Hi there
I am interested in getting advice from women - or men! - on how to meet women if you are a bit of a shy guy.
To be honest I am at the point of despair in this town - I have been here four years and I have been single four years. I am not particularly handsome or anything but I am not hideous - but I feel as if I am constantly ignored.
My self esteem is not helped by this and it is hard not to get gloomy. I have even tried online dating and it has been disastrous. I actually met someone this way a month ago and it was the same old story - I liked her and thought she was attractive and interesting but maybe I'm just too keen. We parted with her saying that we should do dinner sometime over Easter but of course when I called next week she was busy. And has been busy ever since!
I was foolish enough to meet her the first tine anyway after sending her a picture to which she immediately announced that she was seeing someone else but frienship would be good. And like an idiot I went along with this because I thought she might be genuine about that and loneliness gets to me sometimes. I got really depressed after meeting her and having to chase someone who has no time for me despite saying she does. Can't figure it out - I am of the school that if someone says we should do dinner then I think we should do dinner! I could feel the air go out of my tires again - I do wish people in HK actually occasionally meant what they say. But its such a shallow place as far as I can tell!
I read so much about players and relationship problems but I can't even get to square one. I just feel lost, unattractive and hopeless. The thing is you wouldn't neccessarily think that I would be in this situation but I am - I lack the confidence in myself to meet women. And life is slipping by - I know relationships aren't everything but my 30s has been spent entirely single and without any hope of that changing. And now summer is here and another holiday is here and I have no one to share it with! (And yes I do have friends but you know what I mean!)
It has gotten to the point where I want to leave HK simply because of this - I am tired of being invisible and I am tired of being shy. I am not shy in normal social situations but with women its different - I have no idea how to read them, I don't get games and I don't know where to meet women I would like. I don't want to go online ever ever again but I am not a bar-type guy.
Anyway, some insight would be greatly greatly appreciated. Ha ha this month of May was going to be my "Buddha" month where I accept everything serenely but that would appear to go against my nature.
But where I can meet people? How can I make myself attractive to women? Right now I feel like a total loser even though I know I'm not.
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ucp
18 yrs ago
How many times you tried? You can't leave HK because of that reason. How did you react when you go out with woman? If you are not handsome and you are unattractive, then you have to let the woman know you are a very nice guy, honest, and you can't start to meet a lady and want her to be your girlfriend immediately. Start friendship first. After few dates, you have to tell her you like/love her.
I met some guys from this website, they are not serious on friendship or long relationship. I don't want to waste time to have this kind of friends. Therefore, i didn't meet them again. Are you the same kind of person? People choose you, you can choose too.
Don't give up! Still have many chances.
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selda
18 yrs ago
Furrowed brow,
online dating is pretty unforgiving, even for men/women who look better than average.
It's all about first impressions, and a lot of it has to do with appearances.
I rememeber one guy i chose not to see again mainly because he came across as conceited, full of himself, and yes, he had a hideous baseball cap on. By pure chance I met him again at a party a few months later, and felt really stupid for not oing on a second date with him.
Gone was the hat, he was smartly dressed, and had a pretty good sense of humour, which i never suspected. I think he was too nervous to shine during our brief encounter, and ended up talking about himself in an annoying manner. At the party he really seemed in his element, and was a much more pleasant person. We never went out again,but now i am a bit more careful about ruling out a second date.
Maybe you need to address your insecurity first, because it can play bad tricks and make you less interesting than you are.
As to your looks, some women want a a handsome man, but a lot don't care much about looks, as long as they like your personality.
Handsome men are for flings, decent men are for keep.
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Well, Furrowed.
You sound like a nice, earnest chap. My practical recommendation to you is to get your close female friends who most resemble (in attitude, outlook and lifestyle) the kind of girl you most want to me meet and have them give you pointers from a female perspective. Ask them to be honest about anything that they feel you are doing wrong or need to improve upon. Even though your self-esteem may take beating, it is better for your friends to be mercilessly honest.
