Posted by
uk_male_40
14 yrs ago
Hi All,
I'm looking for some advice, 2.5 years ago a girl was sent to my office in the UK from Hong Kong, I was ask to teach her to do her job and we worked together for 6 weeks. From the first moment I meet here we got on very well, she is so funny and cute, I would say it was love at first sight. We both knew how each other felt, but we managed to control our feelings as I’m married.
When she left we both felt bad that nothing had happen between us and continued to communicate for a few months via email and facebook. Gradually the emails got less and returned to work subjects only.
I have recently been to Hong Kong and to my surprise the feeling that we had still existed, we got together and spent a few lovely days together. I really did not want to return to the UK, I miss her so much. She has asked me to leave my wife and move to Hong Kong or she will move to the UK, but I’ve been through this in my head 100 times and cannot see how this will work?, I don’t want to get divorced and re-married within months, as i still feel I need to get to know this girl better, we cannot meet anywhere as I’m married and cannot get the space required.
I loved Hong Kong and China but cannot speak the language, so i guess moving there is out of the question, if we did marry in the UK can I live in HK at a later date?
She suggests moving to the UK as a student, but I think this will leave us very little money, plus she would be miles away because of the location of the university.
I have no idea how old this girl is and I have no way of finding out.
What do you think about my situation? Should I leave my wife? How can I get with my HK girlfriend? Should I just leave my wife if I feel like this?
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You want to eat one's cake and have it too. :)
If she moves to the UK as a student, does it mean that you will pay her tuition fees? Well, if you opt for that option, at least it will give you the time to get to know her a bit better.
Also, if you can get a job in Hong Kong, then do it. You don't need to speak Cantonese. You will be fine with English.
The main thing, be prepared to lose your wife. If you are ok with that, then follow your heart. In the process of 'following your heat' try not to lose too much money or get married too quickly...cause then you will lose even more money.
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Bear this in mind.
If you were divorced you may be feeling very differently.
It is easy to feel lonely and trapped in a marriage and forget about all the good things you have with your wife. Most marriages go through ruts. But ruts can be got out of without divorce.
I would only go forward with this girl if I was certain my marriage was over. I would then get divorced before carrying on with any new relationship. It is normal to go through more than one 'healing' relationship before settling down again. Sometimes the girl who turns a man's head is merely an emotional escape or lifeline.
To get the girl across to UK to study is a huge commitment. What happens if it doesn't work out? If she is expecting you to pay her tuition then beware, you wouldn't be the first to have been suckered. I am not saying the girl is playing you, but there is a risk that she may choose to maximize the benefits.
If the girl is not willing to study in a university close to where you live, then I would suspect that the chance of a UK education may be her primary consideration (i.e. you come further down her list).
You have said it yourself, the girl is not that well know to you.
Unless you are sure that your marriage is already over -
Do you really think it wise to make life changing decisions on the basis of a fling?
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you should try to sort out the problems with you wife. The "grass is always greener" is a hackneyed expression for good reason. Giving up on a marriage for the dream of some girl you hardly know sounds like folly to me.
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F100
14 yrs ago
Dear uk_male,
From everything you mentioned, it's seems like it LUST and not Love.
Don't confuse the two.
You barely know the girl....you don't even know how old she is.
You are thinking with your little head and not big one.
Also remember that when you marry a Chinese girl, you are also taking the responsibility of looking after her family....yes, parents, siblings, cousins....etc....
Trust me, if she comes from a GOOD family, they will NOT be impressed that you are Married and dating their little princess. A Good Man will not fool around and cheat on his wife.
I know a friend whose husband left her for a local Chinese girl.
The Chinese girl was really HOT.
She laughed at everything he had to say. She UNDERSTOOD him and appreciated him....not like his wife.
He felt that they were soul mates and she was "The ONE".
My friend noticed that her husband was suddenly going to the gym more often.
Suddenly, a short while later, he came home one day and blurted out, "I don't think I love you anymore and There's NO spark in our relationship."
She was shocked and didn't see this coming at all.
They eventually got divorced and he ended up marrying the Girl.
After about a year into the marriage the girl wanted to go to the UK to go to school.
He stayed in HK because of his career and supported her.
After paying for her education, she came home one day and said to him,
"I don't Think I love you anymore".
