My Mother wanted to sue me for taking my belongings from home- Part II

While the Part I thread was written under LEGAL a few months ago, I might as well provide some background & updates (especially for those of you who cares & provided great help & support!!)


I'm 23 and my parents sent me away studying abroad since 14, I graduated and came back to HK & it didn't take me a month to realise that I have to move out. My mother is a very compulsive, controlling person, remembering some very violent abuses she did on me as a child, I am very afraid of her (which I really can't help). I moved out quietly with a few belongings one morning, & believe me it was the only choice I had. First thing she did was to lock my room, Two months later I went back there, bought someone to open the lock and took everything that is important to me. Same day she called the police and threatened to sue me & my boyfriend of stealing until the end of time. (For full story, read Part I thread under Legal, around end of page 2).


After one whole month of abusive/threatening phone calls from her, stressful calls from polices, after two family meetings where everyone had to treat her as a victim & me as the rebel who destroyed her family, after countless times of apologise for not sure what, after putting myself down again & again in front of different people to prove that she did the right thing ~ sue her bad daughter (What I deserved)... She had controlled me in everyway since I am on this planet & once again, I let her win, I did what she wanted me to. She dropped the charge & I through since then I get my life back and I own it,,, but seems like I am wrong.


Although I cannot say I have always had a peaceful life, but since the day I moved out from her house, I can really feel how what she did would in fact affect my whole life or even my future family. I want a way out, but I can't seem to find it. Since then I became less & less social; I worried as soon as the phone ring; I rather stay home to avoid anyone. I am worried about myself.


Two days ago, its her birthday, I ordered a bunch of flower and sent to her office. I received a phone call from the flower shop today which said: she didn't want to receive the flowers and the delievery man tried twice, then my mother threatened to call the police (again) if he didn't leave. I broke into tears after knowing this... why am I sad? Can I actually lose something that I never have had?


Can anyone tell me, am I that wrong afterall?? After all these, I almost really think I broke the law and am a criminal...


Should I keep on trying or should I actually keep the biggest possible distance from her?


Chinese family background, western education & grow-up environment,,, can anyone give me some directions?

I think two things are the foundation of reconciliation. First, you both have to be in a mindset that you want to meet and talk. Second, you have to set yourselves up for productive conversation.


I once heard a guest speaker talk about forgiving his father for abuse, assault, etc. In his 20s, he committed to writing donw 100 things he appreciated about his dad. It took him 12 years. After writing those things down, he posted them (with a short note) to his dad's closest friend. The note said that, if he ever thought dad was in a spirit to receive such a note, please give it to him. It took another 3 years for the father to make contact.


When they were both finally in a mindset that they wanted to meet, he suggested they talk for awhile with a third-party present (a counselor) to facilitate the conversation and they have managed to forge a friendship.


If nothing else, the list of 100 things will help you truly forgive your mom (even ifshe doesn't deserve it). And, I think there is nothing more powerful than undeserved forgiveness.

Wow... this story is really heartbreaking. I truly feel for you, Nara.


I had a similar experience, although not with my moter, thankfully, but with a woman I loved for three and a half years of my life (yes, I know, far less of a connection, but to me it was significant - I wanted to marry this woman). She was always abusive, and then one day I was just kicked out, no warning, and no explanation. The problem was, I didn't have a key at that time, and she still, after a year, has not returned personal effects to me including my wallet with my HK driver's license, a mobile phone, documents, digital archives, and various effects. To this date she won't speak to me, and won't discuss returning my things, with me or with her friends. Our mutual friends have not done anything to confront her about this and I feel betrayed by them as well.


It sounds like your Mother, as well as my ex-, have serious psychological issues, and the sad thing is, there's nothing we can do to help them. They have projected unforgivable blame on us, and have taken that blame to a point of delusion, from which I do not believe they will ever return.


However, if there was anything I could have done differently, it would have been to not contact her for an extended period of time (at least a year), to let her calm down and think about what she did. Confronting her cannot help at all. It can only make things worse.


It's okay to send flowers every once in a while, but if she refuses them, don't feel hurt, and most of all don't let her know that you're hurt. Just wait half a year or so and try again, subtly.


If she's ever going to rethink what's happened, it won't be because anybody tells her to. It'll be because time has passed with nothing for her to do except go over events in her head over and over again until she sees them for what they actually were, and not for what in anger she pretended them to be.

