Posted by
Vulvic
19 yrs ago
Personally I don't hold much stock in dating etiquette and 'rules'. Just go with what feels comfortable.
In the first scenario it sounds like the chemistry just wasn't there.
In the second scenario it sounds like you need to communicate to her that you were behaving like a gentleman. Sounds like she also has a little difficulty with dating etiquette.
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I repeat. I don't hold much stock in rules.
There are countless stories of couples sleeping together on the first date and ending up in lasting, loving relationships. Heck, I even have one of those stories.
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Ben, it means you were not flexible or sensitive enough. people are so different, so you just cannot treat one the same way as you treat the other! You must see from their behaviour to decide what to do with whom.
So maybe for the next date, just jump to her bed! (joking!)
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Yes there is such a book and it should be burnt along with all the other dating/relationship books. I have a real mistrust of anyone that allows a book to dictate how they interact with their partners.
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"I had a lovely evening and would like to kiss you good-night. Would that be alright?"
Possible responses: No, Yes (wait for cheek or lips).
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Ben, take it from a woman: we don't understand the rules either.
Show you like him = desperate slut
Be friendly, yet cool = you're not interested and he'll go find someone who is
Call him = desperate slut
Don't call him = you're not interested and he'll go find someone who is
Invite him out on a date = desperate slut
Wait for him to ask you out = (a) you're not interested and he'll go find someone who is and (b) it'll never happen
Be direct about your feelings (assuming you do fancy him and want to shag his brains out) = desperate slut
Be coy and don't let on how much you fancy him and want to shag his brains out = you're not interested and he'll go find someone who is
I could go on, but I think you get the gist... Generally speaking, anytime I've attempted to be completely upfront with a bloke that I was 100% certain liked me as much as I liked him... well, you couldn't see him for the dust as he ran, panicking and sweating, in the other direction.
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rats
19 yrs ago
Ianthe, very well-said!!!
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Sounds as if Binky is not getting enough bonky.
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evohe
19 yrs ago
Dont worry my dear Vulvic. He knows better than many man how to seduce local girls. He speaks canto. He will have his mercy f** soon enough :-)
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Where did you suddenly appear from Monsieur Evohe?
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evohe
19 yrs ago
My dear, iiiit iis always a pleasure to bump into you heu.
Appeared that work did not let us enough time for entertainment lately. But this has been corrected. We have finally decided what will be the Xmas promotion in MacDo' IFC II.
Finger likkin' good - if I may quote competition, which apparently has your graces.
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Ah, they seek him here, they seek him there ... that elusive Evohe.
Vulvic, I think he just got back from that relationship book burning party you suggested. BTW, I can only second that. The Rules sound like Catch 22 to me, the non-funny version that is. Only the author benefits of course.
Evohe, did you burn the Louis Le Prudent books as well?
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evohe
19 yrs ago
Burning books, this remind me of monsieur Adolphe... my granny still shivers at the sounds of boots in the champs elysee under the Arc de Triomphe. Remind me which is the temperature of burning books ... ah yes another book.
Well, books are like food. Some people people choose Umberto Ecco, other are still trying to decifer the Da Vinci code ... you smell what you eat. Same goes with what you read. But who I am to judge. Crap f**d is my business.
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evohe
19 yrs ago
You can by a Tshirt from French Connexion. That might work ...
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I rue the day I ever mentioned KFC, I really do!
Now that you mention food Evohe, I will be in gay Paris in February. Can you recommend some good restaurants in the 15th arondissement?
Nemesis - The authors of said books should be made to heed their own ridiculous advice.
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Vulvic, don't worry I will get tired of that KFC story in a couple of years or so, haha. And yes, couldn't agree more on what the authors should do.
Cher Evohe, we were not talking about the burning of real books, but dating and relationship books. Something completely different. As for Eco or Brown, I go for Eco. And to comfort you, I live by Thomas à Kempis' "In omnibus requiem quaesivi, et nusquam inveni nisi in angulo cum libro". ***Before I get banned again, rough translation of the previous: you'll find me in a corner reading a book.
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Binky, am not American, and I think I've watched a total of, ooh, 17 minutes of Sex in the City (over-hyped, over-rated, over). My observations are completely personal and based on my own experience. I have asked male and female friends and relatives for advice on 1,001 different scenarios and situations I have personally experienced, and I can tell you that the only thing male vs female have in common in terms of advice on relationships is that no one knows WTF they're doing.
