and make you beg for mercy - or I can make you do whatever I want.
Don't think the US government would do used private information to control people?
They ALREADY HAVE....
See Part One http://hongkong.asiaxpat.com/forums/tech-gadget-talk/threads/151603/how-i-could-own-you/
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Ed
12 yrs ago
"While there is ample evidence that Hoover used the information in his files for blackmail, there was usually no need for it. Simply the perception that he had such information was enough to keep politicians in line."
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Ed
12 yrs ago
Glenn Greenwald Full Interview on Snowden, NSA, GCHQ and Spying
Mockery of the BBC presstitutes... http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article36423.htm
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Ed
12 yrs ago
The NSA must be loving this site http://mag.newsweek.com/2013/10/11/wall-street-loves-a-cheater.html
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Ed
12 yrs ago
Living the Orwellian Life
Dorothy Comingore.(Photo: Wikipedia)Sixty-five years ago today, in a remote part of Great Britain, George Orwell was finishing his prescient novel, 1984. At the same moment a continent away in Hollywood, an American woman was actually living Orwell's fictional story. In the fall of 1948, actress Dorothy Comingore of Citizen Kane fame had no clue that the U.S. "thought police" was spying on her, but she could feel a shadow dogging her steps. Dorothy couldn't find a job to save her life and grew so upset about her difficulties, she wondered aloud: "If I've done something wrong, I'd like to know what it is."
It was as if the moody, random terror that Orwell had so vividly created in his manuscript had drifted across the Atlantic and slipped onto a westbound train for California. Unbeknown to Dorothy, she was being tailed by federal agents, monitored by Congressional investigators, and ranked as dangerous on a top-secret "security" list. These facts seemed more ludicrous than Orwell's parody of a "security state." But America already was constructing it.
Today, many U.S. writers, artists and activists undergo similar surreal experiences thanks to the National Security Agency (NSA). While we may think that our government's scrutiny of our private lives is somehow new and shocking, it isn't. America has a tradition of spying on its own. I realized this recently when I picked up my yellowed copy of Orwell's classic after reviewing Dorothy's private papers. I was struck by the parallels between Orwell's imagination, his real-life contemporary in America and what's happening to us today. Covert surveillance, travel restrictions, detentions, loss of work and worse. ... This is what happens to Americans who think differently than those in power.
This is what's happening now.
To understand the beauty of - and potential punishment for - independent thought, let's go to postwar Britain, a cold and dreary place. To finish his novel about "The Ministry of Truth," Orwell felt that he had to go to an even darker place. In late 1948, he lived on the Scottish isle of Jura, a remote and barren scratch of Hebridean rock. With little more than a camp bed and a table, the author used his "natural hatred of authority" to write a satirical fantasy about a totalitarian world. In it, eternal warfare is the price for a bleak prosperity. The "Party" remains in power by controlling the people. Giant telescreens scan the actions of everyone, disembodied voices deliver "newspeak" to the masses, and citizens are bombarded with nonsensical slogans such as "Freedom is Slavery" and "Ignorance is Strength." (Sound familiar?)
In 1984, the Party prohibits any display of individuality, and the worst crime is thinking for oneself. Yet, before long, two lovers, Winston Smith and Julia, begin to do just that. They try to evade the thought police by joining the underground opposition. But the Party finds them, turns one against the other, and tortures Winston until his spirit finally breaks.
When Orwell's book was published, it was called a fantasy. But it served as a warning to Americans such as Comingore. The fiery actress had become famous for starring in Citizen Kane (1941). She portrayed Susan Kane, the mistress of industrialist Charles Foster Kane, who was based on media tycoon William Randolph Hearst. She had rendered the mogul's paramour with such skill and vulnerability that she was rumored to be short-listed for an Academy Award. She already had won the hearts of millions of moviegoers, according to Variety readers' polls, and her gorgeous face graced the pages of Life, Look and dozens of other publications. In the 1940s, Dorothy was a star with a promising career, the admiration of peers, a fine marriage and two children.
The star also had acquired a powerful enemy - the 78-year-old Hearst. The media mogul so hated Dorothy's portrayal of his mistress, 44-year-old Marion Davies, that he used his chain of newspapers and radio stations to smear the young woman. Hearst's columnists Hedda Hopper and Walter Winchell publicly accused Dorothy of belonging to the "Party," in this case the Communist Party, and borrowed Orwellian "newspeak" to malign her. As it was, Dorothy never was a dues-paying "commie." But even if she had been, it was her constitutional right to be one. She did associate with screenwriters who were communists or had been at one time: Budd Schulberg (On the Waterfront), Dorothy Parker (A Star Is Born) and dear friends Cleo and Dalton Trumbo (Spartacus). These people were called to testify about their beliefs in front of America's ersatz Ministry of Truth - the House Un-American Activities Committee (HUAC). Publicly, union members and artists had to convince the HUAC that their "incorrect" affiliations and thoughts no longer existed - or if they did, they were not dangerous to the state.
Orwell would have loved the irony of it all.
U.S. political leaders at the time distrusted labor organizers and free thinkers even if those thinkers had raised money for the war and its victims, as Dorothy had. The FBI began tailing the actress. According to her files, agents reported her attending parties with Russian guests and giving speeches that, among other things, praised Soviet painters for their realism. But her biggest sins were working alongside black musician Leadbelly and singer Paul Robeson to try and desegregate USO clubs (they did), canvassing voters in Watts for state Assembly candidate Albert Dekker (who won) and trying to overturn the judicial lynching of Mexican youths in the corrupt Sleepy Lagoon Murder Trial (they succeeded).
Dorothy's triumphs embarrassed the status quo.
Agents began collecting all of Dorothy's stage names, addresses and names of relatives and traveling companions. Officials tapped her telephone, opened her mail, and went so far as to ransack her tiny apartment. By then the actress was blacklisted and divorced, struggling to raise her children. It's no wonder she descended into depression, alcoholism and a few nervous breakdowns.
Still, the FBI didn't let up. Director J. Edgar Hoover had added Dorothy to his secret expansive "Security Index." He'd devised a system of writing the names of "subversive" citizens on white index cards and ranking them according to how far that person's beliefs strayed from what Hoover considered acceptable. It was easy to get on the list; it was impossible to get off. Dorothy was ranked a "Category C" danger, which meant that in the event of war she could be hauled off to an interment camp. As absurd as that sounds, the U.S. in mid-1950 was fighting the Korean War and, under Hoover's plan, Dorothy and some 12,000 other "potentially dangerous" dissidents were about to be arrested and detained in prison camps. Fortunately, President Harry Truman considered the plan unconstitutional and vetoed it.
But instead of learning from our old, cold mistakes, the U.S. is now repeating them. In fact, we're expanding the old surveillance and intimidation tactics, only we're using far more sophisticated digital tools. NSA agents can access our personal bank codes, voter registration rolls, property records, tax history, GPS coordinates, Facebook profiles and Twitter threads.
The alleged purpose of this giant stakeout is not to stamp out "communism" but to quash "terrorism." But these efforts edge perilously close to punishing "thought crimes," too. The only difference is that, unlike Orwell's telescreens or Hoover's binoculars, individuals (not the Party) pay for the new spy tools by purchasing big-screen computers, private smartphones and the latest high-tech gadget.
Of course, we wouldn't know any of this without the painstaking work of documentary filmmaker Laura Poitras, American journalist Glenn Greenwald and their source Edward Snowden. Poitras is no stranger to heavy surveillance. She has been harassed by the United States ever since she began filming My Country, My Country, which documents the abuse of American power in Iraq. In 2006, her government began marking her flight tickets with "SSSS" - Secondary Security Screening Selection. This designation is just as mysterious as Dorothy's Category C was 65 years ago, but it too means that Poitras faces extra scrutiny. Authorities have seized her private work papers, her computers, cellphones and other equipment, sometimes for weeks at time. They've detained her for hours, interrogating her without specifying why. Poitras has written to members of Congress and submitted multiple Freedom of Information Act requests. But she has never received an explanation as to why she is being hounded.
As Poitras told Salon and The New York Times Magazine, she no longer feels safe in her own country. Incredible as it seems, the woman now lives in Berlin.
Greenwald, too, has long chronicled how the United States has abused its powers and eroded our freedoms; naturally, his views have made him unpopular with US institutions. The author has been smeared as a "communist terrorist," and legislators from both political parties have said he should be prosecuted for revealing our domestic spy program. His past has been dredged up, including his work in defense of the First Amendment rights of neo-Nazis, his work at a gay adult film company (critiques of Greenwld often are drenched in homophobia) and recent financial problems. To stay ahead of spymasters, Greenwald has used encryption software, prepaid phones and track-blockers. But that hasn't gone far enough. Greenwald's spouse recently was detained for nine hours by authorities; officials seized documents he was carrying for Greenwalkd then denied him counsel.
At least Greenwald and Poitras have the protection of shield laws and public notoriety. Unfortunately, ordinary citizens do not. Lately, officials have been detaining a string of women for mysterious reasons. Clay Nikiforuk was stopped for carrying a stash of condoms. Sarah Abdurrahman, a producer for On the Media, was detained by U.S. officials on her way home from Canada. They eventually let Sarah go but never explained why they had detained her. And then there's Michigan resident Mary Scott. She said she received threatening e-mails and was tailed by detectives after she blew the whistle on a health-care company.
The company was fined millions of dollars. Then the government began harassing the whistleblower. Mary and her daughter were placed on a TSA watch list; they've been pulled out of airline boarding lines and detained. According to court documents, Mary also has been denied some basic legal remedies. In fact, when a judge in North Carolina heard about the actions that the U.S. government and company had taken against Mary and her family, he was shocked. The official retaliations, he said, "violate everything related to American jurisprudence."
Yet, this happens increasingly in a country where power has grown more secretive and unaccountable in the past 13 years. Americans cherish their basic rights such as privacy, equality and free expression. Yet the fact that those rights are no longer guaranteed to all is a sign of how far we've fallen.
All of which brings us back to Orwell. He didn't think much of the king and queen. But he loved his country and its working people. He was a socialist but in a pragmatic way, hoping that the conditions of the poor and powerless would be improved. But most importantly, he opposed abstractions of every kind: fascism, Communism and nationalism. He recognized that Americanism was a term that easily could be exploited for totalitarian ends.
How right he was.
http://truth-out.org/opinion/item/19211-living-the-orwellian-life
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Ed
12 yrs ago
How much must IBM be despising Edward Snowden right now? (when in fact they should be despising the NSA...)
http://www.zerohedge.com/contributed/2013-10-17/nsa-revelations-kill-ibm-hardware-sales-china
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..your whole arguement totally depends on whether or not my 'guilt' or 'ego' would hold sway over me. Personally...I wouldn't care. Now what do you have? As long as you aren't illegally stealing from my bank account...what harm could you do...threaten me by telling my girlfriend that I masturbated to pictures of Wonder Woman?....ok....and then?
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Ed
12 yrs ago
How about if the NSA were to tell your wife or girlfriend about some side action you had on the go...
Or perhaps they threatened to pass along an email to your boss in which you referred to him as a stupid moron.... and you lost your job because of this...
Could there by comments in your history of phone calls or emails where you called your sister in law a nasty bitch - or you commented on how your nephew is a spoiled little bastard and that the parents are to blame?
We are talking access to every single communication you have made - every sms, every phone call, every email, every web page you have visited...
There's nothing in your file that could potentially destroy many relationships that you value in your life?
