white-lying husbands

This is quite an embarassing question, as I think it's going to portray me as a particularly naive individual, but does anybody else have a liar for a husband? I can't complain in the extreme sense, as in comparison to other peoples problems it seems quite petty, but this has been going on for over 20 years now. Examples are financial, as in where money has been invested, what happened to xx,000$ bonus/inherited/saved; meals out with who (women always deleted), post being redirected to the office etc.

You might automatically assume that I am a prying wife and therefore this poor chap has to go around fibbing for a quiet life to save him from the dragon at home, but that is definitely NOT the case.

Basically, all I want is to trust him, and if he lies about the smaller, non-important issues (that let's face it, are pretty simple to discuss) then what the hell is going to happen if something big comes up?

does this stem from childhood? Does a lying child become a lying adult? How do you keep a relationship going when it's based on deceit?

We're not talking isolated incidents either, but at least twice weekly. I've tried not asking questions but when you find opened letter around informing you that a certain bill hasn't been paid for 3 months when he told you he'd cleared it the week before, what exactly do you believe?

He knows he has a problem. He can't say why, he just keeps saying sorry but I'm fast running out of love and respect for him.

I guess herein lies my problem! I've put up with it for 20 years, so what's the problem now? With each passing lie, we have a huge row, his promises become more emphatic, and then the lies increase in size. Can a liar ever stop? Have I made my bed by "getting over it and moving on" each time? Will I look back in 10years and think I should've quit while I was still ahead? Will I ever believe and/or trust anything he ever says? And finally (phew!) if a man can habitually lie to your face, does he mean it when he says he loves you?

Iris,


I really think these might be questions to ask your close friends, not absolute strangers of all ages and experiences here... but..Somebody once told me that if you truly love someone you love them in spite of their faults. I'm sure he loves you, and you love him, but he's hopeless with money by the sounds of things. Can you take control their and give him an allowance to squander while you get the bills paid. I suppose I would ask myself if the lies were of a calculated nature towards you, or done to ultimately protect you in a warped way, or just plain covering up for general hopelessness (it's his weakness)? If the latter two, send him to a psychologist! If not, take appropriate action?

The psychologist bit has always appealed actually, as without trust it's pretty tricky to keep going forward. As for the friends bit, don't get me wrong, I love to chew the fat with them regularly, but that would be cruel to him as my girlfriends are his mutual friends (he's not particularly sociable) and don't know his other side. I did once take charge of the bills while he was overseas and it went perfectly, but I do feel like I'm demasculating him by taking all control away!

sorry, one more thing, I guess it's easier to ask strangers and not be judged face to face. I seriously also want to know if I'm alone in this situation as I've never heard of this before.....

Blue Iris - after 20 years it's highly unlikely that you're going to change his ways now. But what I would want to get to the bottom of is the issue regarding unpaid bills and the fact that he's having some post redirected to the office. Why does he feel this is necessary? I don't expect an answer to this, but do you feel that you are financially stable as a couple, or do you have any concerns? Are you sure that your husband isn't in any financial difficulty? I don't wish to worry you, but I'd definitely want to get to the the bottom of this ... perhaps it's about time you both had a serious talk ... tell him your concerns and take it from there. Of course, it may be absolutely nothing to worry about ... but you won't know unless you bring it all out into the open and discuss it together, then perhaps you can put your mind at rest. Good luck!

Have tried 'til I'm blue in the face to talk about financial issues with him but he always protests that everything is perfect. He doesn't drink much at all, never socializes, gambling......? Have considered that in the past, perhaps online as he invariably stays up late on the computer, going to bed if I come downstairs. It all seems so vague, but you know when somethings going terribly wrong and you can't quite put your finger on it? Sometimes I imagine that I am going to get one horrible shock if he dies before me and it all comes out in the open.............

We can accept some lies but not from the people we love and not on a daily basis. The one person who you should be able to get honesty from is your spouse.


People lie to protect themselves or others. But these little white lies can build up because old lies need new lies to hide them. And that’s stressful for both of you.


You want him to change but, as we know, most men don’t respond well to criticism. Perhaps you can try positive reinforcement.


The next time he tells you the truth (when he could have lied), said “thanks for that,” enforced with a hand on his arm. The thing about this is you have to do be 100% consistent – that’s doing it in private and public – and never stop, that’s forever...


When (if) he lies – and you know he is lying – say “are you sure?” gently, not accusingly. Then shut up for a minute, let him talk first. Again this has to be done every time, whenever, wherever.


If you think he’s still lying, leave it. He hasn’t got away with lying because he will know you know he’s lying but without the usual – and stressful - confrontations.


Remember, he is trying to protect someone; he needs to feel safe enough with you that telling you the truth won’t hurt him... or you.

Thanks Claire, spoken like a wise one. Have you ever noticed that all this is not dissimilar to childcare book information. As adults, we seem to come full circle! I do the "pause" after the lie and it's pretty obvious when he's lying as his face gives him away, but do I really want to parent my husband as well as the children?

Many of these problems hark back to childhood. A disapproving parent, a lack of privacy/personal control. Which is why confrontations don't work - he may have had years of those and can switch off.


BTW, the pause comes after you've said "are you sure?". He has time to "correct" himself then.


I don't think this is really parenting him. It's correcting a behaviour which is causing problems in your relationship. It's done so what ultimately he can decide whether of not to continue with the lie - you just decide to offer a small 'reward' if he doesn't. The alternative is counselling which can be very useful, if he agrees...

Do you think counselling can stop a lifetime of lying? Serious question, as I'm not sure how it all works. I would be truly impressed if it could, but doesn't the liar have to really want to stop? I have to say, he's not really one for that sort of thing and how would I know he'd really gone (not as daft a question as you might think as he has lied about drs appointments too before)? To tell you the truth, I really do love him but I take all the lies so personally and it all really hurts now. To me it's simple, if you loved me, you'd stop lying!

