Posted by
mioq
16 yrs ago
Hi All,
I'll be relocating to HK in the next few months. I'll be paid in British Pounds currently only at 1000 pcm after tax. Do you think it's possible for me to survive in HK? I understand that the cost of living should be higher in the UK but I think given that I dont know anyone in HK, I won't be able to share flat..and hence the bills may come up quite high. I did some research on the website; rent in HK is ard $8-10K...seems quite expensive to me or am i looking at the wrong site? And can any kind souls out there let me know how much do i need to save aside each mth on daily neccessities i.e. food, transportation etc. Definitely doesnt include shopping!
And also does any1 know if I still need to pay UK income tax if I'll be stationed out of UK for the rest of the year.
Many Thanks in Advance!
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£1000/m is not a lot for HK, but it all depends on the lifestyle you want.
Food and such aren't necessarily more expensive than the UK. It all depends on quality and source. Transportation is cheaper.
"did some research on the website; rent in HK is ard $8-10K...seems quite expensive to me or am i looking at the wrong site?"
That would be rent for a small studio in "downtown". Yes, rent is very high in HK compared to the UK. You can definitely find cheaper, but it would be in less attractive locations and buildings.
"And also does any1 know if I still need to pay UK income tax if I'll be stationed out of UK for the rest of the year. "
I'm not an expert but as far as I know you would not need to pay UK income tax on income earned in HK if you are outside the UK more than 6 months of the year. You would pay HK income tax, 16%.
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"1000 pounds is NOT going to be enough... the rent is generally minimum of $6-10k. you are NOT reading it wrong. you are moving to one of the most expensive cities in the world. you will want to re-think accepting the offer!"
I didn't want to say it so blatantly but cara is right. Forget HK if you have less than £3000/m after tax. Do calculate with the lower tax in HK.
Of course it is possible to live on less, but I don't think it would be a fun life.
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i think he meant rent AND furnishings/appliances as needed (he did say 'to kit out')...still way on the high side, i'd have to agree. as you say cara, 11k will not be enough to sustain an enjoyable life here...
now wait for the usual "locals live on much less than that" responses...
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you can not survive in London on that money unless you are living with your parents - so no way you can survive in HK, which indeed is more expensive than London. Have another think about why you want to move? I really wouldnt if it did not make financial sense.. HK is nice, but so is London.
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"mioq - may I ask what you do for a living? It seems weird that a company would want to sponsor your move here, but feel you are only worth 1000 quid a month!"
I was asking myself that exact same question.
"for example a large bed with a good matress can set you back over 1k (not HKD)."
It can't possibly be a good bed and mattress for that price. Only really crappy mattresses (yes I have tried some in HK at a store with only Chinese staff) go for 1k.
A decent bed will set you back 8-9k at the very least. Your back will thank you.
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Oops. Quite right rezaul.karim. I misread. Apologies.
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I think that many posters perhaps over state how bad the lifestyle would be on HK$ 11K.
I understand the sentiment. Personally I would not want to live in Hong Kong for anything less than 5K US. Lifestyles I feel are better elsewhere.
But you could quite easily get a single room with a bed and television on Hong Kong Island (not a great one I admit) eat well. Hong Kong does cheap good food from virtually every country better than any place on the planet. And though it would be tough you could still put away a bit.
I have to admit I would not want the lifestyle, but I do not think you could do the same in London. It depends on what you view as acceptable, and generally coming from the UK, the kind of life I am talking about is not what most people would find acceptable.
Having said that, other than eating at an expensive restaurant occasionally, when it comes to food, I would not eat much different to what I am saying is cheap here. I grew up here, and have no compunction about eating street food or at dives, that's what we did as kids, and the food tastes great is cheap and good value for money.
Try spending the same money in London on food and you would starve.
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The minimum that your company will need to pay you in order to secure a work visa is in the region of HK$15 - 20,000. So I would start with asking them on what basis it is they are going to get you to HK to work legally.
You would be better off if they can pay you in HK$ or US$, as the way the sterling exchange rate is at the moment you could end up living on nothing!
Your costs are dependent on where you work and where you live.
If you live and work in Central - its not enough
If you live and work in the New Territories you can get by, but it depends on what sort of existence you lead. Utilities are cheaper than UK but of course are based on consumption.