If so I think you would be in a rather unique position.
Wonder Woman would be the least of your worries - they'd just hunt and peck through your comments and find the ones that you do care about and then they'd exploit them...
And if you refused to play ball your entire life gets turned upside down... no job... friends and family pissed at you... marriage destroyed...
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You forgot the most basic question: "Who benefits?"
Its all still ego or comments..or pics....If I say it on line or verbally to others, I always keep in mind that such things could go beyond immediate ears. With that as my guiding principle....then damage is mitigated. Sure it would suck if they told my sister in law she's a bitch...but then....so? few hurt feelings....you still can't get me to pay even a single dollar for that.
To do this, remember it would take literally an Army of gov't employees to track, monitor, report, then create 'black-mail' on a person....that costs a lot of money...several thousand dollars USD just to learn that I called my mother in law a bitch....so whats their pay out? Nothing...or money losing at best. Its not in their interest or time.
The only one's they go after would be those that break the law...simple extortion because you have nude pictures of Jaylo....gets them nothing.
But in the end, this scenerio won't happen. But let's say it did. Once it happens to a few people, then everyone would take notice and adjust their conversations accordingly. I know they will monitor everything, or at least have the ablity to. I don't like it, but ok it happens. With literally hundreds of millions of people in the world, they are too busy with real issues to worry about a 'pee-pee-touch' of a few unknown citizens..even if the odd analyist keeps the photo's for himself...
Besides...its funny to think of a gov't office full of people surfing emails collecting naughty emails and nude pictures. hahaha.... oh wait...that happened in HK not too long ago...
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By the way, my boss is a stupid moron...just thought I'd get that out there.... I feel better now :)
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Ed
12 yrs ago
I am absolutely sure he/she must be...
In any event I will elaborate further regardless...
It would take only one employee to dig through your file... (you are aware that the NSA has facilities that can store mega terabytes of data)
You simply apply a search engine to the files (google of course cooperates with the NSA so there's your search engine)....
A guy like Snowden is told by the FBI we need something on Ed AsiaXPAT.... Snowden opens his search engine and types in my name... and just like up comes everything on me from the database... in the blink of an eye...
It might take a day for one person to pull enough compromising stuff on me... not much more...
So no, an army would not be needed... keeping in mind the NSA does not have to do this for all people in the dbase... only for those that they want to persecute or control....
I run plenty of controversial stuff on this site - and if someone came to me and said 'stop or we release many communications that you will not want released... unless you stop - I assure you I would almost certainly stop... because they would own me...
Think the US government has never blackmailed anyone?
Think again:
“The moment [J Egard Hoover] would get something on a senator,” said William Sullivan, who became the number three official in the bureau under Hoover, “he’d send one of the errand boys up and advise the senator that ‘we’re in the course of an investigation, and we by chance happened to come up with this data on your daughter. But we wanted you to know this. We realize you’d want to know it.’
Well, Jesus, what does that tell the senator? From that time on, the senator’s right in his pocket.”
http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2011/08/02/fbi-director-hoover-s-dirty-files-excerpt-from-ronald-kessler-s-the-secrets-of-the-fbi.html
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Of course there is blackmail...but approved institutionalized blackmail on your average joe...no.
Let's not forget that Hoover was ended due to a shift in the ideology of the citizenry....He had some great ideas, but in the end, was discarded as they were too 'extreme' for most..
...one man who thinks he controls all...is fooling himself and is himself merely a puppet to his own ego... (not sure what that means..but sounds cool).
Bear in mind 'Ed at expat' is a moniker......not your real name....its not as easy as you think. To link you with your real information is tricky. It can be done, but again...who benefits?
Did they make any money by giving you a 'cease' order? Nope... But did it cost them money and time? Yep.
Hoover days..they did this type of thing sure. But that wouldn't fly today. I think the FBI and NSA have more important things to worry about than making enemies of those who pay their salaries. Besides, if you attack me, what is my natural response? So no, its not in their interest to create enemies where they don't already currently exist.
Could they? Yes. Will they? No. Are there a few exceptions? Sure.
But you are more likely to be impailed by a pelican that suddenly died in mid-flight.
But I do love an occasional 'conspiracy theory'.
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But the pelican impalement...that would suck! ...and it would be a viral news story...but it would be a crappy way to die for sure.
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Ed
12 yrs ago
Yes of course the NSA and FBI would never use the info that they have on every single person in America including its politicians for nefarious means...
That only happened in the olden days...
Why would anyone want to control a Senator or Congressman or President today... what would be the upside to that?
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There are exceptions...but its as risky for them as it is for the senators and such...
but I said average joes...... are you suggesting they will use all they have on everyone on the planet? Now thats a bit paranoid....and impossible to do. not enough people in the entire government role to handle that.
Don't cross the line and suggest that the 'exceptions' are the rule. But no, I personally don't believe there is any institutionalized 'blackmail' on all public figures as you continue to suggest. This world is increasingly transparent..and such a thing would surface and be enough to roll heads....
Do you know of any Senators or Congressmen who are being controlled in this way?
Exceptions by definition are rare...not the rule. Stop scaring yourself...
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Ed
12 yrs ago
You seem to be missing the point... which is that spying on people is illegal ... it is a violation of the 4th amendment of the US constitution...
This law was put in place specifically to prevent abuses of the state against the freedom of the people...
It is meant to stop illegal activities such as those carried out by Hoover... and Nixon...
That is the reason these laws exist... when you remove them you open up the system to abuse ... when there are no penalties and huge incentive to manipulate through blackmail you create huge incentives to carry out such activities...
If theft were removed from the criminal code ... what do you think would happen?
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They have legallized it if they can (even if vaguely) link it to an investigation or inquiry....gotta love the 'homeland security' ...an unnecessary orgainization that sucks the trust and wealth of the nation...
FBI should focus on domestic...NSA and others on foreign...but the lines are blurry now... but yeah, its illegal many times I think...but they will not throw good money after bad to harass or blackmail people...without looking at their own potential for backlash. Everything is now open to spread...hidden worlds are not so hidden anymore. A simple upload can create chaos on youtube for example.
The risk assessments would likely show that both the 'spy' and the 'citizen' stand to loose....with the 'spy' risking more...so I see your point..but not that it is likely to be used to blackmail a citizen based on their words or emails.
After all, I can create my 'cheating' email using a ficticious name ..say..Kaiser Sose' and you would really have to work to link this to me...then even if you did...to exthort anything from me, you would leave a trail for someone to follow. The risk to you the 'spy' is great and the payout small compared to your investment of time and resources.
On the other hand, if the risk is worth the reward, then that changes the rules. But then if I'm rich enough to be a target...I have resources to turn the tables as well.
...as Hoover eventually realized himself.
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Ed
12 yrs ago
Ok... you don't mind that the NSA is spying on every communication you make - or that anyone makes...
You are forgetting one thing... it is illegal.
Perhaps you could answer the question:
If theft were removed from the criminal code ... what do you think would happen?
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You need to read my replies again. Of course I mind, but it doesn't keep me awake at night. The reason is, although there may be some comments or non 'p-c' statements, there is nothing illegal.
If, as you say, it's all illegal, then feel free to do something about it. I personally have weighed the cost-benefit, and see no need.
If theft were removed from the criminal code? Humm...well, here again I do a cost-benefit analysis and find that it would not be in my interest and would likely affect my day to day living..and would have a problem with it.
But again, define theft in cyber terms? Is a picture snapped of me on a public street mine? Is a picture snapped of me in my home mine? What if any significant impact would either of those have. If they did, there are other laws and regulations that cover...such as 'libal', and perhaps 'theft' or 'robbery'..
But in the end, whether what the NSA is doing is legal or illegal...first you need to have an accurate and very specific report of what they did and when. I don't think you personally have that, nor does anyone I know. The whole point is that they are secret. Not above the law...but in the shadows...until they make so much noise as to draw a spotlight on their actions.
Nothing I have seen to harass the average joe without reasonable cause...
But as a closing thought...is your personal information personal? Your bank account...your ID...your drivers license and home address? NO. Most of these things are accessable by even a country sheriff or a bank manager just for info should they need it for no apparent reason.
If my secret life as an 'S&M muppet' is truly scandalous...I would keep it or its attachment to my real identity concealed. Use your own judgement. If you do nothing illegal...only morally questionable, then I don't think the NSA has twisted interest in you. There are literally hundreds of thousands of 'persons of interest'....and not likely you are one of them. So you can play the 'common sense' card..and raise it with a 'play the odds' card to win at this game.
I don't like the NSA spying on me. But again, its not illegal if they feel the need...there-in lies the 'rub'...define 'need'...or 'reasonable' or 'probable cause'...there's your grey area that they take refuge behind to make it legal.
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Ed
12 yrs ago
The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.
http://www.law.cornell.edu/constitution/fourth_amendment
NSA Email Collection Violated 4th Amendment: FISA Court
According to formerly top-secret court opinions declassified this week, the National Security Agency has collected thousands of Americans' emails in violation of the Fourth Amendment.
The NSA on Wednesday released three secret U.S. court opinions that revealed how, over the course of three years, agents collected as many as 56,000 emails and other domestic communications between Americans who had no connection to terrorism, The Washington Post reports.
The Fourth Amendment guarantees that all U.S. citizens are free from unreasonable searches and seizures, absent a warrant issued with probable cause. How did the NSA violate that guarantee, according to the court?
More http://blogs.findlaw.com/decided/2013/08/nsa-email-collection-violated-4th-amendment-fisa-court.html
NSA surveillance program violates the constitution, ACLU says
In a detailed court motion filed Monday as part of an ongoing lawsuit against the NSA, ACLU says program has 'chilling effect'
More http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/aug/27/nsa-surveillance-program-illegal-aclu-lawsuit
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inadvertent and very small in number. This is not a conspiracy.
great that they are held accountable, but there will always be inadvertent emails captured...that happens and will continue to happen.
But not targeted at the 'average joe'...and not intentional or acted upon with malace...
If I drive a car through a red light and get stopped....the cop is after me...but has detained (even briefly) my passengers as well....there is no conspiracy against my passengers...they will be forgotten. 56k emails in 3 years? Thats what....a few hundred people affected...hell, I have over 2k emails sitting on my email every day....
It is still reasonable, in that if they are tracking a 'suspected terrorist'...if that 'suspect' exchanges emails with me, the NSA will also see my email....that's reasonable and in keeping with the investigation.... they didn't target me or use my info against me unless they see I'm part of a 'plot'..
..thanks for the cut-paste...but again....it was not shown to be malicious or over the top...mostly inadvertant...its acceptable, but good that they will address it.
We're back to.....ok....where's the 'blackmail' and 'conspiracy' against the average citizen....still don't see it.
I see the point of your post, but it's all: 'would-a'--'could-a'--'should-a'... or 'what if'...
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Ed
12 yrs ago
I believe that we are back to the law which states that if the government does not have a valid reason to monitor someone's email then they are engaging in illegal activity.
If the NSA or FBI were tracking a terrorist suspect and they found the person had been in contact with you then yes of course they would be within the law to monitor you.
But you are not involved in terrorism - nor am I - yet the NSA is monitoring our email - they are monitoring everyone's email, sms, telcons...
And that is against the law.
You can make up whatever justifications you like for the NSA to monitor your communication (Orwell would absolutely love this - please, please big brother - look at my email, listen in on me... I am yours... protect me!!!)