If a gal advises you one thing, the bloke will advise the opposite. A man's interpretation of a moment/quip/mood/scenario will, without fail, be at polar opposites to how a woman will interpret it -- even if they are both there in the same situation, at the same time, together, with each other, experiencing exactly the same thing.
In short: we are all stumbling along making this up as we go.
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evohe
19 yrs ago
My dear, the 15th is the Breton district. Go for a crepe over there. Metro Edgar Quinet one of the little street. Otherwise ... let me think Oh' Petit Poivrier Mo Motte Picquet Grenelle, rue Motte Picquet, food is light there.
Chez Papa for food from Bordeaux. Nice but heavy : 101 r Croix Nivert. Still my favorite restaurants in Paris are either in the Marais (4th arrondissement), where you have an amazing gelato shop rue vieille du temple, or l'Homme Bleu a Morrocan restaurant next to Bastille, where they cook tajin right before your eyes, or la ferme rue de la montagne Ste Genevieve, the 5th arrondissement, not far from Rue mouffetard the waiter is so rude and the food so good aaahhh. Sorry I forgot myself. Pardon my manners, if you may.
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HER SIDE OF THE STORY
He was in an odd mood when I got to the pub, I thought it might have been because I was a bit late but he didn't say anything much about it. The conversation was quite slow going so I thought we should go off somewhere more intimate so we could talk more privately. We went to this restaurant and he was STILL acting a bit funny. I tried to cheer him up and started to wonder whether it was me or something else. I asked him, and he said no. But I wasn't really sure. So anyway, in the cab on the way back to his house, I said that I loved him, he just put his arm around me. I didn't know what the hell that meant because he didn't say it back or anything. We finally got back to his place and I was wondering if he was going to dump me! I tried to ask him about it but he just switched on the TV. Reluctantly, I said I was going to go to sleep. Then after about 10 minutes, he joined me and we had sex - but he still seemed really distracted, I just wanted to leave but instead I cried myself to sleep. I dunno, I just don't know what he thinks anymore. I mean, do you think he's met someone else?
HIS SIDE OF THE STORY
England lost again. Tired. Bit p**sed. Got a shag though!
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I want one of those grill pans. Chicken always tastes better when it has those brown lines on it.
Very generous with the ice creams JC. I brought a box of choccies in yesterday. Needless to say they've all gone. Far too many women in my office.
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evohe
19 yrs ago
Nemesis still up for an Autodafe, spanish institution (ahh the benefits of a classical education). Forgive me but I had to choose between latin or german. The chance that we get invaded by Italy being less, or romans for that matter, so I choose german. Must have missed out some jokes in the Name of the Rose ...
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Evohe, since you are talking about the Spanish Inquisition, I have to quote Charles V of Spain “I Speak Spanish to God, Italian to Women, French to Men, and German to My Horse”. How's that, cher chevalier?
BTW, no offence meant to anyone who might feel offended by Charles V's quote, he said it, I'm only the messenger.
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evohe
19 yrs ago
Ok to be fair. I have been the victim of those freekin rules some time ago.
But frankly speaking what do you think of those who follow such stupid rules :
[Bruno Quote] Keep them in the ghetto or train to ...
E-
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Evohe - thanks for that. Am only there for a few days and am travelling alone so will stick to the quieter places for dinner I think. Only asked about the 15th becuase that is where am staying but promise to venture further afield.
Ianthe - classic!
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Yes, Ianthe, great story!
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evohe
19 yrs ago
You are most welcome Vulvic.You go there for business I suppose then. Let me know exactly where you stay and how long so I can give you some advice.
Going back to the rules : it is a shame that such rules exist and there is even "litterature" around such things. Girls should follow their instict, the counter part should be man should at least be decent and say what they are up to.
To quote Binky later this evening,
So "Mercy f*ck" darlin' ? Excuse my french.
All goes back to having solid fundations : honest with others and knowing what you want.
Going back to my burgers....
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Only 3 blokes in my office, the rest are women a third of which are PMT-ing at any time. Needless to say chocolate is a staple in our workplace, lol.
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Evohe, I challenge you on that "be honest" recommendation. I have tried it, and it don't work -- not even with a sleazy, self-confessed sex addict who started chatting me up in a LKF bar one evening... as soon as I turned the tables on him and said "whaddawewaitinfor, honey, let's go!", he bottled. Hunters don't like it when you turn the gunsights on them. Challenges their manhood or summat.