Sunshine7, I have been thinking exactly the same thing... the relationship never really existed. Otherwise why would I be the only one who try to do something about it. Remembering while I was abroad, talking on the phone means her telling me about the lost & gain in her business, she seldom asked how my life alone had been. I felt like I had to do something with this 'relationship' and thus tried to work things out, so I always start talking about my life until she get back to her money topics again... And you are right too, her relationship with her mum is very very distant. I recall how she always tell me how bad grandma treated her, how unlucky she was/is... Grandma is left alone in an old government apartment(you know, those match boxes in HK). Now & then my sis and I would secretly visit her or we would get in trouble if mum found out. I would very love to build my own family, but I don't want to do so because I want to fill my own empty heart. I don't want, at all chances, pass this experience to my children.... Do you think the only way to do so is to forgive her, like travelinteacher said??


travelinteacher, I definitely think your solution is the best that I would do if I think its possible. She is simply a person that cannot forgive anyone. I know she hates her husband my father as he did something unfaithful to her before I was born, she hates her mother as she claims grandmum was not treating her as well as other kids in the family, she hates her brothers as .... she hates my sister as she got married as soon as she graduated and gave birth,,, I hear these stories from her on & on before she hates ME too... But me myself, I hate to be like her. After talking it all out here, this time, I plan to forget all these forever, as I don't want to pass this on to anyone,,, but it will be very hard to do, and since forget definitely includes forgive. For sure if I have to list 100 things I appreciate about her, I think I can, first for providing the financial support for me to receive education abroad, which I am very glad it made me a very different person i think I would be if I had stayed in HK. And this make another point, most of the things she did was actually 'financially', I have been confused if that means LOVE? She worked hard to earn the money so to support me financially... Every now and then she says: You think I don't love you? I paid for that & that, I spent that much so you could study abroad... Financial support, is it responsibility or is it love? But i deep in my heart i know she will never forgive me just like all the others she cannot forgive. She hates grandma since she was child until now, about 50 years.....


the_poor_man , I am sorry about what happened to you too. But, we are NOT POOR ^.^ You found out the real her before its too late! Serious psychological issues, I think thats very true. And the most difficult part of it, is that you and I can never say to this person they should see the doctor! Otherwise they will only get 10 times more aggressive. Since a child I had mostly spent time with the maid, I left home at 14 and since then lived on my own. The connection between me and parents,,, maybe very weak. My mum blames me for that, while she was the one who sent me away but at the same time expecting a lovely close relationshop. And I know exactly how you feel about friends not doing anything & feeling betrayed. My sister and her husband (who I hardly talked to), people that I hardly talked to, all at a sudden came together confronted me and said: How can you do this to your mother. Chinese culture, no matter what your parents did, they are still your parents & you must respect them.... I, simply, think this is wrong. I don't have to pay respect to anyone who doesn't respect me. I am a rebel in this big Chinese family. I do hope she would rethink one day like you said. But at the moment, I need to figure out how to heal myself & find a way out of this sick situation, to live a life.

Thanks Plastic buddha,,, you have made a very good point: Lay down your sword. Stop fighting so hard for approval from a woman who has none to give. You pointed this out, something that I have been doing (without knowing) since I was born... I did so many things in order to get her approval. thank you, I definitely work on this. I know I won't send any flowers in the next 12 months. Better give those flower money to the charities.

Nara, I have to agree with travelinteacher about the forgiveness. You absolutely need to find a way to forgive your mother. Not for her sake (as she most likely will never acknowledge that she has done anything to be forgiven for) but for your sake. If you are unable to find it in you to forgive her the bitterness will stay with you for the rest of your life.


That said, unless your mother sincerly wishes to reconcile and work at having an adult relationship with you, you need to stay as far away from her as possible. You do not need to subject yourself to her abuse simply because you were born to her.

Thanks bit&pieces, taking about forgiveness and when I think about it deeply, I am confused. In fact, I never really blame nor hate her. Sometimes I feel really sorry for her seeing her full of hate for people around her. or sometimes, I even question if I am really such a bad daughter thinking of the financial supports she provided. therefore I am not sure now,,, should I be the one to forgive or the one to stop blaming myself. Many mix feelings are going on.

Nara, oh sweetie, I wish that I could talk with you on the phone.


Far from being a bad daughter, your posts in fact suggest that you are a very good one. You seem to me to be a young woman that I for one, would be proud to claim as my daughter. The fact that the state of your relationship with your mother is of such great concern to speaks for this.