But the fact of the matter is that it does not matter if you do not mind that your rights are violated... the Constitution is what determines what is allowed and what is criminal...
And what the NSA is doing is criminal - this is the law:
The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.
http://www.law.cornell.edu/constitution/fourth_amendment
The key words: 'probable cause'
So are you saying the NSA has probable cause that justifies their spying on virtually everyone?
That would mean that everyone is involved in terrorism - or at least criminal activity
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You still haven't made your case that they consistently monitor EVERYONE.
They monitor Activity, not People...and yes, there's a difference. The difference is in the intent and scope.
You suggest they monitor us all the time, but I am still waiting for you to make this case. As you say.
I'll wait...
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Ed
12 yrs ago
Tell you what - try emailing people saying that you are going to plant bombs in various places in the US ... do that a few times over a couple of weeks.. let me know how that works out ...
http://www.theatlanticwire.com/national/2013/08/government-knocking-doors-because-google-searches/67864/
They are monitoring everyone all the time - and even if they were not - even if they snooped on one single email WITHOUT PROBABLE CAUSE ---- they are breaking the law - that is a criminal act.... it violates America's holy document otherwise known as the Constitution
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Ed
12 yrs ago
In a scenario that sounds like the ramblings of a conspiracy theorist, former NSA analyst and now-whistleblower Russell Tice unveiled a massive NSA spying and wiretap program, which he claims vacuumed up an astonishing amount of communications and financial data on journalists and innocent Americans.
The program, which he claims is a remnant of the defunded 2003 “Total Information Awareness” initiative, swept up metadata (call length, envelope information, and so on) on nearly all forms of communications in the United States, as well as full communications logs for targets selected through analysis and other methods.
Tice, who previously helped shed light on the NSA’s warrantless wiretapping facilities at AT&T switching offices, said in a Wednesday interview with MSNBC’s Keith Olbermann that the NSA “had access to all Americans' communications -- faxes, phone calls, and their computer communications.”
“It didn't matter whether you were in Kansas, in the middle of the country, and you never made foreign communications at all. They monitored all communications.”
http://www.dailytech.com/Whistleblower+Says+NSA+Monitors+Everybody+Targets+Reporters+and+Dissidents/article14038.htm
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Thank you.
You just made my point:
..."Tell you what - try emailing people saying that you are going to plant bombs in various places in the US ... do that a few times over a couple of weeks.. let me know how that works out ..."
THIS IS THE MONITORING OF ACTIVITY....not random people.
They don't open a phone book and choose a victim...they monitor activity and analyze that based on what they feel is 'threat' or not.
...they have access...but do they monitor and track it? No....only based on 'threat'....
So there you have it Ed, an email about how a tree looks beautiful in the sun could get read, but nothing will happen and it will be forgotten...
rambling on about specific threats may get closer scrutiny...but in either case...they didn't choose the 'person' randomly ...it was based on 'activity..or content'...
So that's that. Thank's for the conversation though.
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Ed
12 yrs ago
Ummm... you kinda have to be monitoring everyone and everything if you are going to pick up random emails about bombs...
Anyways... good that you feel that I've made your point...
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key words are information mining...not by focus on names... monitoring everything they can, sure.
But where we differ is that you seem to believe its active monitoring with malace of all persons ... I see passive activity scanning with active monitoring of ''persons of interest'...no generalized malace of the citizenry..
I'd say we both made our points well enough...
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Ed
12 yrs ago
Is the leader of Angela Merkel a suspected Terrorist?
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-24647268
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Ed
12 yrs ago
The Big Picture here...
The US is running out of friends and respect ... quickly... the country's politics are sclerotic... it's financial situation is perilous and worsening... it is abusing allies by spying on them...
As Ye Sow, So Shall Ye Reap
http://paulcraigroberts.org/2013/10/23/ye-sow-shall-ye-reap-paul-craig-roberts/
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cut-paste opinion pieces are like tongues (most people have them).
But before you could pass proper judgement, you would need to know both sides of a story. You only link to one.
Your big picture is flawed. Always ask yourself; "Who benefits?". Your links have much to gain by spreading their half-researched pieces...one of them politically. Opinion and fact don't speak the same of your claims.
Bear in mind that all the major countries spy on each other. That's no secret and hasn't been for many decades. Yes friends keep tabs on friends. And in an international world that shrinks by the year, all our interests are intertwined.
The US is a focal point because of its place in the world. And contrary to your claim...is not in as bad a shape as you may think. Consider that it maintains influence throughout the world, and standing armies in many countries....even when its government was shut down....really think about that feat...no other country can do that....with interests on the ground in several countries, yes the US will likely do what they can to protect those interests. but we are not discussing its physical presence...just the 'spy' bit....
The NSA and FBI may consider someone a person of interest who is not a terrorist. Yes Ed, there are more crimes and investigations in the world going on that don't actually involve terrorism.
For example; A head of a financial company.....investigated......hummm.....given that banks stole trillions only a few years ago....YES I'd say they also need to be under scrutiny.....would you disagree here too?
And the Merkel article is an opinion piece. I don't see where the US admitted to any tapping. But I did see where Obama denied it happened to her. Did you convienently skip over that piece? Perhaps your reading what you want in an article and not looking objectively.
And don't forget incidentals...if I cast a fishing net for tuna...I may snare a dolphin....did I intend on that...will I release it if I can...of course...
You consistently paste opinion links that show one side of an arguement...and disregard any information even within that SAME article that would go against your agenda.....
Gee....a bit paranoid are we Ed...
(poking in fun Ed....not trying to offend you or be personal... :)
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I agree that its over the top these days. But I see the arguements on both sides, and I think we are several years away from a single defining line. these rules and new policies are new and the ink hasn't dried yet.
They will over-step their authority time and again. Like a small child pushing the limits, it will take time to really reign in this whole thing. But then again, as it is a shadow endeavor, it will always be taking more than its telling.
Everyone does it for some very good reasons. Countries have been built on spying. Entire economies depend on it.
Legal or no, its not politics or military strength that defines the world and keeps it in check...its business....money is the system of value that keeps the balance and resourses in one's own pocket.
to keep natural resources is the top priority...money ensures that for now...so money is the object of desire....and spying (not pathetic political spying) within corporations is the tool to that end. It's not James Bond....its Joe Smith working at Apple...
All developed countries are actively involved in corporate espionage to the highest degree they can get away with.
Spying by definition isn't concerned with an 'even playing field'...it will be done...you can fight it and win (I hope we all can)...but you never really win...you just identify weaknesses in the spy system that are soon fixed ...and they are back up and running again...harder to find this time. Like water is wet...spying was and will always be a part of the human condition...
(but I'm not truly sure that water is wet...given that Antartica is the driest continent on the planet)...just sayin'
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Fair..just...right... nope its not.
But then its unavoidable. Even as we know what is 'just and fair', we cannot operate in that manor.
The human condition dictates that we preserve our own interests (There is no utopia of fairness and honesty). People will always try to gain advantage over each other...some are more easily swayed into using 'unfair' means to do it than others.
Personally, I vote for zombie appocolypse..
Power serves people....but themselves first. Freedom is a perceived notion...you are free until they say your not...do you have recourse, sure. Will it be effective...depends on how bad they want you. That's the reality.
How we behave in a society is based largely on our collective belief of what is 'right and reasonable'. If large numbers of people disregarded our 'norms'..there would be chaos. That is the part that keeps those with the 'power' in check. To disregard on too large a scale by those in 'power' they risk loosing power...so they have to watch themselves as much as those around them. Like a see-saw...
Values are personal or cultural beliefs. We value life yet take it based on what we consider reasonable in a society. Freedom isn't a big pie you take home. It's the little bite here and there that you can gain...a taste or hope of something you have a great faith in.
Sovereignty is good, unless it is seen as a threat..then its put in 'check'...its the spy that gathers the info to determine if it 'is' in 'check'.
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It's a big issue...best not to loose sleep over it.
But the person watching the watcher is......the watchers watcher. :)
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Ed
11 yrs ago
This is a great point:
And people were upset at Google inadvertently capturing data as they were mapping neighbourhoods - it pales in comparison (very much so!).
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Ed
11 yrs ago
NSA monitored calls of 35 world leaders after US official handed over contacts
• Exclusive: Agency given numbers by government official
• NSA encourages departments to share their 'Rolodexes'
• Surveillance produced 'little intelligence', memo acknowledges
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/oct/24/nsa-surveillance-world-leaders-calls
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While they likely got many phone numbers. It is equally as likely (when they learned who the numbers belonged to) they chose not to monitor all of them.
This op piece suggests they monitored based on the the fact that they were given numbers. I don't see how one means the other.
Cause and effect are not established, only implied.
I didn't see any real evidence of that.
Perhaps in the future we can consider a wider range of 'cut paste' sources? It's curious that the 'guardian' or 'huffington' are the main quoted article mines.
My grandmother gave me a fruitcake....but let's not assume I actually ate it ;)
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Ed
11 yrs ago
How about the copy paste from the US Constitution - that thing that the NSA is violating every time they monitor anyone's communication without just cause ...
As in if you have not done anything that would make you a suspect in a crime - the government is not allowed to spy on you. And if they do that is a violation of the constitution i.e. they have committed a criminal act.
Clearly you have no problem with that...
I assume you also have no problem with the fact that the US has violated another fundamental right of its citizens - the right of habeas corpuse... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hedges_v._Obama
The government can - legally - now pick anyone they like off the street - throw then in a dungeon - and that person's family does not have to be informed - they get no legal representation - no court hearing... they just disappear into the bowels of the earth...
Does that not bother you? Oh but of course the US government would never use this to go after an innocent person... no doubt many thought that about the Stasi, the SS, the KGB, SAVAK, etc. etc etc...
When you remove the laws meant to safe guard freedoms... you open the door to abuse...
Terrorism is almost non-existent in the US - and it's not because of NSA spying (they were spying long before 911 - and they have not caught a single terrorist or stopped an act)
So if not terrorism why are they doing this?
This article speaks to that:
From a blog:
Now I’m someone who certainly believes in laws and such laws applying to everyone equally. I think the entirity of the Bill of Rights of the Constitution are absolutely essential. I also believe in the saying: “No Victim, No Crime.” Taking it a step further, I do no have a problem with societies and communities actively taking measures to protect themselves from both outside and inside threats as long as such measures are consistent with a free people. However, such protective measures cannot and should not be seen in a vacuum.
For example, after all we have witnessed in the past few years, is there any reason whatsoever that a rational human being would trust the U.S. government and intelligence agencies on anything? No, there isn’t. So then why would you trust them to protect you? Why would you trust them to use the Big Brother surveillance grid for your best interests, rather than as a totalitarian tool to squash dissent?
I find it incredibly bizarre that so many people who will claim in polls to distrust the government, will at the same time support the police state grid being built around them. Why? Fear. Fear of terrorists. A fear that has been nurtured and encouraged by the very government frantically trying to have every human being on the planet on watch 24/7. While in my mind the trade-off between “safety and freedom” should always err toward freedom, there are times when it must even more aggressively bend in that direction. I believe that to be the case today since we have a government and elite power structure of oligarchs that has proven itself to be beyond corrupt and beyond morality.
These folks do not care about the country, or the Constitution, the poor and middle class or civil society. Their actions have proved without a shadow of a doubt that they care about nothing but themselves and furthering their wealth and power. They are not constructing the largest surveillance society in human history to protect you, they are doing it to protect them. From you. The sooner we all recognize this, the better.
http://libertyblitzkrieg.com/2013/10/24/dangerous-freedom-vs-peaceful-slavery/
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Reread my posts Ed,
Of course its wrong if its wrong. I just don't by your 'gloom and doom' theory.