Transport is less than in UK. Food, other than meat is generally cheaper if you shop in the markets and supermarket chains and not in the 'designer' supermarkets.
Drinking in bars is more expensive.
Not sure what you like to do recreationally, but the free options are hiking, going to the beach or window shopping.
UK tax is only payable on UK earnings, if you leave part way through the year you will be assessed on what you earned to that point and as you did PAYE you may be in for a refund. You will be taxed on your HK earnings in HK about 18 months after you arrive and this is not deducted from your salary, so if comes as a mightly blow the first time as you have to pay for the year completed and advance tax for the year ahead. If you leave part way through you can get a rebate/refund of any advance tax not due.
You will also be required to make a contribution to an MPF scheme (pension scheme) which your employer will deduct from your salary - so your GBP 1000 will be less 5% to start with.
Hope this helps
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mioq
16 yrs ago
Many Thanks to all that replied to this thread!
>>I’m still quite confused with the tax part. I’ve forgotten to mention in my initial thread that I am not a resident in the UK; I'm holding a graduate working visa here. So I am essentially a foreigner (I’m an American to be precise) working in the UK. The only thing that changed after my relocation is that I will be working in the HK branch office. The UK office will bear my salary expenses while the HK office will be responsible to secure my HK working permit. I am not sure if the minimum salary requirement (HK$15-20K) for a visa in HK applies to me and also I’m still unclear on how or to whom (country-wise) I should be paying by tax to. Does anyone has any idea on this or have been in my situation before?
My rental expense in the UK takes up about 50% of my salary (I shared a flat with few of my friends) and I usually used up the other 50% on transportation (it’s expensive over here), food ( I normally avoid eating out so it helps to cut down a lot – but I don’t think it’s a usual for ppl to eat-in in HK office so I probably wouldn’t do that) and entertainment (go out for drinks once a month etc). Having said all these, one would probably realise that I lead a very simple lifestyle and less of those lavish kinds.
For the salary wise, I’m not expecting the company to pay me a hefty cheque (given the current economic conditions) and so I only want to earn a reasonable amount of money for me to survive in HK in acceptable living condition. But to spend HK$8000+ on accommodation is about 2X that of what I am spending in the UK. I will be working in Central so will be looking for flats near that area and also given that I’m not familiar with HK at all, I wouldn’t want to live that far from my office. That will leave me with just HK$2500+, will this be enough for me to survive in HK?
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Agreed with cara. You are INSANE to come over here with that salary. Economic conditions notwithstanding, any employer who offers those terms is either completely clueless or has an amazing pokerface.
"’m still quite confused with the tax part. I’ve forgotten to mention in my initial thread that I am not a resident in the UK; I'm holding a graduate working visa here. So I am essentially a foreigner (I’m an American to be precise) working in the UK."
Being an American is unfortunately terrible for tax purposes. The US has global taxation, meaning that once you've paid your local (HK in this case) tax, you have to pay federal income tax up to the level you would owe in the US.
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mioq
16 yrs ago
thanks all =) Really appreciate the advices from you guys! I'll certainly re-consider the HK deal now. And hopefully I can sort something out by the end of March or early Apr!
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What about health insurance?
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Goo
16 yrs ago
Americans are technically responsible for US taxes no matter where they live in the world but there's an exemption on the first USD 80,000 in income so I think mioq will be ok. You do still have to file a return though, you just won't owe any money. If you don't file the return, you can have problems later on if you need the government for anything (financial aid, getting a non-American spouse a green card).
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If you are earning 1000 GBP, are you an intern/apprentice/trainee? If so, you can reasonably ask the employer to provide housing in HK (you are after all a young employee posted to some place of a completely different culture). If you can get housing, you can survive on 1000 GBP (11,000 HKD) a month.
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I wonder what is in this for the OP? Work experience? Life experience?
I came to HKG to make money, and AFAIK that is the main motivator for most expats.
What is the point of an expat being in Hong Kong barely able to survive financially?
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your thought applies to his current situation too: An American on 1000 GBP in London?? Can't imagine that unless it's a training program.
mioq - just for your reference, Swire group graduate trainees are paid 30K GBP.