They got a divorce in the end.
My friend is now happily married with a son.
Her husband is a great guy and a fantastic father.
However, my friend went through 3 years of hell to get her life back on track and to
restore her faith in men.
Sort out your marriage. If there are problems, see a counselor.
I would hope you didn't enter into marriage lightly and therefore SHOULD NOT end it unless you have tried your VERY best to work things out.
I think the Girl is taking you for a ride. Pleeeeze don't think that she has eyes for ONLY you.
You have WAY WAY WAY more to lose than to Gain in my opinion.
You are going to tear apart your family and divorce is expensive.
Go back home, take your wife out for a romantic weekend getaway.
I'm sure you'll have a lot of fun.
Ditch the BABE.
It's a BAD trade off.
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Amen to all of that!
I am usually the one to say "Hey, you gotta sh** or get off the pot!" but the advice here is phenomenal.
(a) divorce is hell. Its expensive and it can be bad even if its between two people that agree with each other...which generally never happens because there is always the leaver and the leavee! Someone always ends up feeling done over.
(b) dude...you don't even know this girls age? *SMH*
(c) no where in this whole post have you mentioned what was wrong with your marriage. I mean, how long you have been married, how mean and nasty to you your wife is or how she must be feeling what you are, at least on some level, that she wishes she could bonk someone else.
What others have said is right. Marriage is a commitment. You are at the moment, kinda betraying that, and sure, you have your reasons. You may think its love at first sight, but "she is cute and funny" just doesn't cut it. If the "girl" wanted to come to the UK as a student so as to be with YOU, why would she pick a university so far away from you?
Makes no sense, buddy. Seriously. If someone wanted me and decided that the only way they could do it was by getting a student visa, then I would expect them to get a student visa and come to the college closest to my doorstep...and I would expect them to fund at least part of it and they would have to find a way to get a job! Hey, no free ride, what they would get in return is a roof over their head, meals out and loads of free lovin!
Think this through buddy. Maybe you are a nice guy. You don't know what it feels like to wear the coat of a cheater. So you are rationalizing this shizz as being love. But its lust. If it was love you would have made more of an effort to know everything about this girl, afterall you had all this time to facebook and mail, you didn't bother asking anything personal then?
WTH do people think "I will have my married life to learn all about her!" Sheesh, ask the questions and learn the devil you will deal with before you bother putting a ring on it! (or paying for its college tuition in a far off corner off the UK!) Psshhh. If she is more concerned about the name of her university then she has kinda got her priorities according to the way you are not seeing it.
If you want to get divorced, fine, get divorced...but you have been warned...anything right after leaving somoene, is usually called "rebound" for a reason. Been there, done that. Thought I was so in love and then one day woke up and simply wasn't. Took all of about 4 months and I had to tell that poor thing that I felt nothing when I woke up that morning and it was over. Happens. Sometimes it drags on like a limp dog a little longer, but thats for people who kid themselves.
I say think long and hard before you make any decisions that will not only hurt you but others as well.
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Unless you are sent out to work in HK by a UK company, it is extremely unlikely you'll be hired by anyone unless you are real top of the range material. This is because you don't speak and read Cantonese and Mandarin. That means you'll have to teach English, work in a bar or set up your own company and compete. Also, if she goes to university in the UK you'll have every single local stud trying his luck. Your downside is a) a mesy divorce and getting taken to the cleaners by your wife b) getting taken to the cleaners by new wife and having her run off with someone else. It could work out but the odds - in my view - are against it. Also, as a Brit who has been in HK for 16 years, I can tell you that 99% of Chinese people are more polite and considerate than UK people as there is a culture here of avoiding trouble - which I fully approve of. However, there is also a tendancy to be more ruthless.
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sicn
14 yrs ago
Look, nobody is able to tell what will happen to your life.
The fact is you have this feeling to the other woman for years and develop into an affair. And now you two are even talking about having life together. In my opinion, you already ended your marriage single handedly, which is extremely unfair for your wife and kids.
Be a man, tell your wife nicely. Pay what you have to pay and set her free. She deserves a man who can truely love and respect her. And about your kids...sigh!!!!..... How cruel a person can be in the name of love!