But feel free to pick from numerous examples as you state (ref: Hedges V Obama)...and express your opinion.
But again, realize that although you have a problem with that issue, it HAS and IS going through the proper channels of the court system. After all, since we are assuming things..may I assume you are ok that the courts handle intrepetation of laws still?
That fact that you reference issues that are in fact in the open and within the court system...doesn't that say that things are still held accountable and in good order?
Whether you agree or not with the decisions...it is the proper way to handle them. The opton would be a police state...and I'll assume you don't support that Ed.
You 'assume' I have no problem with people who are totally innocent being spyed on. Well, let's take away the 'hysteria..and artificial hype' of your arguement....
common sense would dictate that any spy agency wouldn''t actively commit resources to actively pursue someone who has done nothing... seems a bit silly Ed.
They may look for a bit, but finding nothing...move on. But again its a big series of agencies...so sometimes mistakes happen.
It's easy to say we should err on the side of openess and freedoms...but if it were a 50/50 risk....I would err on the side of caution...at least in the sense of extended monitoring until that risk were much lower...
your blog is simply another op piece. blah blah...we all have opinions.
But in the end, domestic USA is safer than domestic Yemen..or Iraq...wouldn't you agree? That sheer absence of chaos and destruction in the USA tells me that something is in fact working. Given that as you elude to, the world is out to get the yanks.....well.....no evidence to support that they are successful in domestic terror...so good or bad, things will work themselves out in time. Hopefully we will all be around to see those better days.
Just to be clear again:
I do not support monitoring of personal information or people who have done nothing wrong.
I do support such monitoring of people if there is evidence that would suggest they have done, or will likely do wrong things...until such time that they are caught and dealt with, or until it is determined that they pose no risk. Sometimes you have to look at something for a while to really see the whole picture.
Freedom with no accountability is an open door to chaos....unless you feel people are always going to be beautiful to each other with no malicious intent.
Personally...I don't hold the human race to be that selfless...we are after all...destroying the very world we live in...seems a bit foolish for such a 'smart' organism...We have our good moments, but they are intertwined with our destructive tendencies.
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I agree with both you Malka and Ed..
I just think that for the most part, what is done is done in the interests of protecting good people from bad people..
...my only question is..... 'who decides who the bad people are?'
That like society itself changes daily...so we all float in a plastic boat in a sea of acid...but the sun is shining and there may be a safe harbor in the distance. So I hope...but row, because hope without action is called dreaming...
Sometimes I think that if I wrote childrens books....I would be arrested for being too dark..(but in a happy way)..but then I was brought up on the Grimm Brothers...
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Ed
11 yrs ago
I think you touch on a key point...
As Hedges states - journalists are no longer safe - nor are whistle blowers... the government is spying on them... and if they were planning to write an investigative piece on wrong-doing or expose an illegal act and the govt found out ...
They could simply label that person a terrorist or a threat to America ... and they can disappear them into a torture chamber...
And that person has zero recourse - and it was your brother or sister... and you tried to help them... then you might also be labelled a terrorist ... and follow them into the gulag.
At the end of the day many people have fought, suffered and died for freedoms that we take for granted.
Yet so many are willing to stand by in apathy as these freedoms are stripped away.
We do so at our peril...
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again, make the case for active ongoing monitoring of 'innocents' I see and agree that the NSA has monitored innocents...but where I disagree, is that they are active in utilizing their physical assets to keep an active eye on them.
And lets not be silly.... just because the NSA looks or listens to someone, doesn't make them bad. If they open a case and consistently monitor...still...doesn't mean they are bad...and if they find nothing...we have a reasonable expectation that they will back off.
I am very clear when I say that just to be looked at doesn't make a person bad....that's why they are called investigations...not prosecutions....
Freedoms stripped away...of course not. I don't want that. You need to read my posts, then you won't suggest such things.
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"...You clearly wish to live in the child's world or see the world through rose-tinted glasses. A toast of Rose to you for making up your own mind after you gain access to 'facts' - living in a free society affords you that luxury not available in so many others....."
please elaborate...I'm all ears Malka :)
By the way, I paid for my right to live in a free society many times over. Did you?
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Ed
11 yrs ago
" I see and agree that the NSA has monitored innocents"
So you see that the NSA is violating the 4th Amendment - they are committing a criminal act.
It does not matter what they do with the info - it is the act of monitoring that is the criminal act.
Are you ok with the NSA committing literally billions of criminal acts?
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Let me say it again...just to be clear. If what they do is illegal, then of course I don't agree with it.
That means...NO I don't agree with illegal activity.
I don't see where any case was made to support the op ed pieces suggesting a continous active monitoring of innocents for extended periods of time. I do see that they may collect data as they 'sweep'....however, I don't see that everything they do is to harm innocents.
Again...just to be clear....No I don't agree with illegal activity, but do understand that some innocents get caught in the snare...but once they realize they are innocent...I don't see any evidence of on going active persecution of innocents...
I read about the journalists...but I also understand that if someone were writing and researching me for an article that could be damaging...I would take an interest in that as well...so I understand differing points of view on that.
Again, just to be clear for those of you who don't actually read the thread but like to make assumptions.. Illegal is illegal, and I don't support that. That is why we have courts...and from the articles that keep getting pasted...I see the courts are working as they should.
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-----------------------------------
Malka:
"...Law breaking is law breaking.
NSA HAS NO RIGHT TO LOOK OR LISTEN IN ON PRIVATE INDIVIDUALS. You seem stuck here..."
----------------------------------
Me: You need to read my thread comments before you write. No worries. I stated many times before, and to save you the trouble of actually researching something before you comment, here it is again....ready....
NSA has no right to look or listen in on private individuals WITHOUT CAUSE..
...don't forget the last part.
With cause...I believe they in fact DO have a right. But we can agree to disagree on that.
---------------------------------
Malka:
"...Investigations without people knowing is bad and not what people voted for. If you like it, move to N Korea or your own island where you can be a law unto yourself...."
-----------------------------------
Me: So your saying that investigations without people knowing is bad?
That is contrary to the whole point of an investigation isn't it? But ok, if you believe people under investigation should be informed and aware that an investigation is taking place regarding them
Explain what would happen if a 'suspected serial killer' was under surveillance...and (as you suggest)...a person knocks on their door to inform them that they are under surveillance. What would they do?
...should murderers, rapists, and other criminals be aware of investigations at the time they are investigated?
I would say NO.
As it would be counter productive to catching most criminals wouldn't it?
I don't agree with you on this point, but then...I don't really think you know the implications of your ideas. Or have actually thought them through.
Malka, don't pretend to lecture me on 'freedom' I know well what freedom is, and what sacrifice that requires.
You suggest I move to North Korea?...foolish :(
Stop kicking dirt on my shoes....and say something that doesn't involve ignorance and cut paste...respect is earned not given away.
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Ed
11 yrs ago
The 4th amendment does not say you have to monitor constantly to be breaking the law - you only have to monitor one person one time without just cause - and you have committed a criminal act.
It's kinda like murder - you only have to kill one person - and you become a criminal.
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...and its kind of like jay walking too...a law is a law no matter how big or small.
I agree. If its monitoring without just cause, it's breaking the law of the land.
Hopefully they will get it all sorted and have better 'filters' placed on how they gather info in the future.
There will always be innocent peoples information swept up in any mass information gathering endeavor (its unavoidable), but let's hope as soon as they realize they have those, they will immediately disenguage from them with no harm done.
Like a passenger in a car stopped by a police officer, innocents shouldn't have anything to worry about. But no system is perfect. I personally think they will get better at filtering in the future and fewer incidents will need to come to light.
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Sometimes, a bad thing....leads to good...
comments within Malka's above link:
"...Brazil and Germany have joined forces in an attempt to pile pressure on the United Nations to rein in the snooping activities. They want a UN General Resolution that promotes the right to online privacy..."
"...A month earlier Brazil's president Dilma Rousseff branded the NSA's clandestine activities 'a breach of international law' in a speech to the UN General Assembly and demanded steps be made to stop 'cyberspace from being used as a weapon of war'..."
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Ed
11 yrs ago
US 'bugged Merkel's phone from 2002'
The US has been spying on German Chancellor Angela Merkel's mobile phone since 2002, according to a report in Der Spiegel magazine.
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-24690055
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I have read the articles you have both pasted/referenced.
I don't see where her phone was actively monitored? Perhaps we should wait until we actually know something before we pass judgment.
All we know for FACT, is that her numbers were on a list that the NSA had. That's it.
All the rest of the chatter is speculation thus far (based on the articles and information you referenced).
But please to elaborate on the specifics of the 'bugging and monitoring' if you have any actual proof by way of credible sources..
Let's not jump too soon to pass judgment.
(It may be the French phone data collection isn't attributed the USA now in light of recent developments)..
Besides, having someone's phone number, and monitoring are two very different things. One cannot blindly draw a cause-effect relationship based on that.
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Posted by Ed (5 hrs ago)
[ Message | Report Abuse ]
US 'bugged Merkel's phone from 2002'
The US has been spying on German Chancellor Angela Merkel's mobile phone since 2002, according to a report in Der Spiegel magazine.
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-24690055
________________________________________________________
I read the referenced article Ed. I don't see how you drew your conclusion. Please elaborate to this? Even your article admits that there had been no evidence of what you stated.
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I have the number of the local pizza place...does that mean I monitor their personal phone calls?
So the article states that by learning new phone numbers, they can update their files...ok....
Again,
Yes, I see where the NSA has received phone numbers en-mass...and that likely they looked into them...but there is no evidence as yet to show they actively monitored ALL numbers given to them. Only that they have them (most of which are not secret numbers in any case).
If they stated that they received 'little reportable intelligence'..
...its possible that is because they didn't actively monitor the numbers, or simply disregarded them.
..it doesn't mean they actively monitored all of them with no new intel gathered. A coin has two sides (well legal coins...conspiracy coins have only one).
Show me admission by the NSA or documents that are not opinions that reveal active monitoring even of the German Chancellor........ And again.....I wait......why...because to date...there is NO evidence out there showing this took place....just hype and conspiracy theories...
Proof may or may not come...point is...it isn't there now...so every comment suggesting its there..is opinion only.
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Ed
11 yrs ago
Paradigms & Perceptions
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eHYeVd2pi68
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Ed
11 yrs ago
All The Latest In Merkel's "ObamaPhone" Scandal
NSA boss Keith Alexander personally informed Obama in 2010 about secret operations targeting German chancellor and president didn’t demand to stop it, Bild am Sonntag reported, citing unidentified U.S. intelligence sources: Bild
US denies Obama knew of Merkel spying: AFP
Merkel to seek 'no spy deal' within EU as well as with US: Reuters
Merkel Violated Rules With Use of Party Mobile Phone, Welt Says
NSA spied on Merkel’s text messages, mobile phone calls: Bild
NSA specialists didn’t tap Merkel’s specially secured landline
Interior Minister Hans-Peter Friedrich says tapping phones is crime and needs to be prosecuted, says trust has evaporated: Bild
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2013-10-27/all-latest-merkels-obamaphone-scandal
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Ed
11 yrs ago
4th and 1st Amendments Under Fire; "Everyone Spies" a Favorite Cry of US Apologists; War Against Journalists; "We Hit the Jackpot"
The way to stop media reporting of NSA is simple: Shut down the agency entirely. It is too big, too bloated, and too useless. It spies on friends and foes alike. And when you tap the phones of 35 heads of state, including Angela Merkel, it's pretty damn hard to make the case that US spying is about terrorism.