How about counselling together as a couple ... it may not stop the lies, but it might help you get to the bottom of it?

blue iris, you've tolerated it for 20 years. counselling won't help unless he agrees to go with you AND admits that he has a problem.


i don't want to scare you but i have seen it happen: an otherwise wonderful charming and lovely husband, with a serious financial handicap - debt and tax bills hidden from the wife - what a nasty shock she received when she finally dug deep and investigated their financial situation.


as suggested above by many other posters, you may as well use your time constructively - until the day comes when he has his epiphany and realizes he needs to stop lying to you, why don't you do some sleuthing and find out your true financial situation...all the more important if you are financially dependent on him. also: do you have kids?


you're not being daft, unreasonable or foolish, and stop apologizing for wanting to fix a serious problem. your gut is telling you something - listen to it and do something about it. best of luck.

Thanks, makes me realise I'm not going mad! Any ideas on exactly where to start the detective work? I have found stocks I didn't know existed, and do try to have financial conversations with him, but we'll agree on one avenue, and then I'll find out he's gone down another. The secretive financial gambling is the most plausible explanation, and we should be a hell of a lot better off than we are, although that's never particularly been an issue to me. I've always been the one in tougher times who pushes for downsizing apts, budgets etc., but he always seems to want to keep up with some imaginary Jones's or Wongs perhaps.

"To me it's simple, if you loved me, you'd stop lying!"


It is not that simple. Most men do not make such a connection. It's women who believe that love manifests itself through behaviour, like being given a bunch of roses or a public hug. Guys really don't, or only a few of them.


It is his behaviour, not the lies per se, which hurts you. "When you do [whatever], I feel [hurt, afraid, etc.]." This can be worked through with counselling.


It is about building trust, not damaging it by sneaking around. Neither of you seem to trust each other. This leaves you with three options:


1. Stick it out

2. Make changes

3. Bail


Please note, #4 is not a magic wand.

blue iris, in your case, after 20 years of lies, i would not classify any financial detective work you did as sneaking around. there is little or no trust, you've had 20 years to build it, that's why you've posted here and it's just not happening. at this point, given your circumstances, i would call it self-preservation and protection.


DLL is correct - you can start with the computer. do you have access to your tax records too? also, you can call up all your utilities and ask the status of your accounts.

You're husband is an eternal optimist and doesn't want to see, hear or speak of anything even slightly away from the positive!


What is his starsign?

Hi Blue Iris,

Your situation really stand out for me, as I can completely sympathise with your situation.

I have never been married myself; however your situation is exactly what my parents were going through for a very long time. They were married for 27 years and I always thought everything was fine - they never fought (well at least not in front of me), had lots of friends, were financially comfortable etc. However, unknown to either my father or myself, my mother was in fact very unhappy, and had been for several years. To cut a very long story short - because I am the only child, I ended up becoming a punching bag for my parents (which is not a good situaiton for a child, so if you have kids then don't do that to them). I heard everything about what was going on - my father couldn't understand why my mother had suddenly changed her attitude towards him, or why she was always suspicious and criticising him. However, on the other hand, my mother was telling me that Dad had been lying to her for their entire marriage about a whole range of things from finances to where he was going. As a child in the middle of this trauma it was extrememly terrible and heartbreaking. I moved out and let them deal with their problems on their own - after all it was essentially their marriage and not mine.

My mother wanted to have counselling long before my father had even realised that there was something upsetting her, and so he could not understand why there was a need. By the time they finally got to counselling it was too late, and Mum saw it as more of a way to help them both (particularly Dad) through the break up more than a means of helping to repair their marriage.

My parents will file for divorce in two weeks.

Blue Iris, I know my story isn't exactly the most comforting and probably not one that you wish to read; however I feel that my mother was feeling how you are now.

In your situation, I honestly think you need to look at your life as a whole (that's what my Mum did). You need to ask yourself questions such as:

* Do I still love this person or am I just used to having them around?

* Could I retire with this person and be happy?

* Do we still have a lot in common or are our interests vastly differing?

* Do I have children that will get hurt if we split?


If you decide that you still want to be with your husband, then you need to ask yourself:

* How can I approach him about this without offending him?

* What is the appropriate help we need?

* How can I know I can trust him again?

* How can we learn to grow with each other?


If you decide you can't be with him, then you need to ask yourself:

* What is the best way that this situation be the least painful for both of us?

* What can I do to help him through it?


My parents are just an example - you have command can control over your own situation and so you will know what is best.


Twenty years is a long time to put up with something, but it's not always too late.


I hope everything works out for the best.

Wow! I can't thank you enough for all the replies and suggestions. Not really used to doing this as I'm a master of the stiff upper lip cover up and usually am the confidante for others....I am so glad I came forward now. I won't continue with this thread because I'm sure many people have far worse problems but I can look forward and see which direction to go in. I'm a fairly strong person, so in the words of Gloria, I will survive!!!!!

To clarify a few points, the kids are none the wiser as I prefer to keep any disagreements we have quiet and (usually, not here) behind closed doors...no screaming, crying abdabs or anything. Buddha, when I do go through the menopause (hopefully 10 yrs from now) I promise to look you up, but hey, mid-life crises can occur at any time. Actually pondered the extra family theory myself, but realised she must be in a far worse situation than me as he hardly leaves the house except to work!!!! Never say never though! Time to use this computer for a bit of financial searching I think, although judging from an earlier posting I think he's trying to offload his shares asap (claims he has already). Thank you very much everyone...great work