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I should append my above posts with this: if you are working for a charity or NGO, then they may have staff housing for a proportion of the salary, e.g. 30%, so housing is subsidised. If you do have to pay UK taxes, you will have about 860 GBP post tax (pay is too low for HK tax, if not it will be nominal). As you'd gather by now, housing will be your biggest headache and cost in HK. If you can have about HK$5000 after housing costs, then I think a single person can survive on that with just bare necessities.
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mioq
16 yrs ago
Yes, I am currently an intern working for a consulting firm (commodities related). There might be some delays in my plan..will be going to HK in June instead. In the meanwhile, I'll be sitting down to have a good chat with my boss over the salary package for the next few weeks.
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If you cannot get an appropriate package, well above that which you have been offered, I would say that you are working for the wrong firm. They are cheapskates, exploiting you.
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I won't say that the firm is exploiting him - rarely do firms send interns half way across the world. I think the firm is training him up for bigger things later. But it does sound disorganized.
mioq - I'd say to your boss that you have found out how expensive housing in HK is, and can the firm provide or subsidize housing? (just keep in mind that you need 5000 HKD post tax, post housing to survive, and do your math from there.) Good luck!
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Ed
16 yrs ago
Shall we shift this to the new Work forum
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$11k a month is more than many local families live on in Hong Kong for an entire household (though admittedly often they would be in public housing).
Firstly, at that salary you would pay zero or maybe about 1% income tax, not 16% like people say above as your personal allowance is $108000 per annum or so (dont know about US tax but surely also below threshold?).
You can rent 300 sq ft place in Western district or Lamma for $4000 or so. That leaves you about $200 a day to live on. Sure you can get by easier than somewhere like London as transport and local food cheaper. However one round of drinks in a Western bar or a Western meal will cost more than your entire daily budget. So it depends hugely how you intend to live.
Anyway 1000 GBP was over 15000 HKD until quite recently but 11000 HKD is a big difference. So you should be able to argue that point with your employer and push your salary to 16000 or 17000 HKD, which will make a big difference - then the answer is yes you can live fine on that compared to the same amount in London (but won't be able to save).
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I would sincerely urge you to reconsider, re-negotiate and compare what your lifestyle/work opportunities etc in the UK before moving to HK. Given that you will be working in Central, and would like to live in Central if possible, with HKD2,500 (net housing), my personal view is that you will be pretty miserable. You can survive, but do you really just want to survive? HK is a great city to live in, and just as any one of us who is new in any city, it can also be very lonely, if we cannot afford to hang out with colleagues, get to know new friends, but need to go home to a tiny hole and eat bread/instant noodles because of financial constraint. I am exaggerating, but with HKD2,500 you will find that it is pretty much that kind of lifestyle in HK. I am not sure it is worth it .... my humble opinion. Unless you can find a cheap housing deal.
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mdap
16 yrs ago
$2,500 to live on in HK .... YOU WILL DIE! You will be sharing lunch with the amahs on Sunday! Oh and remember you need to pay US tax as you're an american .... you can check out the flat share on asiaxpat ... but seriously for a monthly salary that leaves you $2,500 - it is just not worth the trouble to live in HK .... hell that's dinner for two at Caprice !
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Mioq-
Please disregard the negative comments on your thread and don't be put off coming here based on the snobbery they represent.
I came to HK 10 years ago and started exactly on that salary- 12k HK$ per month. I shared a flat for 8k between my best mate and me and spent the rest of booze. We lived in a cool place over looking LKF (drinking district) and had the best time of my life. Cans of beer in supermarket are 30pence!
The social life is great, the women lovely and the life style if far far better here then London on that salary. Of course you can spend huge amounts here very easily, but you can certainly live cheaply and decently if you want. You should jump at the chance of moving to Asia and not worry about the $. If when you get here, you like it, you can start to look for other jobs. Things move very fast and being here is the best way to get the opportunities.
It is true, that there is a big segment of "expats" who are only here to try and make as much cash as possible and leave to go back home. There is also a bigger segment, which are more open minded and take Asia as their home and enjoy it for the experience.