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All thank you for your reply’s, let me add a little more detail,
She has no plans for me to pay for her university studies in the UK, she has plenty of money and a good job in China/Hong Kong at the moment. It’s me who stating that the University would be a long way away because all the UK universities are oversubscribed and it’s unlikely she would get her first choice and where I live there is only one within commutable range.
I have asked her personal things, but something’s are hard to find out, far east girls don’t like telling their age, all she would give me is a range, I am finding out more about her every day. She is a special case she has no parents alive and was bought up by her brother, she pretty much works seven days a week either in China or studying for a degrees in HK. We have stayed in contact more that I have suggested in text above, she wanted to come to the UK to see me many times, but with a wife this is not possible, remember nothing had even happened with us until a few months back.
I have no children in my marriage, my wife is older than me and never wanted children, she is now too old to have children. I do love my wife but our relationship is more like brother and sister, we have no sexual life and she will not even let me kiss her, it’s been like this for years and I have tried many times to sort it out, occasionally we talk and it’s resolve for a few weeks, but this feels like I’m making who do it, not like she loves me, maybe this is normal married life? But I don’t see it as the married life I want.
You right about life greener other side, I have found this before and maybe I’m just dreaming to think everything will be good with this girl, but going through my mind is how much I will regret this opportunity if I let it drift by, I don’t want to be looking back in 5 years time wishing that I had made the change. My wife is very controlling, I have things I want to do in my life, 3 years ago I could have moved to Hong Kong with my job, but my wife would not even look at it. I love to travel the world and my wife just wants to go to the same places we have been before. I have the opportunity to have some children which my wife has never wanted, I feel I’m getting old and I need to get this in process ASAP.
I guess a lot of you people are expats? How do you find live in Hong Kong/China, what’s the cost of living like, will I be poorer or better off. We could set up our own company, we both have a good network of contacts in our business life both in the UK and FE, I know we could start a company that would work, I’m very entrepreneurial and I know there is plenty of money to be made in China managing UK business for manufactures.
If I married her (not now) would I be able to live in the UK or Hong Kong with no visa issues? (What about China?)
I have lots more to say, but let’s see if any of the above changes your thoughts?
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Thanks for the update ... it sounds like your current marriage is a dead. And you have no children, so that puts a very different perspective on things. I'm not keen on divorce, but when one party refuses to fix what's broken you both need to admit it's no longer workable. It would almost seem you have nothing to lose.
I would advise you to reconnaître Hong Kong before deciding to make your life here. It's a great place to live, but cost of living is high. Think about what kind of business you might engage in.
True in any relationship, but especially so in a cross-cultural one, you must confirm the others values mesh with yours... signals can be misinterpreted ... spend time discussing her ambitions, likes, assumptions about how you both might live, etc.
Good Luck.
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F100
14 yrs ago
Dear Ukmale,
You asked the question, What should i do?
From the information that you just provided above, I think you answered your own question and that is "I don't see it as the married life I want."
How does your wife feel about things?
Did you ever see a counselor together?
It seems like you each want very different things in your life - it's like both of you are on opposite ends.
- you want kids/she never did (did you have fertility problems?) and is now too old
-you want to travel/she likes to go back to familiar places
-you want sex/she's not interested
etc.....
You mentioned that your wife is very controlling. Did you just go with the flow, or did you really try to raise objections? Your wife may very well have been very controlling but you let it happen. It's not about blame but about taking responsibility for your part in the relationship.
If you can understand why it happened at least you will have a better chance at stopping the cycle and making changes for a happier future.
No couple will always agree with each other on everything.
Having a good relationship requires commitment, love, understanding and give and take.
It seems like you are doing most of the giving (ie..giving in) and she's doing the taking.
Sounds unbalanced and unfair.
Hence, you seem to be feeling frustrated and resentful.
Talk to your wife. See a counselor. Sort things out before jumping into another serious relationship (personal and financial).
Before you enter into any financial relationship and start a company together, you should at least figure out her age.
If she won't even tell you that.....DUDE, it should trigger WARNING signs.
As far as you know, she could also be a GUY who had a sex change operation in Thailand....
Other warning signs, she will tell you about her financial position but NOT her age???
Figure out what you want to do with your current relationship before starting another one.
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I would get divorced first.
It sound like your wife does not love you. If so the pair of you may be stuck in the security in our old age rut.
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Ok, now that we know the whole shebang.