For the time being, I would avoid feedback from males-- they will usually steer you wrong in these early stages.
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Hi all
Thanks for your kind words - I was a bit emotional when I wrote my little spiel and I was probably a bit all over the place when I did so I apologize if it doesn't make sense in parts.
UCP and Flashback - you are both right. I do know I should meet someone I like and not just go out with anyone. That much is a given - I haven't become desperate in the way I act, the desperation has more to do with how I feel. And I don't really like myself very much these days. And online dating really is brutal - its far too much pressure. And I have seen a counsellor before - it might be time to see him again.
As for interests - oh yes I do have them. But for one of them - hiking - I tend to do either on my own or with a few friends.
I like being on my own and I like my own space but loneliness does get to me sometimes. My workplace is pretty solitary and although I have a terrific set of friends, I usually only see them on weekends. I actually really love my friends - the odd thing is that in Hong Kong I really rely on them and in fact they are the best friends I have ever had but the rest of the week can get lonely.
HK Blue - Yes, my confidence is shattered. I am naturally shy but I do know how to hide it. And I should be out there in real life but its hard because I am naturally wary. Actually - you probably wouldn't believe what it is I do for a living. I love it in fact and it is also a personal challenge because when I was 21/22 I thought I was going to be a loner all my life. But though my choice of profession has helped me I would still have gone further in it if I were more open. My body language is probably bad though, you are right. Its defensive - always has been. That's in general too - not just with women. I play all my attributes down, not just my looks. And no, objectively, my looks good, bad and the ugly aren't the problem anyway.
Selda - I have no idea what sort of impression I make at first. Probably not great I guess - and I suspect it is a lot about looks, which just makes me even more nervous. I am incredibly insecure though and very nervous with women. I wouldn't wear a baseball cap and I don't act conceited but I talk too much and far from conceited, its probably obvious from a mile away that I lack confidence. I hate the whole idea of first dates anyway - I suck at them and I rarely get a second. Also, I basically hate dating - in general I prefer informal settings and would ideally just see what happens - the whole idea of timetables seems mad to me.
Marigold - I am Mr Earnest personified. I am passionate, intense, full of ideas and energy. And 'nice' in the pejorative sense. Too nice maybe. I will ask my female friends - they know my foibles.
I've rambled on. Its late, I am still tired, still up and down. But I do appreciate all your words, it has been great getting some different perspectives.
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Peet
18 yrs ago
Hi Furrowed Brow,
I'm sorry that you've been having difficulties. I'd like to echo what others have said here. Like you, I also find it difficult to just be myself when there is "dating" pressure - whether it is meeting a woman in person or whether it is through on line dating. It seems that there is just too much anxiety in these situations. Instead(as someone suggested above), I prefer to meet women in a more relaxed setting, for example during a group activity with others who share a common interest. I've found that (for me anyway) this goes a long way toward taking off the pressure, as I'm there to enjoy time with others as opposed to "dating". Perhaps you can find such an activity in which you are interested and start there. Also, I find that I do much better when I have the chance to meet a woman over an extended period of time, say over several group outings. This allows us both to get to know one another in a more informal way. I also try not to approach each introduction as a potential future "girlfriend" and instead simply make developing friendships my aim. Again, it deflects the "dating" pressure, allows me to enjoy myself a little more, and allows us to get to know one another over time. If something develops from the friendship, that's great. If not, at least I've made a friend, and that's not so bad, right? As someone stated in an earlier reply, meeting a woman who is right for you is a bit of a numbers game (as cold as that sounds)...the more women you meet, the better your odds that you will meet a woman with whom you'll hit it off. As you increase your circle of friends (male or female), you will just naturally meet more people through them. Lastly, don't give up! There is definitely a woman (and most likely many women) out there who will appreciate you for who you are, not simply for the way you look. Looks might make a fleeting initial impression, but it's not the glue that holds a relationship together. This sounds like a bit of a cliche, but it really is who you are on the inside that makes a lasting impression. Best of luck in your search!