Please consider the Guardian article NSA Chief Says Government Must Stop Media Reporting by Glenn Greenwald.
The most under-discussed aspect of the NSA story has long been its international scope. That all changed this week as both Germany and France exploded with anger over new revelations about pervasive NSA surveillance on their population and democratically elected leaders.
As was true for Brazil previously, reports about surveillance aimed at leaders are receiving most of the media attention, but what really originally drove the story there were revelations that the NSA is bulk-spying on millions and millions of innocent citizens in all of those nations. The favorite cry of US government apologists -–everyone spies! – falls impotent in the face of this sort of ubiquitous, suspicionless spying that is the sole province of the US and its four English-speaking surveillance allies (the UK, Canada, Australia and New Zealand).
There are three points worth making about these latest developments.
First, note how leaders such as Chancellor Angela Merkel reacted with basic indifference when it was revealed months ago that the NSA was bulk-spying on all German citizens, but suddenly found her indignation only when it turned out that she personally was also targeted. That reaction gives potent insight into the true mindset of many western leaders.
Second, all of these governments keep saying how newsworthy these revelations are, how profound are the violations they expose, how happy they are to learn of all this, how devoted they are to reform. If that's true, why are they allowing the person who enabled all these disclosures – Edward Snowden – to be targeted for persecution by the US government for the "crime" of blowing the whistle on all of this?
Third, is there any doubt at all that the US government repeatedly tried to mislead the world when insisting that this system of suspicionless surveillance was motivated by an attempt to protect Americans from The Terrorists™?
Speaking of an inability to maintain claims with a straight face, how are American and British officials, in light of their conduct in all of this, going to maintain the pretense that they are defenders of press freedoms and are in a position to lecture and condemn others for violations?
In what might be the most explicit hostility to such freedoms yet – as well as the most unmistakable evidence of rampant panic – the NSA's director, General Keith Alexander, actually demanded Thursday that the reporting being done by newspapers around the world on this secret surveillance system be halted.
Recall that it was Glenn Greenwald who broke the NSA spy story episode with leaks from Edward Snowden.
As one might expect from criminal agencies, the NSA is fighting back, with an attack on constitutional rights.
http://globaleconomicanalysis.blogspot.com/2013/10/4th-and-1st-amendments-under-fire.html?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+MishsGlobalEconomicTrendAnalysis+%28Mish%27s+Global+Economic+Trend+Analysis%29
Keith Alexander Says The US Gov't Needs To Figure Out A Way To Stop Journalists From Reporting On Snowden Leaks
https://www.techdirt.com/articles/20131024/18093325010/keith-alexander-says-us-govt-needs-to-figure-out-way-to-stop-journalists-reporting-snowden-leaks.shtml
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Ed
11 yrs ago
More from the nut house.....
A key Republican lawmaker says European citizens must be grateful that US National Security Agency spied on them because the American surveillance activities are keeping them safe.
"If the French citizens knew exactly what that was about, they would be applauding and popping champagne corks. It's a good thing. It keeps the French safe. It keeps the US safe. It keeps our European allies safe," said House Intelligence Committee chairman, Representative Mike Rogers, (R-Mich.)
The GOP congressman made the incendiary remarks in an interview with CNN as outrage grows around the globe over reports of US spying on both the ordinary people and world leaders.
More http://www.presstv.ir/detail/2013/10/28/331647/europe-should-be-grateful-for-us-spying/
This stuff might convince a great number of Americans... but it does not play well with the world...
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Ed
11 yrs ago
U.S. NSA spied on 60 million Spanish phone calls in a month
http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/10/28/us-spain-nsa-idUSBRE99R0AJ20131028
Of course all of these were made by terrorists... and the NSA was able to identify how many terrorists that month? How many arrests were made?
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Ed,
Investigations by their nature are 'fact finding' endeavors. Of course not everyone looked at gets arrested. I read your article. There is no evidence mentioned that supports your claims.
Even the Spanish who reference the documents 'mentioning' this issues are specific enough to say: "they did NOT track the contents of the calls".
Only that they took place. That's NOT spying.
Every telephone company on the planet does what the NSA was accused of; 'Tracking the duration of a call and its location'. That's not spying...If it is, why aren't you accusing your phone company of spying?
Again...lists and lists of Opinion pieces with NO meat. Let me know when you get real information.
Oh, and for someone who is so against the 'big brother' police state...........you sure are fast to spread unfounded rumors and pass judgment before any of the facts are in....ANY of the facts...be careful not to become what you despise.
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Ed
11 yrs ago
Designer... apparently nothing can convince you that what the NSA is doing is criminal...
So all I can say is that thankfully we have people like Edward Snowden - who has sacrificed his entire life even though a large proportion of the population prefers to ignore his evidence and warnings... and instead welcomes Big Brother and the stripping back of our freedoms and privacy...
As Snowden drip-feeds his hugely damaging revelations hopefully he delivers death to the surveillance state by a thousand cuts...
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Yeah. I kind of prefer facts to hype...I'm funny that way Ed.
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Ed
11 yrs ago
The Pope is a Terrorist Suspect!
US 'spied on Vatican in run-up to conclave'
US spy agency allegedly eavesdropped on cardinals before March conclave to elect new pope, Italian magazine claims.
http://www.aljazeera.com/news/europe/2013/10/us-spied-vatican-run-up-conclave-2013103015834540291.html
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sounds like another opinion piece....aljazeera..now there's a paper with no 'Agenda' aye Ed. ;)
But I'll hang out til the end...hoping for some sliver of 'documented conspiracy'.....again...another week passes and nothing...
Understand something very basic;
'just because they listen doesn't make you a criminal or terrorist'...it means they may be information gathering...(or in the case of this story..may be total BS...as was the French claims as will be many others when the facts come out).
I believe in the court system (its not perfect) in that no one is guilty until they have had 'due process'.
But in all your posts, you keep suggesting that if someone is 'spied on' that makes them a terrorist...that's rubbish. Again, spying is information gathering..its not the court system.
By the way, your link is empty of any facts. All it really claims is that their numbers may have been captured in a gathering of intel. NOT that ANY spying is done.
Using your logic Ed:
I have a can of blue spray paint....therefore....all vandalism commited with blue spray paint must be from me..... See how silly that sounds.
Even the Vatican doesn't buy the Aljazeera claims.... looking for facts please...Something that isn't just drawing lines from A to B without any proof at all....
I'm beginning to think your 'Big Brother'.....At least the NSA is intel gathering...not across the board condeming ...aye..
by the way...you know we share the same opinion about this issue...but from two different angles. But again, I don't support illegal activities outright, and I'm not the NSA defender..just seeing things as they are..not from a 'panic' outlook.
Cheers... :)
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Let's balance a bit (your posts are ALL one sided)...try this link:
NSA: 'Over 50' Terror Plots Foiled by Data Dragnets
http://news.yahoo.com/nsa-over-50-terror-plots-foiled-data-dragnets-162623449.html
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Ed
11 yrs ago
So that's why the NSA is engaging in illegal spying on the Pope?
If the NSA or FBI have reason to suspect someone is engaging in illegal activity - selling drugs, conspiring to murder someone, planning a terrorist attack ... then as per the laws of the United States... the authorities must present evidence to a court requesting permission to spy on the people involved.
The COURTS decide who is to be spied on - not some unaccountable minion sitting behind a computer in a top security complex.
Anything else - is illegal - it is in violation of the Constitution of the United States of America. It is not allowed.
So you are ok with throwing the laws out the window - there are reasons why we have such laws - because authorities need to be held in check - if not they have and will abuse their powers (see Hoover - he abused his powers by blackmailing people for decades)
If the NSA exposes 10,000 terrorist plots by spying in every single communication of every person in America - and globally - it does not matter - they are breaking the law.
Those are the facts.
How would you feel if the NSA was to enter your home - rummage through your drawers and closets - read all your letters - see which books you are reading - and then tell you 'yes I know it's against the law to do this - but we are looking for terrorists'
Because they are doing that many billions of times over to you and everyone else.
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I haven't seen anything to support the claim that they did spy on the Pope.
I'll wait for some sliver of truth to emerge first before passing judgement. Having access and using it are very different things.
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Ed
11 yrs ago
How The NSA Spies On Your Google And Yahoo Accounts
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2013-10-30/how-nsa-spies-your-google-and-yahoo-accounts
Because of course - you are terrorist suspects - and they have court orders to spy on you (and if they don't they are breaking the law)
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Ed
11 yrs ago
Brooks and Coulson had six-year affair, jury told
Relationship covers much of period editors are said to have been involved in conspiracy to hack phones
http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2013/oct/31/rebekah-brooks-andy-coulson-affair
What the NSA is doing is no different... well... the scale is different - they are listening in on everyone....and every thing
Where are the courts in all of this? Where are the criminal charges?
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Ed
11 yrs ago
German journalists urged to shun Google and Yahoo
http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/10/31/net-us-usa-security-germany-journalists-idUSBRE99U0Y420131031
Clearly these journalists are terrorists and the NSA has a court order to spy on them so much ado about nothing
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Where are the courts? um....you just got the link from a Court Case.....I'd say it came from a ...um.....courtroom report.
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Ed
11 yrs ago
I don't think the German courts can put an NSA official in jail - I am talking about US courts.
The NSA is engaging criminal activity on an unheard of scale - yet not a peep from the judiciary in America
But of course not - the NSA would have the goods on any person of authority who attempted to challenge them...
And that is the whole point of why the NSA cannot be allowed to spy on everyone.
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NSA is being grilled by congress. To get to court, first you need to 'gather information'...then organize that to determine the extent and worthiness of bringing a case or some cause of action against someone or some entity.
The first step to court, isn't accusations.....its sufficient proof to show wrong doing, then they will sort it all out.
For someone who is always 'soap boxing' about freedoms and rights...you are so very quick to circumvent the legal system for a hangmans noose.....
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Ed
11 yrs ago
Watch as ....
Congress Approves NSA Warrantless Spying On Americans
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zeaNXdhzaVQ
FYI: warrantless spying is illegal - so Congress is voting to allow the NSA to continue its massive illegal operations...
But then again - the NSA has the goods on members of Congress (and the President, and me, and you) - and just like Hoover used info on politicians to control them ... no doubt so too do those who control the NSA.
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"...Under this program, the NSA acquires the records of who you called, when you called, and how long you spoke..."
Ed, Who you call, When you call, How long you call...............But...NOT THE CONTENTS OF THE CALL.
this is called: Phone records....not spying.
Congress sided with NSA on this since it's NOT Spying...
oh and .... Warrentless spying by definition...means they aren't accusing, only information gathering. You only need a warrent when things get to the point where invasion of privacy will be employed as an information gathering tool.
Understanding what the terms mean, goes a long way to understanding what they are doing.
They basically have the right to acquire the same information the typical phone companies have. And again, no one is accusing the phone companies of spying..
...don't cry "Wolf" too many times...someday we may need the real warning..
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Ed
11 yrs ago
Designer... can we get your feedback on this ...
