Hong Kong's Modern Day Slavery



ORIGINAL POST
Posted by Ed 13 yrs ago
Sitting on a picnic blanket in Hong Kong’s Victoria Park with fellow Indonesian domestic workers on a Sunday in October, 34-year-old Arida is holding back tears.


Moneylenders have demanded she turn over almost all of her HK$3,740 ($483) monthly salary to pay debts totaling 11 times that amount that she incurred finding a job, she says. When she stopped paying in July after being told fees she had been charged are illegal in Hong Kong, debt collectors harassed her and the family that employs her as a live-in helper.


“I want to shout for help but don’t know where to complain,” Arida says, giving only her first name because she’s afraid of losing her job. “This loan will be impossible to repay. I fear this will never go away. I cry every day.”


“This system isn’t right,” Widy said in an interview in Victoria Park, tears streaming down her face. “No one helps us. I say to the government to wake up, not to be like this, feeding off our sweat from working here like slaves. We aren’t here having fun. We are here working hard, so how come the government and the rich people still dare to take our money?”



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COMMENTS
hkhighlander 13 yrs ago
Would be nice if a lawyer could help her out pro-bono if indeed the law is in her favour regarding moneylenders fees being illegal... doesn't this amount to harassment? Can she contact the police to go after the debt collectors?


Was he a "Licenced" Money Lender? A quick google search gave this government website which has details on how to make a complaint: Read More



Complaints against money lenders -

Complaints may be made with:


Hong Kong Police Force, Licensing Office (Money Lenders Licensing Section)

Address:

12th floor, Arsenal House, Police Headquarters, 1 Arsenal Street, Wan Chai,

Hong Kong.

Telephone: (852) 2860 3574

Fax: (852) 2200 4514



Companies Registry (Money Lenders Unit)

Address: 13th floor, Queensway Government Offices, 66 Queensway, Hong Kong

Telephone: (852) 2867 2634

Fax: (852) 2530 9001

For complaints relating to improper debt collection practices, please report to the nearby police station.





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Starbucks2 13 yrs ago
Note that the HK Law Society has started up a legal helpline from now until January (not sure why it is just for a short period). Details below:


"(Hong Kong, 27 October 2012) The Law Society of Hong Kong today announced the launch of Law Week 2012 Helpline 8200 8002 which will operate from now till 14 January 2013. The Helpline will cover 4 areas of law, namely: (1) personal injuries (2) family law (3) legal matters related to small and medium enterprises (4) general legal advices. Panel solicitors on the Law Week Helpline will provide up to 1 hour of free legal advices to the general public. "


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krips 13 yrs ago
I really feel sorry for the young lady. You guys who are suggesting she go to the Police are very NAIVE. You only read the adverts of HKInvest stating "HKG HAS RULE OF LAW" I will not mince words "BULLSHIT" - The Police will do nothing unless it is of publicity or political value OTHERWISE - they will come back to her with a very CLEVERLY WORDED (Legally correct) Standard Reply - i.e. "NOT ENOUGH EVIDENCE" = The lay person making the complaint will innocently reply - WHAT OTHE EVIDENCE DO YOU NEED" The Police will come back with the comment "WE CANNOT TELL YOU OR ADVICE YOU ON WHAT TO PRODUCE - IT WILL BE ILLEGAL FOR US TO DO SO." Ha Ha - File closed - no more costs to be incurred by the Police Dept or the Government. I speak from experience === Since 1997 - I have complained of a fraud to the Police and am still fighting them to prosecute - even adviced them if they are not competent to evaluate the VERY VALID evidence in hand they should get the Prosecutor's Office to evaluate - with copy to the Prosecutor's Office (who have come back they cannot do anything - excuse Judiciary is Independent - BULLSHIT - WHY HAS THE P.O. GOTTEN INVOLVED IN THE KWOK (SHK) Brothers Bribebry issue.) Political Mileage.