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I couldn't have agreed more with everyone who's posted their opinions along this thread that Furrow needs to learn to smile and appreciate more about what life has to offer other than women.
However, I couldn't help but to notice that the girl you dated actually honestly said that she's seeing somebody already but wouldn't mind a friendship. So my question to Furrow is - why did he attribute this lack of interest from the girl to his looks or personality instead of simply that "she's attached and she'd like to remain faithful to her other half"? Perhaps she felt your over keenness in your first meeting that put her off from seeing you again in case you thought that she's leading you on? Quite frankly, I'd think it's more to do with your existing self-esteem Furrow than the girl's taste/personality or whatever.
Sorry that this might sound harsh Furrow, but from reading other threads about gf cheating on bf, I honestly don't see a lot of problem with this girl but that you might have just put too much expectation into this meeting, and hence your disappointment is more about you than the girl.
And to end this response on a more constructive note Furrow, I hope you'll get peace of the mind from your friends, from whatever you enjoy doing and from yourself, rather than relying it on others to give it to you. And I'd agree with you that some counselling might help as well.
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Hi everyone - by and large I agree with what people are saying. It helps when I am more rational myself and look at things in the cold light of day. But its very hard to stop feeling a certain way - especially when you have issues.
It would be more beneficial for me to meet people outside the context of dating - I would be happier that way anyway.
And I do appreciate that there is more to life than having a girlfriend or that one can't be happy being single. But I think actual loneliness and isolation come into play - I am a long way from home (though this is not new!) and work isn't great right now either as I am treated like a child rather than as a colleague as I am the junior guy in the department.
I'll try and be positive about life in general, it does make a difference and I will use these words here as encouragement.
Seagull - you are right that my problems with that girl are more about me than her and I put far too many expectations into it - but I genuinely liked her company and I was pretty cool when I met her. It was all the games after which drove me up the wall and I'm old enough and smart enough to know when someone is playing games - I'm dumb male enough that I like people to just mean what they say and follow through because otherwise I climb up walls.
Also, in answer to your question about looks this girl was "single" when we started writing but then had managed to start "kind of seeing someone" after I sent her my picture. And yes, that brings up certain issues for me.
I hadn't started by chasing an already attached girl - even I'm not that dumb!
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Are you interested in multicultural relationships? Just wondered.
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Aijin - thanks for your postings. Issues are indeed banished for the weekend. I think flatness is a very apt description of my mental state right now - of course it will pass. I don't know if I will live it up but I will live, I will smile a bit and the brow shall remain unfurrowed!
Lambada - I have to admit I haven't the faintest clue as to precisely what you are talking about!Raincatcher is right - women from other cultures wouldn't cure my shyness unless they carry some unbeknownst elixir with them!
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Hi FB
I don't really have any great suggestions, but just wanted to send you hugs. You sound so lovely, kind and totally vulnerable at present. I hope this dark cloudy patch passes for you really soon, and that the rest of your time in HK is enjoyable. Self doubt issues are no fun, and it doesn't help them if one person (the friendship only gal) reinforces, probably mistakenly,your self esteem issues.
Wish you well!
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Guys and gals, thanks for all your help, kind words and thoughts, as well as suggestions - its good to have a bit of perspective and reflect on things. I think the thread has started to go off-topic anyway. Its not going to be easy and I still feel a bit lost from time to time, but that's okay. I had a nice quiet weekend and a bit of space tonight to let it just flow over. This is a tough city sometimes but I am lucky in most aspects of my life and I need to appreciate that. Time to get a bit of my spirit back...
Best wishes to all
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Yee Gods! Conspiracy theories. I was just thinking that it might be harder to have a relationship if the net was not cast across the whole sea as it were. My buddies and I have the opposite problem, we want to be G/F free to have peace of mind and some time to catch up with all that bonding stuff. Some would say he's a lucky man. Maybe we should take him under our wing? The truth is that nice guys are boring and bounders are fun. Be honest girlos. Which would you rather - bored or annoyed? Nobody wants to nail Mr Desperate and dateless. Learn to dance, Furrowed Brow, and you will never ever be lonely - might even meet someone nice. Turn the shyness into mysterious and alluring.