I say "Sh** or get off the pot".
Get a chance at a happy life with an age appropriate woman who is capable of giving you kids you want.
OR
Stay in a sexless, intimacy less marriage to a controlling older woman who doesn't want kids and is simply too old to have em anyway.
Woah.
*SMH*
OK, I know what I would do if I were you!
I would still think long and hard before getting remarried too soon. But yeah, sounds like you already got that covered.
And totally understand the whole "don't know her age thing". I mean, its a common thing here in HK, China and even Japan. They cover their mouth, giggle and say "A woman never tells her age" all coy like. Just make sure you have an asian friend of yours eyeball a picture of this girl and she/he should be able to clock them within two years of their real age.
OR
Sneak a peak at her ID card. That usually works.
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Now we have more details, I think you may be better coming to HK.
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I find it a little troubling though that when the going gets tough, you guys tell each other to give up on the marriage. Divorce rates are high because couples gives up too easily when there are troubles. They find someone else and they are on cloud nine again. Then when they remarry, the same thing may happen and they find themselves divorced again. And so we now have mothers whose children have different biological fathers or vice-versa.
I'm not against divorce, but sometimes I do question how necessary some divorces are.
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GemmaW - I’m not keen on divorce either, but I believe there comes a point where a marriage cannot be salvaged because one party is unwilling to compromise to fix the issues.
My original advice to this poster was “you should try to sort out the problems with you wife” , But when he provided additional information about the state his marriage, I changed my recommendation.
But you raise an interesting point - people’s willingness to recommend divorce.
In point of fact, this forum is full of “Leave Him” advice offered to wronged females ( often by embittered women who have failed relationships themselves ). So, it seems a wronged woman initiating divorce is OK, but a man, no matter how badly wronged, is supposed to put up with it ?
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I am with Capt Dave on this...and with Gemma too, ish. Although I would say in addition to the statement "I'm not against divorce, but sometimes I do question how necessary some divorces are", "I am not against marriage, but sometimes I do question how necessary marriage is at all!"
I say avoid marriage if you want to avoid someone thinking they own you and then slowly cutting off the nookie. Get married and it can either get awesomer with time...or you slowly go down that path of being taken for granted. Avoiding that will keep you on yer toes for as long as is possible. Things will still get a bit old, but never "taken for granted" old.
*Shrug*
Just...skip getting married for as long as you can. I mean, marriage is something everyone ought to try at least once...but if you learned the lesson once, be bloody sure you know what you are getting into the next time around. Coz they are 3% less likely to work out the second time around. (I know, doesn't sound that bad, eh? But still!)
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Mate, you sound like a kid with a crush. If you want to move away and start again, do it for yourself not for a woman.
I'm British and work in Hong Kong. I'm not married to a HK person. I came here for myself and found my own job.
Other people shouldn't be expected to make you happy. You can only make yourself happy. (I don't mean that in the rude way it sounds!)
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uk_male_40, you have 2 separate issues to deal with:
1. Your marriage. Do you want it or not?
2. Your new lady. You mention re-marriage already. Well, just make sure you are not entering into another 'package of control'.
For a long term relationship follow this rule:
The more you can stay yourself while cherishing your partner...the better quality the relationship has.
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No doubt you have all these valid reasons to justify your choice, what I all hope is you shall try your very very best to keep the hurt to your wife to the minimum if you decide to opt out your broken marriage.
Divorce, personally and socially, is taken as a huge, if not the biggest, failure in one's life in general, especially for a woman who is dumped at the age of being already too old for pregnancy. She sounds to be an introvert type who prefers a regular life pattern so such a life change is going to inflict much pressure and pain upon her. Please please please don't leave her all by herself to face and handle all these sh*t of betrayal and loneliness as a result of your infidelity; whereas you're having your arm around another woman.
I feel sad.
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Do not want to comment on the content of this post as it is highly debatable, but only to the above response :
sexyboop, divorce is not looked at as a failure, not anymore atleast. It means incompatability and an unhappy relationship which is not dragged till it becomes unbearable. And being pregnant and having babies is not the only aim of a woman's life. Also in this post it has been made clear that the wife doesn't want to have kids! It is actually the guy who wants kids and why should he sacrifice this big part of life?