Congress Approves NSA Warrantless Spying On Americans
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zeaNXdhzaVQ
Is that what you call a 'grilling'
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This is a data collection of phone calls. Not the content. Just the time/date/location/duration
I don't see (and neither did the majority in Congress) where there is (in this particular amendment) ANY spying on conversation content and length.
Call it warrantless spying if you want....but tell me where (in this particular case) the NSA was doing any more than a phone company.....
So your surprised that Congress allows the NSA to have the same access to phone records (NOT INCLUDING THE CONTENT) that verizon or any other basic phone carrier would have?
That's not the grilling...its fact finding...and the facts in this particular case don't show actual content monitoring of mass communications....and so.....it didn't pass..
Sorry...I don't see the conspiracy...unless At&T and Verizon have been 'spying' for decades....Is that what your suggesting Ed?
are phone companies spy's?
or just record keepers (not including content)?
I don't see any issue here worth hashing.....
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Ed
11 yrs ago
In the United States, federal agencies may be authorized to engage in wiretaps by the United States Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court, a court with secret proceedings, in certain circumstances.
Federal law requires that at least one party taking part in the call must be notified of the recording (18 U.S.C. §2511(2)(d)). For example, it would be illegal to record the phone calls of people who come into one's place of business and ask to use the phone, unless they are notified. Several states (e.g., California, Connecticut, Florida, Illinois, Maryland, Massachusetts, Michigan, Montana, Nevada, New Hampshire, Pennsylvania and Washington) require that all parties consent when one party wants to record a telephone conversation. Many businesses and other organizations record their telephone calls so that they can prove what was said, train their staff, or monitor performance. This activity may not be considered telephone tapping in some, but not all, jurisdictions because it is done with the knowledge of at least one of the parties to the telephone conversation. The Telephone recording laws in some U.S. states require only one party to be aware of the recording, while other states require both parties to be aware. It is considered better practice to announce at the beginning of a call that the conversation is being recorded.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Telephone_recording_laws#United_States
The fact that the NSA is recording AND monitoring your phone calls, emails, sms is an illegal act.
PERIOD.
It does not matter if you don't mind - any more than if you told the police that even though someone had stuck a knife in your back with 10 people witnessing this that you don't mind and don't want the perpetrator arrested...
This is a criminal act - the person will be prosecuted regardless of what you think or want.
Just as the NSA should be stopped from spying on you - even though you don't mind that complete strangers are going through your personal data.
The law is the law - it can't be applied on a whim.
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Your wrong. They dont have your 'bag if goodies'... at least to date there is no evidence to prove it. They know what your bag looks like and where and when you bought it.
So..... phone companies and credit card companies have the same data.
If you protest the NSA having this...why aren't you protesting your bank and credit card companies who have it as well?
They sell your data for profit!
at least the NSA doesn't do that...maybe that's why courts and congress haven't stopped them....sadly for you...your ill conceived conspiracy theory may actually be..just a theory
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Ed
11 yrs ago
NSA Spied on World Bank, IMF, UN, Pope, World Leaders, and American Politicians and Military Officers
http://www.zerohedge.com/contributed/2013-11-01/nsa-spied-world-bank-imf-un-pope-world-leaders-and-american-politicians-and-m
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Ed
11 yrs ago
If the NSA had a webcam in every room of your house (like the Truman Show...) and all they did was watch you ... waiting to catch you working on your bomb... otherwise not bothering you - just watching you 24 hours per day - 7 days per week - and recording and storing the video....
All good with that?
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Ed
11 yrs ago
How amusing ... the courts will stop the authorities from arbitrarily looking in your pockets... but they won't stop the far more intrusive (and illegal) practice of snooping into your email, phone calls, sms etc...
Funny how nobody is even attempting to challenge the NSA in the courts... where are the prosecutors who job it is to defend the constitution.
US court stops NYC stop-and-frisk ruling
http://www.presstv.ir/detail/2013/11/02/332522/court-stops-nyc-stopandfrisk-ruling/
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Ed
11 yrs ago
Of course applying the law to the NSA would be an aberration considering the US is violating laws on a regular basis with impunity:
> they committed an act of piracy in forcing down the president of Ecuador's plane
- can you imagine if a country tried to force down Airforce One because they believed Henry Kissinger - he is wanted in many countries including Chile http://www.theguardian.com/world/2002/jun/12/chile.pinochet
> the US on an almost daily basis flies drones over countries that it is not at war with and kills people it believes are terrorists - they also kill many innocent bystanders... this is a war crime
- turn this around - many consider Bush, Cheney and Rumsfeld mass murderers - far worse than any of the suspected terrorists the US is targeting ... so let's imagine if the Iraq government were to launch drones over the US and kill these 3 men... imagine that!
Of course, the examples of US violations of international laws are endless...
How amusing to think that those who are pulling the NSA strings would not stoop to use the information gathered for nefarious means.
These guys don't care about laws - the do not respect the law makers - and if anyone tried to stop them rest assured they'd do a quick file search and pull up the goods on anyone who attempted to stand against them.
And no doubt that is why they will continue with their illegal spying activities... what can anyone do about it?
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Ed
11 yrs ago
Governing in the Dark
The NSA scandal isn't going away, and each leak tears a bigger hole in our current governing structure, says Gautney.
Obamacare may have sucked much of the air out of the room over the past few weeks, but to the chagrin of the White House, the NSA scandal is not going away so easily. Since June, each new leak has outdone the other in tearing at the fabric of the president's legitimacy. Last week, it was the NSA spying on Mexican President Felipe Calderon; this week, the wiretapping of 70 million French and the cellphone of German Chancellor, Angela Merkel. And, according to Glenn Greenwald, Snowden's trusted messenger, "the worst is yet to come."
more http://truth-out.org/opinion/item/19614-governing-in-the-dark
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Ed
11 yrs ago
SEN. RON WYDEN (D-Ore.): “This is for you, Director Clapper, again on the surveillance front. And I hope we can do this in just a yes or no answer because I know Senator Feinstein wants to move on.
Last summer, the NSA director was at a conference, and he was asked a question about the NSA surveillance of Americans. He replied, and I quote here, ‘The story that we have millions or hundreds of millions of dossiers on people is completely false.’
“The reason I’m asking the question is, having served on the committee now for a dozen years, I don’t really know what a dossier is in this context. So what I wanted to see is if you could give me a yes or no answer to the question, does the NSA collect any type of data at all on millions or hundreds of millions of Americans?”
Director of National Intelligence JAMES CLAPPER: “No, sir.”
SEN. WYDEN: “It does not?”
DIR. CLAPPER: “Not wittingly. There are cases where they could inadvertently perhaps collect, but not wittingly.”
SEN. WYDEN: “Thank you. I’ll have additional questions to give you in writing on that point, but I thank you for the answer.”
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/fact-checker/post/james-clappers-least-untruthful-statement-to-the-senate/2013/06/11/e50677a8-d2d8-11e2-a73e-826d299ff459_blog.html
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Everyone will be angry and have tantrums...and in the end....when the noise settles, they learn their lesson and can now operate better. Sometimes you have to shine a light on the cracks in the box before you can fix them.
There are few countries that can claim to be free of spying....I think...none.
Some seem 'cleaner' than others, but that's not because they are...because its the others doing the 'heavy lifting' ..
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Ed
11 yrs ago
Snowden: Calls to Reform Intelligence Agencies Prove I Did the Right Thing
http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_slatest/2013/11/03/edward_snowden_s_manifesto_for_the_truth_calls_for_reform_show_i_was_justified.html
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Ed
11 yrs ago
NSA files decoded - what the revelations mean to you
http://www.theguardian.com/world/interactive/2013/nov/01/snowden-nsa-files-surveillance-revelations-decoded#section/1
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Ed
11 yrs ago
Interactive map of who is watching you http://homment.com/internet-nsa
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Ed
11 yrs ago
“The moment [Hoover] would get something on a senator,” said William Sullivan, who became the number three official in the bureau under Hoover, “he’d send one of the errand boys up and advise the senator that ‘we’re in the course of an investigation, and we by chance happened to come up with this data on your daughter.
But we wanted you to know this. We realize you’d want to know it.’ Well, Jesus, what does that tell the senator?
From that time on, the senator’s right in his pocket.”
http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2011/08/02/fbi-director-hoover-s-dirty-files-excerpt-from-ronald-kessler-s-the-secrets-of-the-fbi.html
How do we know that those who control the NSA are not using information they have on US congressmen, senators and perhaps even the president to control them?
The NSA is handing over the data to Israel http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/sep/11/nsa-americans-personal-data-israel-documents
How do we know that the Israeli government is not using this to pressure US officials on foreign policy? After all... the US vetoes every UN vote that condemns Israel....
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Ed
11 yrs ago
Collect it all: America's surveillance state
Fault Lines investigates the fallout over the NSA's surveillance programme in the US and abroad.
http://www.aljazeera.com/programmes/faultlines/2013/11/collect-it-all-america-surveillance-state-20131158358543439.html
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Ed
11 yrs ago
The Ultimate Surveillance State
http://www.aljazeera.com/programmes/faultlines/2013/11/collect-it-all-america-surveillance-state-20131158358543439.html
"If you don't care if the NSA is reading your emails then how about you give me all your email accounts and passwords and let me read them too"
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Ed
11 yrs ago
Re: Chris Hedges article below.....
If that law would not have already been passed at the time …. there would have been nothing stopping the authorities from putting this journalist into a prison without trial, without notifying her family, with legal representation…
This exemplifies how once these rights and freedoms are stripped… they will most definitely be abused…
If someone is suspected of committing a terrorist act – just as if someone is suspected of having committed a murder – the way to deal with them is to put them on trial - that’s a system that has worked very well in countries that have rule of law for centuries…
So what purpose does throwing rule of law in the bin serve – why shift to the methods of totalitarian regimes?
Surely the purpose is to allow authorities to commit atrocities behind closed doors – one can imagine the outrage there would be if someone like O’Brien were put on trial as a terrorist – it simply would not happen because there is not a shred of evidence… but if you blow up habeus corpus you can circumvent that messy trial stuff and just lock them up in a gulag and toss the key – nice and convenient.
The email exchanges Hammond made public were entered as evidence in my lawsuit against President Barack Obama over Section 1021 of the National Defense Authorization Act (NDAA). Section 1021 permits the military to seize citizens who are deemed by the state to be terrorists, strip them of due process and hold them indefinitely in military facilities. Alexa O’Brien, a content strategist and journalist who co-founded US Day of Rage, an organization created to reform the election process, was one of my co-plaintiffs. Stratfor officials attempted, we know because of the Hammond leaks, to falsely link her and her organization to Islamic radicals and websites as well as to jihadist ideology, putting her at risk of detention under the new law. Judge Katherine B. Forrest ruled, in part because of the leak, that we plaintiffs had a credible fear, and she nullified the law, a decision that an appellate court overturned when the Obama administration appealed it.
Freedom of the press and legal protection for those who expose government abuses and lies have been obliterated by the corporate state. The resulting self-exile of investigative journalists such as Glenn Greenwald, Jacob Appelbaum and Laura Poitras, along with the indictment of Barrett Brown, illustrate this.
All acts of resistance—including nonviolent protest—have been conflated by the corporate state with terrorism. The mainstream, commercial press has been emasculated through the Obama administration’s repeated use of the Espionage Act to charge and sentence traditional whistle-blowers.
Governmental officials with a conscience are too frightened to reach out to mainstream reporters, knowing that the authorities’ wholesale capturing and storing of electronic forms of communication make them easily identifiable. Elected officials and the courts no longer impose restraint or practice oversight.