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I am generally a bit nervous about dating, but I am aware enough of my actions. I feel sorry for the guy if he was sweating - its hard not to sweat in Singapore much less HK! Even if you get there early.
I am not fool enough to behave in a scary way (unless of course I wanted to actually scare her off but I think even then my inner niceness or the fact that I have been brought up to be polite would take over!). I am not scared of spiders nor would I hold hands on a first date.
But point taken - I get the impression girls see through things all the time. I'd still like to meet someone but I am going to forget this dating thang for the time being and enjoy my life!
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Furrowed, you sound like a really lovely, level headed individual. That's all you have to portray when you are with women. Just be who you are with confidence! Personally speaking, confidence is a quality in a man that I find most attractive. (be careful not to confuse it with arrogance although!) Just like who you are and the rest will fall into place.
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Guys who are too shy may appear as a wimp...or even gay! I have a colleague who is now caught in a gay scandal! He does look gay I know he is not!
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yes...he needs to overcome his shyness
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but then again my colleague is probably gay...in disguised
Anyway a man who's too shy will always look wimpish. That's all the I want to say
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Sorry I guess I was a little too harsh. I have never implied that FB is gay ... Sorry!
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hamilton,
if a=b,b=c...then a=c.
most probably you mean to say he projects a gayish image to women!
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Yes! That's exactly what I was trying to say!
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"I do feel this is often a factor in inter-racial relationships (though not all of course)."
Why?
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Hi everyone - well this thread has taken an interesting turn after I thought it had died out. I've been away licking my wounds and taking a few things on board.
I've been making progress but today was very very tough - its kind of the way things work sometimes. But more on that later.
But first the gay thang.
I don't have a problem with gay people at all - to be very frank I went through a period of questioning my own sexuality in my early 20s and it took me a while to figure things out - and yes I prefer girls. I'm not bi, I'm not gay, I'm shy.
If I were gay I think I would still be shy. And I don't think that I act wimpy in general. Flashback is right about gay people anyway - many are outgoing and fun. And its hard to tell someone's orientation by the way they behave. I certainly don't act macho - its just not me. But again, that doesn't make me a wimp. And if anyone - male or female - thinks I'm gay then I couldn't give a monkey's.
Now, Flashback's point about shyness in men is interesting. I have always been shy - even since before adolescence. And from 13-19 was hell hell hell. I was constantly depressed and I still sometimes feel that way now.
I wasn't even just shy about women - I was shy period. Now, I have largely learned to conceal - I can conceal my anxiety in professional situations to the point where people don't realize I am shy - and sensitive. Shyness has held me back in life for sure.
I was so shy I didn't even - oh thank the Lord for the anonymity of the internet - have sex for the first time until I was 24!
I suppose I made up for that in the rest of my 20s but the relationships I had were pretty dysfunctional. In fact I was in a long-term relationship with a woman who specialized in putting me down. I am not claiming victimhood here but it took me a long time to get over that. My shyness reflects a lack of confidence in myself and a lack of belief.
I hate being rejected, that is true. I hate it even when I don't really like the person THAT much but when I do like the person it sucks up my soul and spits it out.
I kind of know what flashback is alluding to in terms of 'mail order' solutions etc but its not really a factor for me personally, but maybe fb can spell it out more clearly.
I have come a long way in so many ways but its just too much sometimes. I think I have a lot to give but people don't see that. And I think I am resolutely shy and devastated by rejection.
The reason I know so is because I felt it very acutely this afternoon. I was getting over the girl I alluded to way back in my equally rambling first post but I ran into her unexpectedly this afternoon. She knocked me out.