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Sexless marriage for years, no intimacy of any kind, obviously incompatible - he wants different things from what wife wants..it's a no brainer. This marriage has long been over, divorce would just finalize it on paper.
Life is too short. No person should stay miserable in a relationship that can no longer be fixed.
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Well said, Little Carmen and Mike204!
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Agree completely.
There is no such promise or commitment to remain miserable. That is just being bound, as if, jailed.
Even if there is love, that basic love, similar to that of a sibling, it is not marriage. Then anyways no need to be married!
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I think we've all agreed that Mr 40 should leave his wife if he's in an unhappy relationship.
I don't think that means go straight into the arms of another woman. I do think people need to be on their own after a long relationship, just for a while, just to re-establish their own idenity. I'm in a long term relationship, and I know that my fella and I are thought of as one person. We get joint Christmas presents and if one of us likes something like Chinese food, for example, it means both of us like it.
I think he should take some time to redescover his own idenity and think about what he really wants out of life. He probably wants a bonk to be perfectly honest, but after the bonking has finished, does he really want to jump straight into another commitment. There could be other people willing to bonk his brains out.
Best not to settle straight away.
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i wonder how UK_male felt when he entered into marriage with his wife.
Surely he knew that she was older, they must have discussed kids, they must have had a pretty good sex life together, common goals, shared values....whatever happened???
One day he woke up and realised that his wife was too old to have kids??? Or did he changed his outlook on life as HE too grew older and started to question the mutual decision not to have kids?
IMHO, he sounds a bit unfair to his wife. Actually he sounds like a friend's husband who after refusing to have a child with her for 10 years because "he wasn't ready", one day he decided that he was finally ready...too bad she was already menopausal when he changed his mind. He went on to have a child with a 25 y/o, who is now taking him to the cleaners...as he deserves!
In my experience, men who go through a mid-life crisis thinking that they can start all over again with a younger partner, feel 25 again, are usually delusional. The younger partner becomes a wife, has a kid or two, and then ditches him for a younger man...and lives happily ever after on the alimony, child support , etc.
Often she outlives the ex and shares the inheritance with her kids.
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Juliette
My initial advice to the poster was “you should try to sort out the problems with you wife.”
But then the poster came back and disclosed more of his situation... “she will not even let me kiss her, it’s been like this for years and I have tried many times to sort it out”
When I read this I totally changed my mind. Assuming it’s true, he’s made an effort to salvage his marriage, but his wife has not.
I think his wife has been unfair to him, not the other way around.
Please spare us the stereotypes about mid life crisis men running away with younger women, and abandoning a virtuous wife.... the real world is a lot more complicated.
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Personally, as a woman, I think that if one part of the relationship falls apart, it's not long after that the rest will.
If you don't put out, he's going to get it elsewhere. It'd be the same for me if my fiance wasn't interested in being intimate. I don't have children yet, but I think sex is important in a relationship.
If she doesn't put out, she can't be upset that he gets his gratification elsewhere. Planning to emmigrate and marry that gratification, I'm not sure that works really, but that's just my opinion.
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You are asking for trouble. Good luck to you.
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ODS
14 yrs ago
if you divorced with your wife, married this girl, then another young girl turn up, you have to dump this girl again. or before that happens, she found another guy and dump you. If the relationship start with cheating (yes, you are cheating on your wife) it would get no where good
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uk_male, I find you really LAME! Lame, as in L A M E.
Now you' re putting the blame on your wife. and thats really childish. If you weren't lame, you would have done soemthing about it. then guess what?
A tricky chinese woman, sees that lameness in you and is trying to pull your leg. Now lets see if you cannot make that good business in hk/china and ends up so poor this china lady is willing to drop u out of her a** in a bat of an eye lash!
I suggest you do these things first:
1. LEARN to be a man - a strong man who is un afraid to chart his own destiny through himself and not through some women.
2. UNLEARN child-like thinking of putting blame on other ppl. what's next? u will blame ur chinese lady for putting a gun in your head to marry her, go into bad business with her, etc?
Man, you need a divorce, yes.. but u dont need another woman yet - not until you get urself sorted out for good.
AND- this hk woman is just another woman. she is also a woman. So what did all wise and experienced men all say? "... they divorced their wives thinking they can get a better one in Asia? But women will be women. No matter in the west or the east, how old, what background. women will be women."
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