The last line of defense lies with those such as Hammond, Julian Assange, Edward Snowden and Chelsea Manning who are capable of burrowing into the records of the security and surveillance state and have the courage to pass them on to the public. But the price of resistance is high.
http://www.truthdig.com/report/item/the_revolutionaries_in_our_midst_20131110
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Ed
11 yrs ago
Cisco Shares Plunge
Cisco's revenue warning comes after former U.S. spy agency contractor Edward Snowden exposed widespread surveillance by the National Security Agency through internet data, much of which is transmitted via Cisco's equipment.
http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/11/14/us-cisco-results-idUSBRE9AC16F20131114
karma?
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Ed
11 yrs ago
Ed Snowden's latest revelation may leave SEC officials quaking as the NSA "has been gathering records of online sexual activity and evidence of visits to pornographic websites as part of a proposed plan to harm the reputations of those whom the agency believes are radicalizing others through incendiary speeches."
The NSA considered discrediting six people by revealing surveillance evidence of their online sexual activity, visits to pornography websites, and other personal information, according to a report today in The Huffington Post. The article cited documents leaked by former NSA contactor Edward Snowden. The targets of the NSA’s plan were all Muslims whom the NSA characterized as “radicals” but who were not believed to be involved in terrorism. The documents say one of the targets was a “U.S. person,” a term describing American citizens and legal permanent residents, but all of the targets were reportedly outside the United States.
American Civil Liberties Union Deputy Legal Director Jameel Jaffer had this reaction:
“This report is an unwelcome reminder of what it means to give an intelligence agency unfettered access to individuals' most sensitive information. One ordinarily associates these kinds of tactics with the secret police services of authoritarian governments. That these tactics have been adopted by the world’s leading democracy – and the world’s most powerful intelligence agency – is truly chilling.”
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2013-11-27/nsa-tracking-your-porn-browsing
So let's say you were an environmentalist... or let's say you were an organizer of the Occupy Wall St movement - and that movement started to gain momentum for real finance reform.... (not the kind we have now where bank lobbyists write the reforms)...
Do we think authorities would not use NSA gathered information to compromise you?
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Ed
11 yrs ago
Stephen Sackur of BBC’s “HARDtalk” appeared absurd this week when he challenged Glenn Greenwald, the journalist who led reporting on the NSA documents leaked by Edward Snowden, on minutiae irrelevant to the historic revelations that British and American governments secretly spy on and violate the privacy of untold numbers of people around the world.
http://www.truthdig.com/avbooth/item/greenwald_sacks_bbcs_stephen_sackur_20131129
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Ed
11 yrs ago
Sacker is supposed to play devil's advocate --- but he very clearly does not like Greenwald --- and he embarrasses himself...
As to be expected --- BBC is typical MSM drivel --- and you don't get a job there unless you are willing to toe the line.
"We're not the kind of journalists that go around repeating what the government says and accept it as true without evidence - we're the kind of journalists who believe that the way you hold power accountable is by reporting on what the truth actually is and its the documents that reveal that"
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Ed
11 yrs ago
Congress Backs Terrorists In Syria … Then Says We Need NSA Spying Because There are Terrorists In Syria
The civil war in Syria started in March 2011. And see this.
However, the U.S. has been funding the Syrian opposition since 2006 … and arming the opposition since 2007. (In reality, the U.S. and Britain considered attacking Syrians and then blaming it on the Syrian government as an excuse for regime change … 50 years ago (the U.S. just admitted that they did this to Iran) . And the U.S. has been planning regime change in Syria for 20 years straight. And see this.)
The New York Times, (and here and here) , Wall Street Journal, USA Today, CNN, McClatchy (and here), AP, Time, Reuters, BBC, the Independent, the Telegraph, Agence France-Presse, Asia Times, and the Star (and here) confirm that supporting the rebels means supporting Al Qaeda and two other terrorist groups.
Indeed, the the New York Times has reported that virtually all of the rebel fighters are Al Qaeda terrorists.
The Syrian rebels are now calling for terrorist attacks on America. And we’ve long known that most of the weapons we’re shipping to Syria are ending up in the hands of Al Qaeda. And they apparently have chemical weapons.
And yet the U.S. is stepping up its support for the Islamic extremists.
More http://www.zerohedge.com/contributed/2013-12-03/congress-backs-terrorists-syria-%E2%80%A6-then-says-we-need-nsa-spying-because-there-
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Ed
11 yrs ago
This summarizes the importance of Snowden --- and the state of America very succinctly:
http://www.theburningplatform.com/2013/12/09/may-the-odds-ever-be-in-your-favor-hope-defiance/
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2013-12-11/guest-post-may-odds-be-ever-your-favor-part-2-hope-defiance
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Ed
11 yrs ago
US Judge Whacks At NSA: Pandemic Phone Spying on Americans ‘Almost Certainly’ Violates Constitution
It finally happened: a federal judge ruled that the NSA’s ravenous “metadata” collection of phone calls made in, to, or from the US violated the Fourth Amendment ban on unreasonable searches. What's worse, the judge said: it hadn’t even prevented a single terrorist attack.
http://www.testosteronepit.com/home/2013/12/16/us-judge-whacks-at-nsa-pandemic-phone-spying-on-americans-al.html
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Ed
11 yrs ago
America is now a police state
Paul Craig Roberts
Years ago when I described the George W. Bush regime as a police state, right-wing eyebrows were raised. When I described the Obama regime as an even worse police state, liberals rolled their eyes. Alas! Now I am no longer controversial. Everybody says it.
According to the UK newspaper, The Guardian, the Chancellor of Germany, Angela Merkel, had an angry exchange with Obama in which Merkel compared Obama’s National Security Agency (NSA) with the East German Communist Stasi, which spied on everyone through networks of informers. http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/dec/17/merkel-compares-nsa-stasi-obama
A former top NSA official, William Binney, declared that “We (the US) are now in a police state.” The mass spying conducted by the Obama regime, Binney says “is a totalitarian process.” http://www.washingtonsblog.com/2013/12/former-top-nsa-official-now-police-state.html
Perhaps my best vindication, after all the hate mail from “super patriots,” who wear their ignorance on their sleeves, and Obama-worshipping liberals, whose gullibility is sickening, came from federal judge Richard Leon, who declared the Obama-sanctioned NSA spying to be “almost Orwellian.” As the American Civil Liberties Union realized, federal judge Leon’s decision vindicated Edward Snowden by ruling that the NSA spying is likely outside what the Constitution permits, “labeling it ‘Orwellian’–adding that James Madison would be ‘aghast.’”
If only more Americans were aghast. I sometimes wonder whether Americans like being spied upon, because it makes them feel important. “Look at me! I’m so important that the government spends enough money to wipe out US poverty spying on me and my Facebook, et. al., friends. I bet they are spending one billion dollars just to know who I connected with today. I hope it didn’t get lost in all the spam.”
Being spied upon is the latest craze of people devoid of any future but desperate for attention.
More http://www.paulcraigroberts.org/2013/12/19/washington-discredited-america-paul-craig-roberts/
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Ed
11 yrs ago
Edward Snowden's Christmas message is not available for viewing in the UK (I am in Scotland attempting to watch and it is blocked)
Very Orwellian no...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eWLFwif-BrY
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Ed
11 yrs ago
Another Orwellian development...
US military blocks entire Guardian website for troops stationed abroad
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/jul/01/us-military-blocks-guardian-troops
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Ed
11 yrs ago
‘Courage is Contagious’: Glenn Greenwald electrifies Chicago crowd speaking on Snowden, journalism and the NSA
http://mondoweiss.net/2013/06/contagious-electrifies-journalism.html
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Ed
11 yrs ago
Greenwald: US, British media are servants of security apparatus
http://rt.com/news/greenwald-snowden-nsa-hackers-conference-889/
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Ed
11 yrs ago
How massive is Big Brother?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b0w36GAyZIA#t=722
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Ed
11 yrs ago
Americans, or many of them, are such exhibitionists that they do not mind being spied upon or recorded. It gives them importance. According to Wikipedia, Paris Hilton, a multimillionaire heiress, posted her sexual escapades online, and Facebook had to block users from posting nude photos of themselves.
Sometime between my time and now people ceased to read 1984. They have no conception that a loss of privacy is a loss of self. They don’t understand that a loss of privacy means that they can be intimidated, blackmailed, framed, and viewed in the buff. Little wonder they submitted to porno-scanners.
The loss of privacy is a serious matter. The privacy of the family used to be paramount. Today it is routinely invaded by neighbors, police, Child Protective Services (sic), school administrators, and just about anyone else.
read the rest http://www.paulcraigroberts.org/2013/12/30/2014-will-bring-social-collapse-paul-craig-roberts/
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Ed
11 yrs ago
Deny.... Deny.... Deny.... http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2013-12-31/apple-denies-ever-working-nsa
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Ed
11 yrs ago
Glenn Greenwald: The NSA Can "Literally Watch Every Keystroke You Make"
http://www.democracynow.org/2013/12/30/glenn_greenwald_the_nsa_can_literally
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Ed
11 yrs ago
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2014-01-03/senator-bernie-sanders-asks-nsa-if-it-spies-congress
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Ed
11 yrs ago
Yesterday, in what we characterized as an episode of a "real life magic-mushroom, banana dictatorship envisioned by George Orwell" gone full retard, Vermont Senator Bernie Sanders asked the NSA point blank whether it has "spied, or is the NSA currently spying, on members of Congress or other American elected officials?" Today, via the Bezos Post, we got the answer:
"Members of Congress have the same privacy protections as all U.S. persons," the spokesman said, which thanks to Edward Snowden, we now know for a factor are precisely none
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2014-01-04/nsa-responds-bernie-sanders-whether-it-spies-congress
I am aghast.... congressmen of the United States of America as terrorist suspects - what is the world coming to?
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Ed
11 yrs ago
Hedges nails it (as usual) http://www.truthdig.com/report/item/the_last_gasp_of_american_democracy_20140105
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Ed
11 yrs ago
The Surveillance State. NSA Telephony Metadata Collection: Fourth Amendment Violation
http://www.globalresearch.ca/the-surveillance-state-nsa-telephony-metadata-collection-fourth-amendment-violation/5365057
Edward Snowden, who worked for the National Security Agency (NSA), revealed a secret order of the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court (FISC), that requires Verizon to produce on an “ongoing daily basis … all call detail records or ‘telephony metadata’ created by Verizon for communications (i) between the United States and abroad; or (ii) wholly within the United States, including local telephone calls.”
The government has admitted it collects metadata for all of our telephone communications, but says the data collected does not include the content of the calls.
In response to lawsuits challenging the constitutionality of the program, two federal judges issued dueling opinions about whether it violates the Fourth Amendment’s prohibition on unreasonable searches and seizures.
Judge Richard J. Leon, of the US District Court for the District of Columbia, held that the metadata program probably constitutes an unconstitutional search and seizure. Judge William H. Pauley III, of the US District Court for the Southern District of New York, determined that it does not violate the Fourth Amendment.