I had really liked her but since we met I have basically been ignored. No chance, nada. Okay, I have to accept that. But the hurt all came back - she's beautiful and smart and I have never ever had a chance in hell with women like that. Same old story. I went for a walk and found a hill that I could cry on - the whole thing just upsets me. And I know in my heart that I am a good man - I have spirit, I have soul, I have intelligence - I just have no confidence about anything. And I never have. I'm getting too old for this and I do feel not only that I will ever have a relationship, but that time is slipping by and I have not lived my life fully or wisely. I don't feel that I have done what I could with my life or made life better for anyone else. And I am still learning to love - myself, my family, my friends. That's all I have.
And in an odd way the only saving grace after seeing this girl walk by is that I was in a place in HK that means a great deal to me. Its my sanctuary, its my home, its the place where I have history. And on that place an old friend walked in with his wife and had dinner with me. It gave me enormous comfort because I was very upset. And I still am.
Apologies for the ramble - I just need to get some of this out even if it is incoherent. Apologies for any gaps in my narrative and/or logic.
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Hi Furrowed Brow
Your post was very moving, and again my heart went out to you.
Keep visiting your sacred place, I think you have that place for a reason.
You mentioned how you somehow smother your shyness in professional situations...is there a way that you could figure out how you smother them, and transfer those techniques into other areas of your life? I hope that doesn't sound lame or patronising, I just want to be supportive.
You apologised for being incoherent...au contraire, you are highly articulate, and perhaps that is another side of you that perhaps you could develop.
hugs to you
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maxis
17 yrs ago
I can relate to a fair bit of what you say about yourself FB, but too the same extent.
Enterring into a relationship is scary if you are sensitive as you know you could be rejected, which is very hurtful to sensitive and shy people.
Only fickle and insincere people get over relationships quickly.
I hope this doesn't sound mean, but it sounds like you have low social self confidence, rather than being shy per se.
When you date someone and at some point you think "yeah, she's great!" it is terrifying as frmo that point on you are exposed.
But if you never acknolwedge how you feel, then the relationship will never progress fully.
Difficult isn't it?
perhaps when you casually date, you have to not get too focussed on somone too soon, or it creeps them out and sets you up for heart ache.
That girl you refer to in your post may well not all that you think, and remember that. You know what she told or showed you in one date, and there could be many undesirable characteristics you wouldn't go near.
You really must do something about the low self esteem. A good woman will help keep you ego up but you need to be able to be confident without being propped up by someone stroking you cos when (if) she stops what have you got eh?
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Hey, thanks for all the posts everyone. I think the thing about the low self-esteem is a huge problem for me. And the depression. Even today I am absolutely and utterly off my head - my mind will not stop. I'm feeling slightly manic and unbelievably sad and angry and restless all at the same time. And its the sound of utter futility going on in my head.
Its interesting reading all these posts again - I try and critically assess my own behaviour. I don't think I am scary - I think what is scary is how I feel. When I feel upset I don't let people know - I go and hide. Right now I am at work and I feel absolutely abysmal - my heart and my mind is racing. I am not acting manic - in fact I am quite withdrawn - but I can feel it all inside.
I need help of some sort. I can talk to my friends but I don't want to burden them - there is an element of broken record and I talk about the same things without ever really elaborating or understanding the core of the issue.
And raincatcher, you may very well know me if you can spot my incorrect use of en dashes. That is spot on - I am fond of them and I do indeed use them far too often. Also, I use them incorrectly because I had it drummed in to me that I should use the en dash instead of the em dash at a previous employer. It is a bad habit I have kept.
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FB, that's an interesting thought. I didn't quite think of it that way - but maybe there's something to that.
And no, I don't sleep well. I have found it hard to sleep well for well over a year now. 8 hours is unimaginable for me - my average is maybe 6 and on many nights I only sleep 4 or 5 hours. You would think I would be sleepy during the day but I never nap.
I am very stressed right now - I can't quite calm myself and exercise helps but not that much.
And its just gone 1 now - but finally I am tired enough that I will drop off to sleep.
Everyone has given me kind words of advice and I thank you all for it. I think it is time to take some of it and put into action. And I don't want to monopolize the help section here because other people need advice too.
Take care - I'll try and contribute to some of the other threads in a postive way at some point.
FB
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Is capital letter FB English?