As for the financial support your mother has provided to you, this was wholly her choice. Yes I think that you should be appreciative of it and it does seem that you are. But for you mother to hold it over you like a club, it just plain wrong.


You have nothing to blame yourself for. But you do need to forgive. As travelinchina states undeserved forgiveness is a powerful thing. It is powerful for the one who is forgiving; it will set free all the hurt you are now feeling.


I am so very lucky in that I have two daughters that I have excellent relationships with. One I gave birth to and the other that I received when I married her father. Do I always agree with their choices, no. But they are responsible, kind and loving women and what more can a mother ask for of her daughters.


Sweetie, I know that there is a way to send a private message to me but I don't know how to do this so if someone would be so kind as to explain hot to send and how to receive it, I would be most grateful. If you wish to do so and if you include telephone # and the best time to call you, I would truly want to talk this over with you.

Nara, I can totally relate because my parents are also abusive and I struggled for years between anger, hatred, sadness, guilt and the desire to win the love I never got. I eventually left home and was given the same emotional blackmail, though not as extreme as your case.


It's been a while since and I have thought a lot about this and realised a few things. I need to let go. If not, I will be eaten up by bitterness and turn out exactly to be the same as my parents. And before I can do so, I need to forgive. You see, my parents are the way they are because they were treated badly by their own parents. They never knew better or learnt better; whatever they learnt was absorbed unconsciously through modeling their parents' negative attitudes and behaviour, thereby perpetuating a vicious cycle. The only way to break out of this is to accept that though they were wrong and hurt you badly, they and did the best they knew how to in their own screwed up way.


Other things I have learnt:


- Allow yourself to feel anger and grief. Your feelings can only be resolved/get lessened over time when you let them out.


- Accept that the past is the past. You didn't get the love, attention, affection etc you needed and deserved from your mother and you're unlikely to ever get it. Stop trying to win these from her or from friends and lovers because you're going to go round and round in the same negative cycle. You're worthy of love like everyone else and if you don't start believing you do, nobody would.


- Understand yourself, your motivations and how much is shaped by your desire to compensate for the past. Just because your relationships have been a certain way in the past doesn't mean everyone is the same and you have to react in the same way all the time. If you do, then don't be surprised if the ending is also the same.


- Last but not least, take a break from your mother. It's much easier to get a good perspective on the situation with time and distance- and easier to forgive her when your feelings are less intense. You will recognise that though she might have been mad, bad and sad, she was as much a victim as you were.


Good luck Nara... I trust these help.

Agree with all above. Also, although it sounds a bit tree-huggy, I have heard that symbolic rituals have been very helpful to people who've gone through similar things and need to clear their minds: Go to a country park, set free a balloon up into the sky, and, with it, let go of all the hurt your mother's caused you. While you're releasing the balloon, vow to yourself that from this moment on you are not going to allow her to take up any more of your life.

Nara, I gave up my "mother addiction" only recently and realised that all relationships need 2 sides of give and take. I no longer have the sleepless nights of wondering what exactly I'd said that had upset her, put her on strong antidepressants and caused her to try to kill herself (all her words). It's certainly not a guilt-free existence and it's quite scary to lose the safety net that you always imagine your mother to be, but like you, your mother and grandmother before you, I feel like I've broken the poison parent chain. If this hadn't happened, then 20 yrs down the line my children would be repeating the pattern all over again.....

bits&pieces, I have just PM you. ^.^

Dear all of you who gave me valuable advises:


Its already been over 2 years since I posted this thread, hope you are all doing well. I did what many of you suggested, stay away for a while. For a while I did not have contact with her despite 2 to 3 abusive calls I received (I talked free to her, I told her how I think of her and of course she is furious).


But since 2008 I have seen her more often as my sister bought a house close to my parents’ . Once we went on a day trip together and that day I saw hope, we were talking and crying together like mother & daughter. But it was just a one-off thing. All the other times I saw her she ignored me and put on a dark face.