Leon’s opinion
Leon wrote, “Because the Government can use daily metadata collection to engage in ‘repetitive surreptitious surveillance of a citizen’s private goings on,’ the ‘program implicates the Fourth Amendment each time a government official monitors it.’” The issue is “whether plaintiffs have a reasonable expectation of privacy that is violated when the Government indiscriminately collects their telephony metadata along with the metadata of hundreds of millions of other citizens without any particularized suspicion of wrongdoing, retains all of that metadata for five years, and then queries, analyzes, and investigates that data without prior judicial approval of the investigative targets. If they do—and a Fourth Amendment search has thus occurred—then the next step of the analysis will be to determine whether such a search is ‘reasonable.’” The first determination is whether a Fourth Amendment “search” has occurred. If so, the second question is whether that search was “reasonable.”
The judicial analyses of both Leon and Pauley turn on their differing interpretations of the 1979 U.S. Supreme Court decision, Smith v. Maryland. In Smith, a robbery victim reported she had received threatening and obscene phone calls from someone who claimed to be the robber. Without obtaining a warrant, the police installed a pen register, which revealed a telephone in the defendant’s home had been used to call the victim. The Supreme Court held that a person has no reasonable expectation of privacy in the numbers dialed from his telephone because he voluntarily transmits them to his phone company.
Leon distinguished Smith from the NSA program, saying that whether a pen register constitutes a “search” is “a far cry from the issue in [the NSA] case.” Leon wrote, “When do present-day circumstances—the evolution of the Government’s surveillance capabilities, citizens’ phone habits, and the relationship between the NSA and telecom companies—become so thoroughly unlike those considered by the Supreme Court thirty-four years ago that a precedent like Smith simply does not apply? The answer, unfortunately for the Government, is now.”
Then Leon cited the 2012 Supreme Court case of United States v. Jones, in which five justices found that law enforcement’s use of a GPS device to track the movements of a vehicle for nearly a month violated a reasonable expectation of privacy. “Significantly,” Leon wrote, “the justices did so without questioning the validity of the Court’s 1983 decision in United States v. Knotts, that the use of a tracking beeper does not constitute a search because ‘[a] person travelling in an automobile on public thoroughfares has no reasonable expectation of privacy in his movements from one place to another.’” Leon contrasted the short-range, short-term tracking device used in Knotts with the constant month-long surveillance achieved with the GPS device attached to Jones’s car.
Unlike the “highly-limited data collection” in Smith, Leon noted, “[t]he NSA telephony metadata program, on the other hand, involves the creation and maintenance of a historical database containing five years’ worth of data. And I might add, there is the very real prospect that the program will go on for as long as America is combating terrorism, which realistically could be forever!” He called the NSA program “effectively a joint intelligence-gathering operation [between telecom companies and] the Government.”
“[T]he almost-Orwellian technology that enables the Government to store and analyze the phone metadata of every telephone user in the United States is unlike anything that could have been conceived in 1979,” Leon exclaimed, calling it “the stuff of science fiction.” He cited Justice Scalia’s opinion in Kyllo v. United States, which held the use of a thermal imaging device, that measures heat waste emanating from a house, constitutes a “search.” Justice Scalia was concerned about increasing invasions of privacy occasioned by developing technology.
Leon wrote, “I cannot imagine a more ‘indiscriminate’ and ‘arbitrary invasion’ than this systematic and high-tech collection and retention of personal data on virtually every single citizen for purposes of querying and analyzing it without prior judicial approval.”
Quoting Justice Sotomayor’s concurrence in Jones, Leon noted the breadth of information our cell phone records reveal, including “familial, political, professional, religious, and sexual associations.”
Having determined that people have a subjective expectation of privacy in their historical record of telephony metadata, Leon turned to whether that subjective expectation is one that society considers “reasonable.” A “search” must ordinarily be based on individualized suspicion of wrongdoing in order to be “reasonable.” One exception is when there are “special needs,” beyond the need for ordinary law enforcement (such as the need to protect children from drugs).
“To my knowledge, however, no court has ever recognized a special need sufficient to justify continuous, daily searches of virtually every American citizen without any particularized suspicion,” Leon wrote. “In effect,” he continued, “the Government urges me to be the first non-FISC judge to sanction such a dragnet.”
Leon stated that fifteen different FISC judges have issued 35 orders authorizing the metadata collection program. But, Leon wrote, FISC Judge Reggie Walton determined the NSA has engaged in “systematic noncompliance” and repeatedly made misrepresentations and inaccurate statements about the program to the FISC judges. And Presiding FISC Judge John Bates noted “a substantial misrepresentation [by the government] regarding the scope of a major collection program.”
Significantly, Leon noted that “the Government does not cite a single instance in which analysis of the NSA’s bulk metadata collection actually stopped an imminent attack, or otherwise aided the Government in achieving any objective that was time-sensitive in nature.”
Pauley’s opinion
Pauley’s analysis of the Fourth Amendment issue was brief. He explained that prior to the September 11th terrorist attacks, the NSA intercepted seven calls made by hijacker Khalid al-Mihdhar to an al-Qaeda safe house in Yemen. But the overseas signal intelligence capabilities the NSA used could not capture al-Mihdhar’s telephone number identifier; thus, the NSA mistakenly concluded that al-Mihdhar was not in the United States. Pauley wrote: “Telephony metadata would have furnished the missing information and might have permitted the NSA to notify the Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI) of the fact that al-Mihdhar was calling the Yemeni safe house from inside the United States.”
“If plumbed,” Pauley noted, the telephony metadata program “can reveal a rich profile of every individual as well as a comprehensive record of people’s association with one another.” He noted, “the Government acknowledged that since May 2006, it has collected [telephony metadata] for substantially every telephone call in the United States, including calls between the United States and a foreign country and calls entirely within the United States.”
But, unlike Leon, Pauley found Smith v. Maryland controls the NSA case. He quoted Smith: “Telephone users … typically know that they must convey numerical information to the telephone company; that the telephone company has facilities for recording this information; and that the telephone company does in fact record this information for a variety of legitimate business purposes.” Thus, Pauley wrote, when a person voluntarily gives information to a third party, “he forfeits his right to privacy in the information.”
While Leon’s distinction between Smith and the NSA program turned on the breadth of information collected by the NSA, Pauley opined, “The collection of breathtaking amounts of information unprotected by the Fourth Amendment does not transform that sweep into a Fourth Amendment search.” And whereas Leon’s detailed analysis demonstrated how Jones leads to the result that the NSA program probably violates the Fourth Amendment, Pauley failed to meaningfully distinguish Jones from the NSA case, merely noting that the Jones court did not overrule Smith.
Leon’s decision is the better-reasoned opinion.
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Ed
11 yrs ago
Snowden's Latest: NSA Grabs Millions of Text Messages in Daily Sweeps
http://swampland.time.com/2014/01/16/nsa-grabbed-millions-of-text-messages-in-daily-sweeps/
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Helloooooo NSA Agents :)
How are you ? Hope you're well. Here's a little something to brighten up your day:
One day, an NSA Agent received a coded message from a Russian spy claiming it came directly from President Putin. It read: S370HSSV-0773H.
The spy was stumped, so he sent it to his boss at the agency. His boss was stumped too, so he sent it to the Brits for decoding.
The Brits couldn't solve it either, so they asked the Japanese. The Japanese, having received this same message during WWII from the Chinese, suggested turning it upside down.
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Ed
11 yrs ago
Well.... looks like Huxley was right and Orwell wrong....
If we recall Huxley suggested the masses would welcome in the totalitarian nightmare - they would willing give up their freedoms --- out of fear and guarantees of safety....
Whereas Orwell expected that the masses would resist and be put into line through brutality...
Here we see that the majority of Americans would like to see Snowden imprisoned ---- a man who has risked his life - his freedom - and given up everything -- essentially he has martyred himself to protect the freedom of all...
http://www.wtsp.com/news/national/article/353851/81/Poll-Most-think-Edward-Snowden-should-stand-trial-in-US
Absolutely pathetic.
I read with amusement how President Obama is encouraging the use of pot saying 'it's no worse than alcohol' ---- then I watch a clip on bloomberg and the presenters are saying 'wow - isn't this great - if you don't want to smoke pot you can buy it in all sorts of awesome edible forms!'
I also saw some other MSM source stating that 'it is a myth that marijuana destroys motivation'
Yes - let's encourage the sheeple to go even deeper into their Facebook, Twitter, NFL, Dancing with Stars, Xanax induced stupor --- the MSM needs to keep sending out the message that pot is awesome --- it's herbal ya --- it's good for you.... just waiting for the first pot Super Bowl commercial....
Stoned and stunned - far better than soma to keep the masses compliant.
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Ed
11 yrs ago
Agents within the US-led global intelligence network are reportedly taught how to subvert and destroy their opponents on the web. This is according to Glenn Greenwald’s report which is based on the leaks of former US National Security Agency contractor Edward Snowden.
http://voiceofrussia.com/news/2014_02_25/Disrupt-degrade-deceive-western-agents-taught-to-infiltrate-internet-and-destroy-reputations-2629/
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Ed
11 yrs ago
Here's who runs the NSA... and they have every message, web cam discussion, sms, phone call etc... you have made in recent years...
All good with that?
Mike Lofgren, a former GOP congressional staff member with the powerful House and Senate Budget Committees, joins Bill to talk about what he calls the Deep State, a hybrid of corporate America and the national security state, which is “out of control” and “unconstrained.”
http://billmoyers.com/episode/the-deep-state-hiding-in-plain-sight/
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Ed
11 yrs ago
Greenwald's new site https://firstlook.org/theintercept/
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Ed
11 yrs ago
Skip to 14 minutes to watch how spy agencies are collecting your video images if you are using a web cam - a significant portion of the images involve nudity of the cam users.
And these images are being stored.... pretty good blackmail material if ever needed???
http://dncdn.dvlabs.com/ipod/dn2014-0228.mp4
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Ed
11 yrs ago
DEADLY FORCE: ARMING AMERICA’S POLICE
US police forces are increasingly using military-style tactics to carry out even the most routine daily operations. The number of SWAT teams and SWAT-style raids across the county have skyrocketed in the last few decades. SWAT raids occur at an estimated 50,000 raids per year and a majority take place for low-level crimes.
http://www.aljazeera.com/programmes/faultlines/2014/03/deadly-force-arming-america-police-2014348442383391.html
1.6 Billion Rounds Of Ammo For Homeland Security? It's Time For A National Conversation
http://www.forbes.com/sites/ralphbenko/2013/03/11/1-6-billion-rounds-of-ammo-for-homeland-security-its-time-for-a-national-conversation/
NSA! NSA! NSA! Throw in the end of habeas corpus and you’ve got the dinner table set for the devil.
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Ed
11 yrs ago
“In the need to develop a capacity to know what potential enemies are doing, the United States government has perfected a technological capability that enables us to monitor the messages that go through the air. Now, that is necessary and important to the United States as we look abroad at enemies or potential enemies. We must know, at the same time, that capability at any time could be turned around on the American people, and no American would have any privacy left such is the capability to monitor everything—telephone conversations, telegrams, it doesn’t matter. There would be no place to hide.
If this government ever became a tyrant, if a dictator ever took charge in this country, the technological capacity that the intelligence community has given the government could enable it to impose total tyranny, and there would be no way to fight back because the most careful effort to combine together in resistance to the government, no matter how privately it was done, is within the reach of the government to know. Such is the capability of this technology.
I don’t want to see this country ever go across the bridge. I know the capacity that is there to make tyranny total in America, and we must see to it that this agency and all agencies that possess this technology operate within the law and under proper supervision so that we never cross over that abyss. That is the abyss from which there is no return.”
Frank Church on Meet the Press regarding the NSA – 1975
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