Anyway, having recently met someone with anxiety issues in the past and is getting a mild half pill medication per day, I would say that it helped him improve his life a great deal, in fact it turned his life around and he's enjoying life, has many friends and is always great around people. Not saying that you need to be medicated but if you're thinking of it, there is no stigma involved.
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Well, I think more regular sleeping patterns may be a start. I may have to establish more of a routine in general so as improve my self-discipline. Sometimes I have quite a loose relationship with time and I find it easy to sink into a morass.
I suppose I need routine. One of the best things about being gainfully employed is that much of my day is planned. I'm not sure if I need 8 hours of sleep a night but even if I managed 7 hours consistenly for a while it might make a spot of difference.
I do have frequent anxiety attacks and regular bouts of depression - they have progressively gotten worse. And I have had some counselling before, I found it very helpful.
When I said I was heartbroken, I meant it. I'll get over it, but the rejection just exacerbates a lot of my old habits. The self-loathing, the manic depression, the intense negativity. I have never had lots of confidence and though in some ways it improves the older I get, my patterns seem to get in the way.
I think a combination of counselling and changes to my lifestyle might be the way forward.
I do have gifts, so its time to use them.
I'll say something positive though for a change. I was brought up very Catholic and in a loving family, but one in which love is hard to express.
But here in Hong Kong I do have terrific friends whom I love dearly. Just last August when I got back from a trip I told two of them that I realized that the bunch I hang out with now are the first truly adult friends I have ever had. So while I am useless at coupling and dating and all that, I have never thought of love as primarily romantic. Oh I still want that dearly and I would like to feel less lonely sometimes, but at least it is not the only thing I want.
And all that business about self-love? I still find that very very hard. So maybe one step at a time then. Softly softly.
But the thing about my friends is that though I am still somewhat aloof and withdrawn is that I do get to express my warm and slighty more tactile side. I smile more often, I hug more often, I get to feel part of the gang. And for a somewhat shy fellow like me, being part of a gang can be great fun.
All this kissing on cheeks business still makes me nervous however! Can't we just shake hands?
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Hi,
I didn't read all the posts as there are too many. Good for you I guess, a lot of suggestions/ideas.
From what I understand, you are shy. I'm definitely not a shy person, but I find online dating to be more difficult than real life situations.
And if you are too shy meeting people, you probably don't have women's number to invite for hiking or other nice activities that were suggested.
First you should go to that private party you were invited.
Secondly, I think you could try to work your confidence out by just understanding that's it's OK to be rejected by a women, which I assume is your fear. In fact, you WILL get rejected by women, case close.
Being funny is good. Really good. The best way in fact. Makeup silly stories, she'll know its a joke and go along with it. Then you actually play together talking this instead of "the weather is nice". I was expat in Paris before, I would say my actual job was being a fisherman, that I studied in "fishery". They all laughed. Then I was sad: "my father was a fisherman, my mother was a fisherman, my grandfather.. please don't laugh, it's serious". This starts a nice long conversation and you get to know her. Have fun just talking to her, I would say you should not talk to her for more than that (you just have some fun right now, right there). It removes a lot of pressure also with that set of mind.
A personal trick: when I'm shy I just say it. I say whatever is on my mind. One situation for instance, I really felt a lot of pressure (for sex) and was really anxious going to bed. I told her: not sure I'll be able to... The pressure was suddenly all gone. I think you understand my point..
I think this mint even make your shyness cute to her!
good luck
bye
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Well FB how are you going?The thread was gone and now it's back.The magic of ED.Lots of good advice here hope your life gets back on track and you are making progress.Hang in there.Life throws many loopy things out at people what your reaction is to those is the outcome.
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Well, I go up and down like a manic loon sometimes. I was very DOWN yesterday. If I fronted my own Emo band I would be looking gloomily over Hong Kong Harbour (in my imaginary fantasy album cover)in a big gloomy winter's coat. And the record would be called "Great big dollops of sadness in an ocean of tears" or some such. Today I am feeling a bit more electro clash and bold as brass. But the truth is somewhere in between - I feel angry, sad, slight used. But also philosophical and rational and appreciative of what I do have instead of what I don't. And that is a start. I am grieving though - though I am not sure about what. What I am not doing though is sleeping - and that doesn't help matters.