So actually things are not getting better maybe worse, because her depressive, anger mood for sure also make my dad & sister’s life like hell. What’s worse for her is, my younger brother (who she loves the most) seems to be cutting himself off by working overseas more & more frequently and when he’s back in HK he doesn’t go home. All in all mom is more depressed and now blame me for more. Feel like she will never move on and if I try to fix things with her it will only hurt me more…


she as the dominant character in our family, cutting her out of my life means I will be all alone, means cutting my father, sister & brother out too. I would leave HK immediately if circumstances allow but we can’t yet. A piece of good news though is I am recently engaged, after going through so many things he is still there for me. But thinking of a wedding, I can’t help feeling the shadow over me when I think of should I let my mother be there…. do I want to see her dark face in my wedding? Is cutting your mother out of your life sounds as easy as it sound?

hi nara, we are in a similar situation...


i helped my mother a lot. in our culture it is the eldest child responsibility to "help the family. so help i did. i quit school back home then came here to work in hong kong..


thats when it all started.. i gave her basically everything i can give. financially, she broke me.


then the last straw was this summer when i went home for a holiday.. i had high hopes for us then coz we just made up after about a year of frozen silence.


i was wrong.. nothing changed. their endless demands for cash left me skint i moved out, but they managed to make me move back in, using my 11yr old brother as leverage. i love my brother a lot.


then i found work during my holiday, all they watched out for was my pay date. she borrowed the cash i was saving for my visa run with promises to pay back.. needless to say i didnt get any of the cash she had borrowed the last 3 years..


i finally refused to be their cash cow.. they threw me out in the end.. and i cant understand why they did... it took a lot of talks from a very close friend to make me see reason. they wanted my cash and after i refused they threw "family values" at me


but it was either i stay with them and end being neck deep in debt.. or i disconnect myself and make a better life for myself so i can still help them in the long run..


needless to say i chose the latter.. but it cost me my family... they dont acknowledge my existence at all..



so i know how you feel. your mum is trying to make ur life miserable.. be strong and hold your head up.. she can hurt you only as much as you let her.


make her see that u are not affected.. she seems like she take great pleasure when ur hurt..


ur not alone..

Hi Nara,


I read your story (quiet day at work today:) and feel truly sorry for your being put in this situation. Mother's are supposed to be there for their babes (no matter what age, no matter what they have done) so it must be very disconcerting for your mother to have acted like this towards you.


I think that your mum actually sounds quite unwell - she sounds like she has emotional problems that need professional help and also some compassion.


There is no way that you can 'fix her' nor should you try as her daughter. Unless she is open to 1) getting some help to work through HER (not your) issues and 2) realising you have done nothing wrong so to stop abusing you and 3) open to mending the relationship with you that she has destroyed, then there is nothing that can be done for her.


You have endured years of her abuse and for your own sake and future you need to look after yourself now. Try to look to the future and become who you want to be. You're now in your mid-20's so it's time to start looking at how you want to live your life as an adult now out of your mother's shadow. As your mother hasn't been a great role model, perhaps think of others who you admire and build a life that is balenced & happy like theirs.


I wish you all the best and I hope that the next 20+ years of your life are fabulous and full of all of the blessings you deserve.


Take care


G.

Nara,


I went through the same thing with my mother...although not quite as crazy as yours, but very similar. She did some awful things, and I felt like I had to be the obedient daughter and just take it. I have been married for 6.5 years and things are better with her. I have learned that there is more to life than trying to gain my mother's acceptance and love. I have tried many times to make her understand that what she does really hurts me, but she is blind to it and lacks empathy. I am afraid you just have to let go of your relationship with your mother, try to see her as little as possible and most of all stop thinking that she will change, she won't. If you let her back in, she will continue hurting you. I suggest you seek therapy, it helped me quite a bit to understand why some people are the way they are and it helped me deal with my need to be appreciated by my mother. Take care of yourself and try to separate from your family (those that are negative) and see them as little as possible, YOU WILL BE OKAY!! If you need to PM me for more advice or to just talk, you are certainly welcome.

bye chicago, how did you manage to let go of it? im still struggling with the things my mom did to me the last 3 yrs that im finding it hard to let go of the pain and hurt and all those mixed emotions i have.. and its starting to affect my life and outside relationships big time


thanks

Hi NARA,


You are a very sweet person.... I dont know why she cried with you that one time.... but you being 23 might be a young age to put her shoes on your feet.


I have a very loving and intelligent mother and she spent her whole life taking care of the children... we always have a good relationship but as me & my sisters grow older, we acknowledge more and more how amazing she was to raise the family, as we ourselves has to face our family situation. We gave our mother recognition but each day growing older I understand I never give her enough recognition that she wished for. She just didnt clearly express it but it was the reason we had a few big fights in the past.


As for tradition hk mother - money is everything because Hk in the old days is not like now. You can die starving and no one knows. HK new generation always take for granted the govt/parents are responsible for everything of their lives. In the old days, a mother would do anything everything to give the kids food/education and all that the child need to have a better life.