PLEASE DO NOT BE NAIVE. - krips

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Susie1 13 yrs ago
Couldn't the labour department protect her, or somebody from St Johns cathedral act as advocate to help her?they have some kind of help for helpers set up. It could be that the original agents she found the job through are the ones who have imposed this dept, some agents are unscrupulous.

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Elcay 13 yrs ago
The "original Agents" are as corrupt as the money lenders.


many years ago I tried to support my helper in finding a job for her husband She went through this agent who charged her a fortune ...way beyond what I thought the placement was worth....months of salary.

I Insisted we pay by cheque so we would have some trace on this but they would only accept cash!!.She chose to go ahead antway...husband arrived ...job lasted a couple of months and for some pathetic reason was kicked out and sent back.

The employer had been through soooo many helpers/drivers etc in the past months. Much later it eventuated that the employer was in collaboration with the agent...was had up for other corruption charges despite being retired lawyers themselves....the old Chinese lady and European man who used to live on the Peak!!!!


I was told that if she wanted to complain about the agency she would have to publicly stand up in front of them in court and she was too afraid.

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woods99 13 yrs ago



Jim Fit,


No room for any kind of morality in your life, old chap? Or compassion? Or fellow feeling.


You must lead a sad, lonely, life, up there in that gilded cage.

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chyna 13 yrs ago
Slave? no one forced you to be one in the first place! your government is 10 billion times worse than ours!! and you say our Government is bad? how dare you!!! do you realise how many jobs and lifestyles of the original HK workers your people have destroyed in the past 30 years our Government has allowed your prople to stay here in Hong Kong? simply return to your own hometown and see how many of Hong Kong people has your country hired in the past 30 years!! before you bitch again..or simply stay in your own hometown and leave us be. and thats the Facts.

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punter 13 yrs ago
What's your lot in life Chyna? Do you need to go to work 9-6 daily? Do you have a child to care for that if you care for yourself you can't go to work? Or do you have a aged parent in the care home?

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tieniefraser 13 yrs ago
CHYNA, show little respect man !!! I'm in construction and i'm telling you the FACT ;;; remove all the Nepalese workers , phillipino workers in construction and domestic ladies and Hong Kong come to a standstill , same as in my country , South Africa , the ""locals'' will only do jobs not getting hands dirty , and THAT'S A FACT !!!! We don't have a DH cause my wife is not lazy , but i respect and feel sorry for them working at minimum wages where mostly serving well off HK people who can afford to pay more , but are stingy .....

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Beermoney 13 yrs ago
Chyna, Do you not realize that if you invite workers to a country the country has a duty of care to that worker and that the laws of the land apply to all, only just the ones born in the country.


Having said that, it’s morally right to CARE about another human being. The old moan about “go back to where you came from if you don't like it here” has been ringing in my ears from my country men since the 70’s and I say they were wrong, and still are wrong! You may not guess, but the people they were referring to were from many countries in Asia but a big one was Hong Kong.



Maybe you need to grow up a little, and be part of the solution rather that be part of the narrow minded group who takes the easy path.


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novie23 13 yrs ago
honestly there is no way to stop this corruption that has been and is still going on every day...we are not naive here but the only way to stop this is to control the on going recruitment of the foriegn domestic workers.but how? this is a dog eat dog world...how can we get help if the ones making the law are the ones breaking it? i suggest that the employer and the helpershould work together to make a complain and have the agency investigated.am sure the employer pays the agent an unreasonable amount. and the helper pays 3 or 4 times the amount the employer paid thier agent.and there's a lot more going on behind closed door but the poor victim chose to remain silent to keep the job.

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novie23 13 yrs ago
i can not imagine the hongkong government is not doing thier job well to protect the image and reputation of thier clean and free corruption legal system.but of course who said they are different from the rest?thing is people have faith and naively believe that hongkong is at least better compared to the rest of the world.