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hi furrowed brow. sometimes when you think too much about something, it grows bigger and bigger till it consumes your every thought. i believe that, if we really wanted to, we can stop dwelling about something and channel our focus and minds on other things. you said that you want to start a thread on something more positive and i think you should. stop contributing to this thread as you are allowing this problem grow into a bigger monster than it should. there are a lot of people in this world who do not have time to ponder about their insecurities. To them, life could be as simple as having enough to eat everyday. so if you put your problem in perspective, it really doesn't seem like a big deal and that your life is very blessed. some guys may have a phone book full of girls to call but what is that if he doesn't have one true friend? you said that you have made some really great friends and i think that is precious and hard to come by. if you HAVE to reply to this entry (i can see how it's very addictive), then make a conscious effort to say only positive things, and do not allow that problem to take over. cheers.
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1)find a disco 2)load your pocket with enough cash or get a gold/silver card 3)tacket on the lady of your taste may sure she has no bodyguide 4)seat/stand next to her 5)buy her the same drink that she is having when you see it's finishing.
Most girls who get the treat will start off a conversation with you first. If not, it just mean that u r not her type. Change your target.
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hi Furrowed. Didn't have time to read all the posts but a guy that has self esteem issues is the antithesis of the many other posts complaining about playboys that are hoovering up the women some of these shy guys could be getting. The post that struck me in particular was the one about you losing out on the beautiful, smart...woman of your dreams and feeling devastated that you weren't good enough. That's probably happened to most guys at some point so you might take heart in that fact. But there's nothing guaranteed to make you stumble more than to remind yourself how beautiful, gorgeous and desirable she is, bc all it does is remind you how unworthy you feel you are. You'll never make it. First thing you have to do is get that out of your mind. Second thing is to take it easy, you're there to get to know each other, not win her over on the first outing. Otherwise it's pressure, pressure... if you can't dazzle her with you repartee at least focus on her, and have a decent chat. Better to leave something of an impression, however innocuous, and the chance of a second date than try too much and slam the door on the first, right? Keep thinking you want to be friends. She might have had enough experiences with beefcakes that didn't work out and want to give Shy guy a try. Have to say though, you seem focused on this 'beautiful, amazing woman...' idea. If that's all you're going for, you might have to mix it up a little. Good looking girls do tend to seek out good looking guys so you can't be too unrealistic. Besides if you want girls be understanding, you have to be flexible as well.
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Hi Squid
Oh, I am the antithesis all right. Sometimes I feel like the AntiChrist, the AntiCapitalist and my AntiRose all rolled up in one. The points you made and several others made are all good - all very sound. And plainly rational.
I understand all this in my more rational moments, but the problem is I am often not very rational in the slightest. Slightly touched you might say - and made worse by the fact I keep it inside. I need an outlet for the madness.
I am not fixated on beautiful, amazing women in general though. Its too much effort, they cause too much stress, and they clealy think themselves well above me. Obviously they fail to recognize my inherent genius - which I can understand as I have a boring corporate job. Little do they know I am actually a perfomance artist masquerading as a boring office worker to expose the absurdity of it all!
I do, admit, however, I was fixated on one particular woman. That is not a usual habit of mine either - its something I generally try and avoid. It hurt, it still hurts, but its also over over over. Like Marshal Zhukov I have drawn my line in the snow and am ready to stop retreating and launch a lively counteroffensive.
But the problem is still self-esteem, depression, other troubles that have mounted up. I need to sort those things first before I meet any more women - ever. I'm tired of it.
I will start living again though - thus Marshal Zhukov. And frankly, forming my little own Red Army and marching from Stalingrad to Berlin sounds a lot more realistic than meeting people. Maybe I need to be able to handle rejection - but no more for now thanks!
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