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evohe
19 yrs ago
You are quite true Ianthe. Of course you have to play the "rape me and I'll help you" approach in that case. But at least you clearly know what you are doing. Those rules are for ppl that don't know what they are doing. So they keep floating in the middle. There is a difference between the seduction game, and the general attitude over here.
When you don't like a guy, then you simply do not go on 5 dates with him, to say ... hmmm let's stay friends.
When you like him then you seduce him : with flames in the eyes, crossing your legs left and right, left and right at an appropriate rythm, smile in a sensual manner ... all that in order to build a "tension" and redistribute the blood in your future companion. But all is in the unspoken and unmanifested. Seduce, but never say bluntly "yes".
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Evohe> Interesting. So at what point in the seduction process is it appropriate to make "the final move" i.e. subtly alter the kiss from a chaste peck on either to side of the mouth to a full-blown, hot'n'heavy french kiss?
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JC - C'mon, you know full well that wimmen don't smell of flowers when they parp. Except for me of course, lol.
Evohe - stop with the sensuous seduction lecture, you're giving me a hot flush.
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evohe
19 yrs ago
Ianthe > If the blood is rightly distributed in a male subject, ie he is somewhat somewhere pointing at you ... then the question is irrelevant. You will proceed an exchange of saliva within a few minutes.
Vulvic > Imagine how it would sound in french ... hahahaha
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Ha ha. How was your chilli JC?
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evohe
19 yrs ago
One question though. I'd like to go back to the topic.
Is there anyone on this forum that follow those golden rules and would stand to defende them. I would like to understand why so many girls stick to those books. There must be some truth in it ...
Ladies : enlight me !
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Okay, this is how it's gone for me: I have always stuck to the rules in the early part of the "relationship" (i.e. before it is even a real relationship), trying to find that perfect balance between showing I'm interested while not scaring him off by seeming desperate... So far, zero results.
I eventually reach the point (length of time depends on the bloke/situation, has ranged from anything between 60 minutes to one year-plus) where I throw caution to the wind and announce my feelings -- then sit back and await the response.
So far: results have been identical -- blokes goes running screaming off in the other direction.
Go figure.
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Ianthe - I'm sure you do very well with the blokes. Just a case of finding one that doesn't scare easily.
Wasa - good idea, are you planning on throwing the displays on the pyre aswell?
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Vulvic> If you find that bloke who doesn't scare easily, send him my way...
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JC - you are so emphatic it must be bad, lol!! Haven't seen them yet, have been avoiding all shopping malls, but may have to venture in on the weekend to do the dreaded shopping.
Are the carols in that annoying tinkley timpany style , like in Ikea??? One of the girls in my office actually bought in the Ikea soundtrack to play at work. I scratched it.
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Ianthe - they are like gold-dust but will keep my eyes peeled for you!
JC - surely not all carol singing is inhumane? I always like to go and listen to the Welsh Male Voice Choir at Christmas.
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Lol!!! You're probably right.
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rule is - go with the vibe! Know what a woman is signalling and do what your told! LOL
ask! thats always a good thing! hehe
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wasabigizmobunny - When will the self-help book burning party be? Can I join? Should I bring along some books to help the fire going?
It sounds like it is largely depended on your luck, isn't it? Sometimes you don't have to lift a figner and chicks/guys just pour over ya, but other times you "show" the person all your moves and you end up with nothing =p
Dorris- what kinda signal do woman give out to show that "Hey! Come on to me"?
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No rules really, evohe is right....does anyone sense anything....yeah, and what is that with going on a date five times, or for five weeks and say let's remain friends...
I have a very conservative male friend in that is a woman sleeps with different men regulary (whilst trying to find the right one mind you) he calls her a trollop, yet he states himself "If a woman doesn't sleep with you on the first date I can understand that, BUT, if she doesn't sleep with you on a second date....well....that is too much"...
I agree with what all women have said sleep with a man on a first date, and they wonder....and run, wait and it doesn't happen.....etc etc etc.
But there are no rules. Know plenty of people who have happily shagged on their first date and are still shagging now after kids, marriage and more kids...
Know people who will not shag until they get married or at least a promise of one....and they are still virgins at 35 nonetheless.....
All rules out the window, go with your instincts, we realy on them in every other way...
There are no rules....just feelings
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