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Justin Credible (Part Deux) 13 yrs ago
i have to say that its not so much the HK govt that is to blame here but those evil greedy bastewards who prey on the naive and hard up who are trying to claw their way out of poverty.


Sure the HK govt could be doing more, but what? Bailing them out? Going after fraudulent moneylenders? On who's dime? And where does it end?


My previous helper has on more than one occasion paid for a ticket for her daughter-in-law, her son, her niece, all to fly over to HK from Sri Lanka for 2 weeks in the hope of "finding them a job". I think, Jesus, woman, you could have saved yourself a lot of money and heartache if you had just used your frikken noggin and thought "how the hell am I gonna find them this magical job when I have zero connections and anyway it would take 2 months for an application for visas and whatever else to be approved!"


its just village-mindedness. She honestly doesn't know what is the right side up.


A lot of the helpers that get taken to the cleaners by unscrupulous moneylenders are just that, village-minded...don't know the first thing about what a loan is and what "interest" is. Like a gambler in debt with yakuza moneylenders...they don't understand about tomorrow, they only see the chance at money today!


Its vicious, but this is what we are faced with when trying to fight poverty and slavery globally. Could the govt do more? Sure, but someone needs to champion this shizz instead of just sitting there criticizing one side or the other. Its a frikken mess.

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inkonkoni 13 yrs ago
I managed to play a part in taking one of these people to justice several years ago. It was most satisfying, until I found out that my helper had been stealing from me, ripped off my jewellry and been making long distance calls on my automatically paid mobile. hmmm... well, it was good while it lasted.

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denisiel 13 yrs ago
That sounds familiar, inkonkoni. My part time lady who was a Filipina (married to a local HK Chinese guy so was legal part time) was attacked by a neighbor's dog in her village. The police refused to quarantine the dog or even take a report saying it was her word against the neighbor. She was about to go in the hospital for a series of rabies shots. I called the police head and animal control and, after protracted efforts, got them to quarantine the dog, pull all the animal's veterinary records and she was able to avoid the shots but still get reimbursed for the medical costs from the neighbor.


I also referred her to several friends for work and one even offered to move her to Europe.


Later, I help her arrange her first trip back to see her family in 10 years as she was always scared she wouldn't be let back into HK so I help clear the issue with Immigration. The following year, I help her apply for permananent residency.


Fast forward a few years later, I find several jars of my face creams hidden in the trash she is about to "dump" - this missing items issue had been going on for so long I thought I must be losing my mind. Then my jewelery is missing. Next week, she sends a text to my hubby that she will no longer work here again. I call very concerned about her welfare and manage to track down her daughter (who she always told me she needed more money to help back home but, nope, that was a lie too). In the end she just avoided taking my calls and I am now discovering what else is missing. She must have made a tidy sum off of us and my friends.


OK, now that my little story is over with...So, yes, I agree the Police will not intervene for a helper even if they are right. I also think most of these helpers are not educated enough to know what they are agreeing to and they are under tremendous pressure to support their families. But if these contracts are signed outside Hong Kong and the training courses take place in other countries, why should the HK government expect to have jurisdiction over these matters?


P.S. I hope my former helper is reading this - after all, I did find her on AsiaXpat!

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summers2008 13 yrs ago
sad story; but glad to see the support coming from this forum.

there is a a helpline administered by St. John's Cathedral HDH group. they are a charity group that helps DHs by channeling them for legal advice services without a fee. they can contact Read More

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inkonkoni 13 yrs ago
Yep Denisiel, I think everyone on here would have their stories about being ripped off by helpers. Luckily with my helper now, she borrows the money from me at zero interst and a workable way to pay it back.

These loan sharks often take the helpers' passports, which is illegal, and there is a maximum amount of interest they can charge. So the thing is that if you are concerned about your helper being involved in this, then you need to be the voice behind her, and insist the police do something.

Also, of course, most don't report it because they know not only will the police not listen but the employer will not let them have time off to go to court.