It seems to me your mom is a capable woman and she takes charge in life and stands on her feet. I think she needs recognition for being a very responsible mother. I would be frustrated if I make a big effort for my kids and they end up running away. People are not born to be a perfect mother. She did her best to be a mother. Maybe she would be a much better senior vice president than being a mother.


I hope you try to give her recognition, ask her what you can do to make her happy, cos the kids are grown up and she deserves to enjoy a happy life. Try to understand her without she tells you everything. There must be a reason why she becomes bitter in life. Try to help her to untie the knot, if you really treasure a family.

I agreed with easygoing that your mother needs some kind of recognition. Both of you deep inside do care for one another or else you wouldn't have cried together that time.


The built-up tension through the years are quite difficult to untie as the start of your relationship when you returned home after finishing school went off the wrong foot with her and she must have handled it in her Asian way making you very offensive as you have Western influence therefore this WAR started.


The mother is yours and only you know your own feeling - try to figure out how to cope with her in the Asian way if you care enough - if not, just minus a mother in your life - your choice.

You wrote: "She had controlled me in everyway since I am on this planet & once again, I let her win."


Your mother is obviously psychotic. Don't abuse yourself any more, move on and accept the fact that your mother has a twisted mind that you can't fix. Be happy you have someone who really loves you--the boyfriend.


She is never going to change, so stop trying to do so. MOVE ON, MOVE ON, MOVE ON!

Hi Nara


My mother is also a very controlling woman and has split the family completely. I have only spoken to her/met her once in the last 11 years. People who know her well understand why. Most outsiders find it very difficult to understand how a person can cut off their own mother.


I think of it as, like being divorced. My mother and I have a history together, but no future, and I am now emotionally detached from her. My life is now more peaceful, simpler, and I am happier.


I will admit the past has left scars. Living with judgmental people can do that, because you never can win, and there is not rational arguement that you can use with irrational people. Because they always justify themselves.


Only you can decide what you are willing to do.

But I have grown a lot since I set myself free.

Thank you all for the advices and caring… Somewhat strange but I feel the warmth knowing that some of you have been following my story and supported me through my way (My story was originally posted about 1000 days ago). Saying of 1000 days, I suddenly realized that I have used another 1000 days of my life trying to gain acceptance from my mom.


An update for the situation…


 My brother moved out to live with his girlfriend, just the same as what I did. My brother is very a very passive person, I can imagine he didn’t do much regarding my mom’s emotions. But my mom treated the “problem” differently, she was only angry for a week, no police, no dramatic apology either. Although I grew up always knew that she loves my brother most, this proves that she can loves unconditionally, but it’s just not towards me…


 Last month, I called mom to say happy birthday, all she did was yelling at me over the phone. Her topic switched to money mainly, I didn’t bring any home (she has properties, good running business & savings). Then she insulted me and my fiancé…


 When I called my dad told him I am recently engaged, first he said “Great!”, then he said let’s tell your mom later, she is very crazy recently…


 My sister thinks I should bring her money, I said no as I don’t owe her. A mother is suppose to feed and provide education, but she can’t just ask for a refund when one day she decided to forget about her daughter… it is getting harder to connect my thinking with my sister’s…(she studied overseas, now married to a rich man with very traditional Chinese family background)


I went on planning a wedding with expectation that my family won’t really be happy for me, but I expect many others will be. Like many of you said, I must move on. From the above situations I’ve realized that I can’t lose what I don’t have, but I can lose a mother that gives me only money & blames, I also can lose a family that can’t bother bringing me back in but play safe and put up with a crazy “powerful” mother. I want to shut her out of my life and live my own life, even if that means losing a dad, sister and brother.


I need help going through this… I saw in the replies that some of you who went through similar things is now detached from the problem someone, how did you do that? Does anyone know of a good therapist that is affordable in HK? I am going to go through this…

I feel sad for you.. but I am happy for your wedding! IT is okay.. just keep a distance from your family. if you can move away from hkg... then do it..


the further you are.. the less affected you will be by your family .. wedding is just between you and your bf.. at least your fiance is with you there and support you all the way.


There is really no way to be detached from all these.. you just have to be AWAY .. from your family as much as possible.. time is the best healing medicine.. one day.. your mum might turn around.. and know you are a good daughter.. but she might never too.. all you can do .. is to only wish for good things.. (mind power is a very powerful thing yuo know!) for her.


I sincerly wish you all the best.. and peace in your heart. take care.