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cd
16 yrs ago
Cheesypeasplease, you came to HK on that wage 10 years ago, prices have gone up a lot since then. Yes the poster could live on that, but his quality of life wouldn't be good.
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Can't imagine living in HK on that amount or why you would want to. cheesypeasplease not everyones life revolves around beer and LKF.
Hk can be a fun place but you will be a long way from home with very little money, the city is crowded, polluted and very expensive and may not seem so attractive if your living like a student and unable to go to bars or restaurants but sat in your shared apartemnt drinking cheap tins of beer.
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jamil
16 yrs ago
Well the flat if you rent in NT its very cheap and very nice. Currently i am paying 1900 for my 400sqft in Yeun Long. Its a bit far from the city but I have abicycle so only take about 10 minutes by MTR and the flat that are nea rthe MTR very good conditions you can rent a 2 bedrooms flat for around 4k.
I am making only 9k a month and living quite a decent life. 1K would be just fine for you man.
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Im on 15K HK per month and I'm paying 2mortgages, 1 remortgage and golfclub membership. Its very do-able. I don't go out and eat expensive food every night, nor do I go out and drink my nights away all the time, but just do those things on occassion now. You don't have to shop in the expensive supermarkets all the time, you can cook at home relatively cheap, and as said eat out probably cheaper.
Either way 1K stirling is going to be a little tight if you want to live the lavish life for a year - paying rent of about 4-5K HK per month on kowloon side is easy to find, wont be the peninsula but will be quite comfy, and to be honest not far fromanything as nothing really is. that leaves 2K for bills which is very much fine. smaller places will not use that much in bills. that leaves 3K for you. Its do-able but will be tight. just make the right choices. but still should ask thm to double that. 20K HK and you'd be just fine.
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I suggest you look in the SHARE FLAT section of property on asiaxpat to guage the cost of accomodation "budget style", the Pound is also going to nosedive in the near future (mark my words) so negotiate your salary in HK$ as it is US$ pegged (also likely to nosedive in the near future), however at least your buying power is not diminished if the Pound goes nipples up first. I believe your income will be below the US tax threshold. Go for a minimum of HK$ 15K, which was the value of 1K Sterling not so long ago.
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It is really very simple. To answer your question, if you are single (no kids to support) yes you could live here on that salary, certainly. Obviously it would be a fairly modest existance. Some people here by the sounds of it, are fairly out of touch and have forgotten what it is like to live on an "average" salary. Having grown up here and all my friends living in London and then moving back here we are all in agreement that the quality of life is far higher here on a low salary then in the UK.
Rents in Lantau for a one bedroom start around 2.5k HK$. Lantau is not crowded, and means you talk a 30 minute commute in conditions much nicer then any tube ride. Good luck.
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ODS
16 yrs ago
I think if you are young expat moving to HK, minimum need 20K HKD a month. Young means you are good at what u are doing (that's why your company sent u here ) but still need to learn a lot and gain experiences (that part is to sacrifices the 'good paid').
Locals mostly earn around 9-14K after university, if they are lucky, some work for a few years can make 17,18K. But most locals lives in their parents house (which are usually tiny boxes), all they need is to pay their parents may be 3-5K for the house.
Some locals moved away from parents, but what apartment that they rent are some really old Chinese building (small dirty no lift cockroach), cost around 3-7K.
Being an expat... you have no parent's house to stay, some young expats I know share house with a few room mate, but if you are not willing to do it, you may spend a big part of your salary for the house.
Local food is cheaper and in fact, isn't bad, but if you never live in Asia you would probably get sick eating it everyday. Western food is more expensive as they import from others countries and have a lot more quality check before selling. But mind you even local food is cheaper, not THAT cheap anymore. recently everything just get ridiculously expensive everywhere.
So if you have no wife and child yet ... 20K is minimum that you can spend for living and save a little. I seldom heard expat make less than 25K though. If your company offer you less than that ... look for another job...
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mioq
16 yrs ago
Many Thanks to all that replied to this thread. I'll be moving to HK to work in June..salary-wise: my boss is offering me HKD 28K.(will not be an intern once i get there... will instead be a proper consultant) I guess my financial concerns are quite sorted. Once again, i'm really grateful for all the replies I received from you guys.Let's hope everything will go well for me in HK!
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