What a mess.

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Hugie 13 yrs ago
tried to help am Indonesian lady 12-13 years ago. Blew up in our faces! Immigration didn't want to know, Police tried, then didn't want to know, in the end she was charged with illegal work, deported and never returned to H.K. I saw the places in Immigration tower that most of us would never know existed! Where they call you by your nationality on the form and not by you name clearly printed on the form! So in other words, Indonesian! Indonesian.......come here! Stand there, wait!


I saw the the agent's 'holding pens' where the helpers are 'kept' while awaiting new employers! With a bit of my own undercover work,I soon found out that it was their own consulate that was in on the whole deal with the agents! It's a sorry affair and I really can't see a way out at the moment until all concerned work together! Hope something can be done!

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Beppo 13 yrs ago
Well said Hugie about the Indonesian Consulate and the Agents. It smacks of corruption but presumably nothing the ICAC would be concerned about as it would seem to be something outside their jurisdiction and something perhaps the relevant Indonesian authority should be looking into. For these Indonesian women, who give up so much in terms of family to come to Hong Kong, to be ripped off so callously by their own people is a disgrace.

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rakedavids 13 yrs ago
these helpers are well aware of the charges beforehand if they borrow from the legitimate places, as in UA finance and others...

borrow from the black market (quick and less paperwork) and be prepared for the consequences.


i specifically have told me helpers not to borrow anything from outside and to ask me - I will see how i can help and i will not charge them any interest.

i have also told them to never sign any documents without either showing it to me or their priest.


this is not modern day slavery and shame on the subject heading as it seems to point the blame at HK, the government and the public. It certainly is not.


Helpers are not informed about the risk of borrowing from outside sources or signing as guarantor. Their desparation for cash or to help their friends, as guarantor, without first seeking information is the problem. I suggest each helper to receive a flyer from Immigration officers upon arrival with full information of their rights as DH and risks they should be aware of.

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Hugie 13 yrs ago
@ rakedavids, yes, I agree re; flyer from immigration on arrival (before they meet their agents, I suggest airside would be a good place)! I also feel it should go further with follow up phone calls and compulsory 'progress' interviews a few months into their contract. I must say this would make a lot of work for the various departments but I'm sure it could be worked out!

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rakedavids 13 yrs ago
@Hugie - agreed on airside area for the flyers.

however, progress interviews is not gonna work. which dept to handle this, whom will face the costs...? there is no way the taxpayer will accept this....

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Hugie 13 yrs ago
@ rakedavids, yes, I hear you on that! How about random follow ups? Or an impressive 'welcome' pack on arrival, with a letter to employers and agents inside? Anything is better than what is on offer now! Have a good day.....

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auslass 13 yrs ago
When they say that even the helper's employer has been harassed by the moneylenders, what recourse is there for the employer? Surely they would have no legal obligation to honour the helper's debts would they? Do they continue to be harassed even after they let the helper go? How common is this? For all these reasons we've been reading about recently ( and others related to living space and whether we would actually need one- have managed fine) we've been very reluctant to take one on although we could probably offer a pretty decent wage. How do you filter through applicants to see if they have these kinds of debts or moneylenders after them?

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NuinHK 13 yrs ago
I suspect this is not an isolated case. Where are social workers? And where are the indignant, self-righteous law professors/students? They can certainly take on some pro-bono work for legal clinic coursework .

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auslass 13 yrs ago
From my brief googling today, there are lawyers who attend St John's Episcopal church who are doing this sort of work pro-bono. Their associated website, helpers for helpers, seems very anti-employer though. I'm sure that they do come across some real bastards but what about the cases where the helper has taken on loans without the direct employer being aware of it and then both the agency and the moneylenders seem to be turning into standover men for them to?.It also promotes this idea that helpers are not worldly wise and at the mercy of their employers. I think that's a bit naive. It's a situation which requires trustworthy behavior on both sides.

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